Is there ANY proven correlation between school uniform and performance?

[Hullygully]

Any data (either way) anywhere?

[CheesyPoofs]

School uniform is more about the school's image than attempts to improve performance IMO.

Although I agree it might improve behaviour - but 6th formers are not generally a badly behaved bunch are they?

[daftdame]

It is an interesting pint that students should appear business like. In the work world this is more complex..dress code in a creative environment can be dramatically different from the law courts for example.

What kind of work world do schools wish to emulate?

[daftdame]

point not pint!

[TheYamiOfYawn]

I hate uniforms. DD's school made uniforms compulsory thus academic year, and it is a pain. White shirts and red jumpers mean that I can't shove the kids' clothes in the washing machine at the end of the week but have to do 3 separate loads. I have to buy clothes for different weather conditions in 2 sets, one for school and one for weekends and holidays. My daughter has stopped taking pleasure in choosing her clothes in the morning and now has to be dragged into her clothes, and she as she has stopped expressing herself through colour and shape of clothes she has started giving herself impractical hairstyles at playtime and yearning for fashionable, uncomfortable shoes. The uniform sweatshirt label says "handwash only". I have to check the weather forecast every morning as my usual layering tactic doesn't work. The trousers are horrible and the tights get inflatable after a while. Polo shirts and cardigans look really scruffy if I don't iron them (and I rarely do).

[Bonsoir]

"Business attire" in a school uniform context makes them all look like call-centre workers. Or perhaps car rental workers.

[tinierclanger]

I think the point about when uniform gets scruffy or damaged, that children from poorer backgrounds will have to carry on wearing it is a really important one. I'm not a fan of uniform but have sort of reluctantly accepted the "leveller" argument in the past but that really gives the lie to it.

Sorry, I know that's not what you were raising though Hully. I also find it really irritating when these sorts of policies aren't evidence-based and I agree if a school wants to introduce uniform they should have some firm evidence to back up the reasons

[daftdame]

If you there is very rigid uniform at what point to children learn to make good decisions about appropriate clothing?

[seeker]

It's one of those things parents use to judge schools without actually having to think at all. Like primary school homework.

It's very useful on school trips, though. And it was useful to me this morning when I rang a particular school to tell them that about 10 of theirs were walking down the central reservation of a dual carriageway........

[Bonsoir]

I love homework! DD loves homework! It's the holidays and she is very happily doing her holiday homework...

[DewDr0p]

While the Sutton Trust found no robust evidence that uniform improves performance, it also says that TAs make little or no difference as well. And I can tell you that at the school where am I am governor, the carefully recruited, well skilled, intelligently deployed TAs make a huge difference. So personally I take all of this with a pinch of salt.

My Mum (retired primary deputy) would tell you that introducing uniform was a key part of the senior management's strategy in turning the sink school into an over-subscribed primary with fab results. It was all about behaviour and sense of belonging and readiness to learn. But last time I mentioned that on mn I got shot down in flames cause it's not the view of Sutton.

[daftdame]

I think a uniform can often be easier up to about 6th form. From this age students should be trusted to start to make there own choices, as they could be away at university or in the world of work after the course.

A very rigid and unforgiving policy (such as only one supplier) however is counter-productive.

[flatpackhamster]

daftdame
If you there is very rigid uniform at what point to children learn to make good decisions about appropriate clothing?

If only there was, maybe, some way for them to view other clothes, or try them on outside school. If it was popular we could probably build an industry out of it.

[seeker]

I don't think that uniform per se has any magical powers. But if uniform is introduced as part of a lot of other measures to turn round a failing school, it is one of the most visible so the most commented on. Having a school where people care about you, pay attention to you and focuses on achievement is what makes a difference. Uniform is just cosmetic.

[daftdame]

flatpackhamster Well I never would have thought of that ! You don't want to limit opportunity or industry though!

[IShallWearMidnight]

our school had a new deputy head who wanted to move the 6th formers into business suits (rather than their existing "uniform" of jeans and hoodies), against the views of both the students and the 6th form heads.

He left and went to work for OFSTED. Not that I'm linking his views on uniform and his choice of job at all .

[Beechview]

I agree Seeker. I watched a documentary about a failing secondary school in Hackney.
The school became really strict on school uniform and the children had to adhere to some very strict dress rules. I think the school saw it as a measure to generally improve discipline.
That was only one of the measures but the school improved vastly.

[SoupDragon]

I always feel sorry for the children who need to wear their own clothes in order to be an individual.

[daftdame]

Beechview I didn't see that documentary but please assure me they just didn't become really downtrodden...

[seeker]

"I always feel sorry for the children who need to wear their own clothes in order to be an individual."

[mummytime]

Parents usually like it, students often do too (my DD campaigned for Blazers at her Primary school, she didn't get them but she liked the useful pockets).
I think schools which are strict on any Uniform rules they have (at secondary level) tend to have better behaviour. But I think that is just, if you have a rule then enforce it taking effect.
I think there are some great schools with no Uniform.

However for a failing school introducing a new Uniform can be a very visual signal that the regime has changed. Of course without other real changes, nothing will really change.

[SoupDragon]

I dread to think how "individual" DS2 and DD would be if they wore their own clothes all the time. Thank goodness it is stifled for 5 days of the week.

[RooneyMara]

TinierClanger, I am really glad that you agree with this point.

Thankfully, and mercifully ds1 doesn't yet car if his clothes are scruffy, which they are - despite best efforts at washing, with vanish et al, his shirts are no longer white and have stains on them that will not come off. Many have holes in them because he is a boy, (though could equally be a girl) and likes to play rough-ish games at break.
These shirts are not ancient. I bought them new last autumn.
So he keeps wearing them - I don't have time or hands free to stitch the holes, as I have a baby who won't be put down most of the day.
He wears them with the stains and holes, though they have been washed so are technically 'clean'.
He doesn't currently care.
But I can tell that people judge him, and us, on his appearance and he often looks shocking.
in contrast at the weekend he looks great. I'd never dress him in white if I had the choice - so his home clothes are colourful, they hide any stains, they wash well. They are tough and they are comfortable. They are in short suitable for children.

Uniforms are generally the least suitable clothing for children that anyone can imagine. I think that's the point of it.

[Dahlialover]

There is probably a correlation between school uniform and outcome.

But no proof of cause and effect. It is probably because people who like their children to go to a school with uniform like their children to do well.

[daftdame]

Some times people are just such individuals a uniform doesn't really stay looking like one.

I remember reading Joanna Lumley's auto biography where her and her friend used to get old uniform out of lost property to wear, to see who could get away with looking the scruffiest! Thus they found a new way to rebel. I think, as I remember, she was disappointed when her teachers didn't notice.

[Flobbadobs]

Interesting you mention failing schools seeker.
6 years ago the high school that DS now attends was in special measures and at the stage where they had been given 12 months to turn themselves around. They brought in a super head who blew the place wide open in order to keep the school.
One of the first things he did was to crack down on uniform.replaced the jumpers with blazers, organised a house system with each house having its own tie which had to be tied in such a way so a certain length of tie was showing under the knot, banned any skirts other than the official school issued skirt, plain black shoes -he even banned walking shoes on school premises until there was a backlash as we are pretty rural-. The students aren't even allowed to take off their blazers unless they get permission from the teacher!
Now I'm not suggesting that the uniform is the reason that the schools last OFSTED report was good with outstanding qualities, the staff have worked really bloody hard to get there and the school is recognised at national level in a certain subject but the current head uses it as a symbol of the pride that the students take in their school. At the open evening last year (DS is in yr 7) he constantly all the bloody time connected looking smart to feeling smart and being organised which hopefully leads to better performance.
The SATS and exam results in this schools case would back up his assertion but it's not the uniform on its own, more a case of better teaching and I suppose a better attitude within the school.