to wonder which formula company sponsored this article?

[nittynittynora]

yano.co.uk/2013/03/breast-is-best-or-is-it/

It just seems so anti-breastfeeding! Surely the health benefits of BFing are proven - there's nothing political about saying that it protects against disease, for example.I agree that of course you can form a close bond with your baby when FFing but the rest of the article seems determined to bat away all the 'supposed' benefits of BFing and focus on any perceived 'cons'.

shag no problem....it is telling in and of itself that my parody could and does turn up for real regularly!

Likewise I know of know one being told that in their specific case they should breast feed regardless of the mothers wishes.

BF is best on average. This tells you nothing of individual circumstances, and as I said, I have never heard of someone being forced.

Breast is not globally best.

Breast is normal, which may be best for some women and babies..... But formula may be best for others.

...... And I say that as someone who exclusively BFd 2 children until they were 18 months and 2.4 respectively.

Are we talking about what's best for mum or best for the baby?

Not always best for the mother - clearly. But nutritionally for the child it is the best.

I avoid BF/FF posts like the plague, but I must say this.

I have never met any FF mothers who judge BF mothers negatively.
Conversely, I met plenty of BF mothers who do judge FF mothers VERY negatively. And I have met plenty of FF mothers who were driven to severe depression and worse because of the general disapproval of their 'choice' (even when the 'choice' was to let their babies starve).

In the UK, in the present day, I really don't think advertising makes such a big difference in people deciding whether to go for one or the other. Women have "proper" reasons for their choices.

In answer to the original question, in my experience, the BF message is rammed down women's throats much more 'violently' in the here and now. In my mix-feeding days, I could clearly feel a "breast fundamentalism" coming from certain quarters (which I can only assume OP belongs to), and it has done more real harm to both mothers and babies than FF ever could (in this country, at present).

Can I also say - a severely depressed/suicidal mother is FAR WORSE for a baby than FF ever could (anywhere, anytime).

Shagmund - the livejournal communities are full of exactly what I'm talking about, I'm afraid.

Anyone who thinks ff is pushed anywhere really can't have had a baby.

I registered on the Aptamil website recently to find out some product information and every fucking page is full of BF bumf before you can go anywhere. Ditto the emails they send.

Seriously, why would anyone want to use the Aptamil website for that??

It does stick in the craw a bit though when you start being told by HCPs that from 6 months follow-on is better as it has more nutrients than breastmilk which declines in quality quickly.

(Yes, I made a complaint.)

I was told recently that I need to give ds two large bottles if formula per day as some women (sympathetic look) don't have the best quality milk. And am I eating ok?

"who were driven to severe depression and worse because of the general disapproval of their 'choice' (even when the 'choice' was to let their babies starve)."

Yes, because breastfeeding advocates are so evil they'd rather babies were DEAD than formula fed.

Weird. I've been an enthusiastic bf advocate for YEARS, have met hundreds of others, and have only heard one very young and stoopid bf peer supporter trainee express the view - fairly timidly - that she thought it was selfish not to breastfeed. She was immediately shot down in flames by everyone else.

"Women have "proper" reasons for their choices."

Out of interest, why do you think older and more educated mothers choose to breastfeed and breastfeed longer. What do you think accounts for them having fewer reasons not to breastfeed? They're also the group most likely to go back to work after having a baby, and the group most likely to have had difficult births and pre-existing health conditions. And yet as a group, they seem to find fewer reasons not to breastfeed.

Asian and African women in the UK seem to have fewer reasons not to breastfeed too.

T'is all very interesting to me.

Chunderella
I think that is one of the best posts I have ever read on here on this subject.
Totally objective.

I think Chunderella is one of the most intellegent ladies ever, we are so lucky she is a mums netter and posts here with her wonderfully wise words.

I always find her posts to be so well written, eloquent, informative and gentle.

The come as a relief to some other posters who rear thier heads on these subjects.

That's funny, because I read Chunderella's post as one from someone who is absolutely, blindly determined not to concede that breastfeeding is the healthiest and most nutritious way to feed your baby, despite all the evidence to prove this.

The cat is not out of the bag, I'm afraid, fashionable as it may currently be to rubbish the benefits of breastfeeding. Scientists are constantly discovering new ways that breastfeeding and new amazing facts about its composition; there is still a lot we don't know about breast milk, but we do know that it is a living substance that cannot be replicated by formula milk and its man-made ingredients.

Just one of the amazing things it does, for example, is to coat the gut of a new born baby and provide passive immunity for the baby in a way that formula cannot. It is an amazing substance.

I do not think that governments and major health organisations are so stupid and ill informed that they are putting their all into recommending a substance whose superiority is just a hypotheses, much as you would perhaps like that to be true.

that breastfeeding benefits babies, I meant to say!

Is it possible that governments choose to promote it so heavily because it costs so little to do so, and involves almost no clinical expenditure (although they could do so much more to support women post-birth!) so why wouldn't you. If the proven benefits are assessable on a macro level only in any case, then it's exactly macro-level health care providers who stand to gain from these benefits bearing out in reality. Eg a 10% reduction in likelihood of x illness means a lot of breastfed babies still get the illness but does lead to a 10% reduction in babies overall getting the illness and the related costs of care for the healthcare provider. On an individual basis, you could breastfeed til the cows come home and see none of the benefits because of other factors. So in some ways I think it's a leap of faith.

And extolling the benefits of breastfeeding does NOT = denigrating women who bottle feed and trying to make them feel guilty! It just does not! It may make them feel guilty, and that is of course something they should not feel - but that is nobody's aim.

Last time I looked cervantes, producing marketing materials - flyers, DVDs, websites, then paying for the distribution of these plus paying for training of breastfeeding counsellors and all the other activity the government takes part in to promote BFing was certainly not a low cost activity, and in these times of austerity I'm sure if there was the slightest whiff that this was all a waste of time, they would use the money elsewhere.

It would be nice if, instead of merely promoting breastfeeding, the health service could give help and support right at the beginning, on the wards.

While that is not in place, it is not the best thing for many mothers (extrapolates wildly from own experience), because extolling its virtues without that support creates a great deal of anxiety, angst and guilt, and a hangover of negativity about the whole thing.

Theres's this cognitive dissonance about breastfeeding than leads people to extreme emotional reactions to it. It's not wonderful, nor is it poisonous.

Sorry, i meant bf is not necessarily wonderful, nor is FF poisonous

Chunderella, in fact it is often breastfeeding women who are shamed in public, not ones who bottlefeed. I find your tone very patronising towards women in general and quite arrogant actually when you say they have the 'right to know what the science says' - and you are going to be the one to put everyone in the picture, are you? Because you know better than everyone else?

jamie, I agree with that, I think more support is definitely needed.