Aibu to think that sueing the church over gay marriage is not acceptable?

[Orlux]

Here:

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2383686/Millionaire-gay-fathers-sue-Church-England-allowing-married-church.html

I supported the right of gay couples to have same rights as heterosexual ones, but I feel this is going to far. Plus my religious friends (I'm agnostic) are now having a go at my naivety.

Maybe she/he NC Soupdragon?

Which would just make them a "goady fucker" or a coward who doesn't want their beliefs on this subject attached to their "real" posting name. Amongst other options like journalist fishing for comments.

Either way, that's the debate over for me.

'the first time I enquired I was young, and I did go to church but didn't live in that parish (the area my parents lived) any more.
Second time around I didn't want to get married in church but I also knew the rules of the church'

So a gay couple who do live in the parish and do go to church and do want to get married there are in a completely different situation to you then? So your experience isn't really relevant.....

'my gut doesn't like it, it doesn't quite know exactly why it doesn't like it yet, but it does.'

Is there any chance your gut could be God? They share some very similar views?!

'Outrage - do you want to get married in a church? Are you religious? Do you go to church?'

No.
No.
No.

Oh for heaven's sake, OutragedFromLeeds, the Christian church believes that marriage is between a man and a woman.

End of story; they're not denying anybody's legal rights by doing this, gay people can still get married in the eyes of the law. If any government appointed official like a registrar in a register office refused to marry a gay couple, I'd think they should be disciplined.

Let them ( the C of E) hold that view; let anybody hold whatever view they wish, if people don't like it, just don't go to church.

Orlux

I reckon gay marriage is alright.

I also believe that I am a member of the Church. Am I incorrect in that belief?

No-one is forcing the church to marry anyone. The couple are bringing a test case. If the law is written correctly they won't win.

Talk of totalitarianism is therefore slightly premature.

And your opinions about 'denying children parents of different genders' aren't shared by everyone - either here, or in fact in the Church. Personally I find them abhorrent.

Outrage - they were the rules that applied to me. Therefore they were the ones that were relevant to me. That is why I mentioned them. I did get married in a church actually, a Unitarian one that covered all faiths.
Are you religious? Are you attending church? Do you want to get married in church?
I'm guessing you're not because of the venom spewed by you about 'its my belief/Baby Jesus told me'
The church is built on following the Bible and based on faith and belief. It is for those who live their lives according to the bible and believe in it.
It is based on it's rules and framework and those attending abide by them or go elsewhere. Just like a hospital, hotel whatever...
Anyway I am leaving this discussion, I've go things to do with my day.
Have fun!

ToadintheHole,

Well I say this with respect but I don't believe in god so I can't really comment on what god thinks on this issue.

If your church and its members takes some kind of a vote and decides that your church wants to marry gay people, up to you. I mean this in a non-offensive way but I don't really care.

What I am against is the forcing of the church to do this.

Ok... So the marriage ceremony in a church is a religious one, the religion does not agree with homosexuality so a) why would they want to get married there and b) how are they promising to live their married life according to that religion when that religion is opposed to their lifestyle...?! Confused!!!

The church won't be forced in this case because the law is too clear. What it will do, however, is perhaps make the church leadership think again. No harm in that, in my view.

Outraged, I completely agree with you.

For those that think this is okay, would it be okay if churches refused to marry mixed race couple? This is discrimination too and is no different. The national church of the country is meant to be there for everybody, not to exclude a large segment of society.

If course it wouldn't be OK. It would be utterly absurd, but it's hardly a meaningful comparison.

These two couldn't give a stuff about getting married in church. They just want to be the first to do it, or gain a heap of publicity in their attempts to do so. They are absolute attention-whores.

Duh. This was always going to happen. They're doing it to make a point. They aren't upset or traumatised in any way. But they're going to make damn sure they upset and traumatise a lot of other people.

Mammagaga

the religion does not agree with homosexuality

That's a pretty ignorant statement.

All religions are open to interpretation, there is no consensus within any religion that homosexuality is wrong - some followers of Christianity believe that homosexuality is an abomination, others believe those passages to be nothing more than ignorance we've outgrown, along with stoning adultery and divorce being prohibited.

There are also LGBT Christians, so it's perfectly obvious why they'd want their wedding ceremony to be a religious one.

I absolutely support their right to get married.but I equally support the right of a religious establishment to say "not here".

Would they sue a Mosque for the right to eat a bacon sandwich on the premises? No they wouldn't.....madness.

Not sure what their point is actually.

Two guys/women marrying in a church would be ridiculous as it is clear that the Christian version of marriage is against that.

You mean the Christian version of marriage that once forbid divorce? Do you think two divorced people getting remarried in a CoE ceremony is ridiculous too?

But they're going to make damn sure they upset and traumatise a lot of other people.

It is pretty traumatizing to have your bigotry highlighted for the world to see.

Orlox,

I hardly think it's for you to say what Christian belief ought to be, given that you have just professed ignorance on the subject.

because eating a bacon sandwich and getting married is the same....

They can be homosexual Christians, but I fail to see how they can be Christian if they don't grasp the fundamental Christian view that marriage is between a man and a woman.

That's like me saying I believe in football but think that goalposts are silly.

Anyway, this has now tipped from being 'fair' and just i.e. civil marriage into something else entirely and it seems that the right-wing swivel-eyed loons had a point after all.

Orlux

Because it's not a fundamental Christian view to some Christians.

I would like to see it left up to the individual priests to determine if they are comfortable performing the ceremony. I don't necessarily agree with forcing anyone to perform a ceremony which is against their personal religious beliefs.