To give a homeless man a meal deal rather than the money?

[TheSeventhHorcrux]

There is a homeless man sat outside the Tesco Express with a little cup asking for money. Instead of giving him
Money I went inside and bought him a meal deal (crisps, ham sandwich and drink) and gave that to him. He was very polite and grateful about it and I thought nothing more of it until my friend then later accused me of being patronising by presenting him with food rather than te money.
When I lived in South Aftica I would often give food rather than money as in many cases the money went on drinks and drugs etc.
Am I being unreasonable to "control" the expenditure of this man (as put by friend) and not just give him money. I'm quite concerned now that he would have been offended, as my friend certainly thinks so!

[PessaryPam]

diddl, yes, otherwise you open up a world of painful middle class angst.

[Greensleeves]

And it isn't OK to assume that because somebody is homeless they must be drug-dependent and incapable of making good choices. How do you think that assumption makes people feel? On top of being homeless, they're also less-than-adult by default.

It would need to be one fucker of a ham sandwich to be worth all that. Homeless people are people, not hungry dogs. You don't get to throw them a crust and go home and get patted on the back. Not if you post about it in AIBU anyway.

[PessaryPam]

So Green what are we supposed to do?

[DeepRedBetty]

Sadly even 'free' meals at soup kitchens rely on the generosity of volunteers, fund-raisers and (some) food suppliers, the charity sells the tickets as a means of fundraising - I doubt they'd turn away a person clearly in need if they arrived without a voucher.

[garlicblocks]

Greensleeves.

Back in the '80s my employer gave generous Luncheon Vouchers (it was a nationwide scheme - you could spend them in restaurants, takeaways, sandwich shops) and a generous expense account, too. As we didn't really need all the LVs we used to give them to homeless people: we were in the West End; there were a lot. They were always very well received - mind you, we weren't choosing their lunch for them. I do think that was a bit presumptive. I bet if you asked in the shop, they'd have written out a receipt for him to bring in :)

[Greensleeves]

IMO PP, since you ask, if somebody is asking for money then you should either give him what you can afford or not give him anything. You could even talk to him. If you were shopping by card you could ask him what he would like. Generally treating him like another person really, not a child, or an animal, or some sort of peformance artist you can join in with.

I did give someone one of my penny whistles once. But he was really good and taught me a new tune.

[Greensleeves]

I think the luncheon vouchers are different. You already had those and of course it makes sense to pass them on if you don't need them. Not the same as going into the shop and choosing a nice worthy lunch for someone who is asking for change outside.

[PessaryPam]

Green well that's wonderful and exactly what I already do.

[Angelico]

You did a nice thing OP. Enjoy the warm glow. For every hundred people who walked past that man 99 of them probably gave him fuck all. So you were not being unreasonable.

[TheOriginalSteamingNit]

Who wants their salary paid to them as a Sainsburys delivery of food for the month - no fags or booze obv - and some primark vouchers for clothes?

[garlicblocks]

No, not the same. It's the same as "If you were shopping by card you could ask him what he would like."

[TheOriginalSteamingNit]

Anyway: clearly kindly meant, but since you ask, I'd give a quid or two rather than a sandwich.

[Greensleeves]

If this hadn't been in AIBU and worded the way it is (the thread title) I wouldn't have responded so emphatically BTW. But this isn't a support thread, or a self-congratulatory feel-good thread. And it is something I have strong views/feelings about.

I do rather resent the implication that I shouldn't answer frankly because OP did a lovely thing in good faith and I might upset her. She posted asking for a debate about it - we've provided one, and without any personal attacks.

[Branleuse]

if he's hanging around begging for money, then he's asking to be patronised . It sounds like he was glad of the food and it was good of you to give it.
no issue x

[NoMoreMarbles]

I think it is a lovely thing you did OP :) it is something I have done to an extent in the past.

I think that the entire situation is demeaning from the homeless man needing to sit, dirty, hungry and whatnot and beg strangers for money...to the being ignored by most and getting given pennies by others... He is sat on a cold floor, wet through to his skin, hungry, possibly hung over/coming down off a drug, most likely cold right into his bones... Whether or not a sandwich, drink and bag of crisps is the best choice here shouldn't even be a debate as ANYTHING Is better than nothing. If I were homeless on the streets, having to poo in an entryway, starved and thin, being ignored or jeered at, spat at or assaulted, being treated as less than human by strangers in the street I doubt very much, if a person bought me a ham sandwich, drink and bag of crisps, the first thought out of my head would be "cheeky bastard...what about my right to choose my own purchases...how demeaning"

[TheOriginalSteamingNit]

He's asking to be patronised?

[Greensleeves]

I find it a bizarre argument that because somebody is clearly already at a low ebb, it is OK to treat them as less than fully adult. And I don't think it follows that somebody who is homeless and going through hell no longer feels humiliated or insulted by gestures which betray assumptions about their competence.

There is just no need for it. It is middle class smuggery and it has no place. Either give the poor fucker what he is asking for, or trot on. Don't use him to give yourself a nice rosy glow and something to tell your friends.

[grovel]

Greensleeves, fine.

And I think your posts smack of revolting smugness. You know best and we should do what you do or nothing at all.

[TranceDaemon]

When it was snowing recently there was a man sitting outside my local Costa, wrapped in a thin blanket, clearly freezing. I had no cash but was going in so bought him a coffee and muffin and took them out to him.

Not to patronise him, but because I wanted to help him.

Seeing as I had no shelter, hard cash or a job to offer it was the best I had.

Should I have walked past and ignored him then?

[Greensleeves]

Everyone who posts an opinion on AIBU "knows best" fgs. It's a forum for debating opinions. It seems to be you who wants to stop people from posting against the majority opinion on this thread. But you can't I'm afraid.

[flow4]

Here's a report from the Joseph Rowntree Foundation that gives a very good insight into homelessness and the issues facing homeless people. 70% of homeless people with complex needs have a substance misuse problem. 63% say they drink 6 or more alcoholic drinks per day. The figures are higher for rough sleepers.

I don't see this kind of drug/alcohol misuse as a lifestyle choice; I see it as a problem at best, and a tragedy for many. The substance misuse is a cause of many people's homelessness, and factor that makes admission to hospital, and psychiatric hospital more likely, and prison, and being a victim of crime or domestic violence, and self-harming, and prostitution, and a whole host of other problems...

I don't think it's treating people as 'less human' to give food rather than cash; I think it's reasonable not to want to risk contributing further to all these potential problems.

I do think that asking what someone would like to eat is a better option... And I bet the OP will do that next time. :)

[MrsTerryPratchett]

I have worked in homelessness for years. Here's my take. I sometimes give food, if I have a sandwich or something about my person. I ask if they want it first. I sometimes give money, if I have a bit of change on me. I sometimes give a smile and an 'I'm sorry' if I can't or have given a lot that week.

I also know the people who are begging a lot of the time. I won't give money to people I know have ODed recently. However, I do give money to other people who use drugs and alcohol. I don't see why I should use some of my money for alcohol but deny them that.

The severely addicted will get the money for drugs and alcohol. It may be prostituting, it may be robbing and selling, it may be dealing, it may be begging, they will find the cash. I'd rather give them cash than have them have to do things that are worse.

[grovel]

Greensleeves, I agree. That's why I gave my opinion of your post Get it?

"There is just no need for it. It is middle class smuggery and it has no place. Either give the poor fucker what he is asking for, or trot on. Don't use him to give yourself a nice rosy glow and something to tell your friends." Lovely.

[AgnesBligg]

I think homeless charities have for a long while now asked people not to donate to individuals, but to support homeless charities themselves. They can support people in getting food, accommodation short term and Long, benefits, and help in independent living skills.

A lot refuse this help, unless it's really cold outside. But there are outreach workers who will be aware of the people the OP has encountered for example.

OP you were kind and I'm very sure your lunch was much appreciated. Cash donated will be spent on booze.

[Greensleeves]

I "get it". I'm not getting into a game of ping pong with the likes of you.

Mrs TerryPratchett, in the OP's situation, would you have given money, given nothing, asked what he would like from the shop, or gone in and bought a ham sarnie and a Coke? Not a trick question; I'm genuinely interested, as you have extensive experience.