AIBU to find this slightly odd behaviour from atheist friends?

[handsandknees]

I am an Evangelical Christian. People who know me well know that. I am happy to talk about it if people want to, but I don't go on about it.

Last Easter one of my friends posted a long status on facebook basically ranting against the Christian Easter message and saying that she didn't want or need Jesus to have died for her, thank you very much. Up to her what she writes of course, but the tone was very aggressive and I wondered why. I didn't comment but later she sent me a personal message asking me what I thought of her post.

Then this week another friend posted a photo on my wall which said "Proud to say I'm an atheist". I haven't responded but just wondering why would someone do this? I am not offended just find it a bit strange.

Why do you think they would do this?

[Wallison]

Thanks, TheWave, Fushia, Narked and Joyful. I know I haven't explained myself very well and sorry for getting the thread off-topic, but I just got a little bee in my bonnet about it.

Have to say that I don't much like the 'Like if you love Jesus' things you get on Facebook, but there is worse stuff on there - all of the 'Fuck off you foreign bastards I'm wearing my poppy' ones really got my goat recently. The Jesus stuff is quite benign compared to that as at least it's mostly people being thankful for what they say are his blessings - family, home etc.

[seeker]

Exactly, narked. The gravity analogy is a very good one.

[ethelb]

just to go back to the op, the op's FB friend is anti-religion rather than atheist then? As she is expressing a belief though apparantly that is impossible if she is an atheist.

[Wallison]

Where does the friend say he is expressing a belief? He just says he's an atheist.

[ethelb]

accordign to the OP, nowhere has the FB poster said they were an atheist. OP may have missed that off, but all the info we have says they were ranting against the Christian easter message.

[handsandknees]

I don't know if my friend would say she was an atheist. I would have said she is, but after this not so sure!

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

"What impossibility are you talking about in your atheism? a Deity presumably"

You presume wrong. Take your pick from all the woolly religious concepts such as grand designers controlling the world, fate and karma, signs and portents, offerings and requests, 'miracles' etc... all undertaken on the basis of sheer faith & belief with no evidence of their existence & no predictability of outcome.

Dogs look in mirrors and believe they see another dog. Because I know they are seeing their reflection, that doesn't mean I am a non-believer in the 'Other Dog Tenet'.... just that I am a lot more rational than the dog

[ethelb]

I understand a bit better what you are saying cogito. Though offerings and requests are real things though surely?

I think not believing in religious claims is antitheism though.

[madmouse]

For those who raised that point - evangelical means seeing the Bible as containing the word of God and living by it as well as you can.

It does not mean the same as evangelising - which means spreading the word of God.

It sounds the same because 'Evangel' refers to the Word of God.

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

Offerings and requests made expecting some kind of result? 'The power of prayer'? Lucky charms? No sorry.... all merely an expression of hope and desperation with no real evidence of a positive outcome.

[ethelb]

evanglism means "reward for the messenger of the word" actually. Or something like that.

Does the word angel come from the same word as messenger in Greek?

[madmouse]

Yes Ethelb - same word.

[Wallison]

The OP says that one of her friends posted 'proud to be an atheist'. I thought that was what you were talking about.

The other one was going on about Easter but we don't know if she is an atheist.

[ethelb]

but people do make offers and requests expecting some kind of result!

I'm not saying that there is any evidence that they will get a result but those religious practices are real tangible things. I can go into a mosque and see someone, touch someone, smell someone praying.

[madmouse]

''The term evangelical has its etymological roots in the Greek word for "gospel" or "good news": ευαγγελιον (evangelion), from eu- "good" and angelion "message". In that sense, to be an evangelical would mean to be a believer of the Gospel, that is the message of Jesus Christ.''

[madmouse]

oops MN does not support greek alphabet

[madmouse]

When my son was born and fell really really ill and turned out to be brain damaged doctors were sure of one thing: His visual cortex was shot and he would be blind.

He's now nearly 5 and they have no clue, really no clue how come he sees so well.

Several thousand (literally) people praying in our view has had something to do with it

[FredFredGeorge]

CogitoErgoSometimes So why an atheist when you oppose so much more than a deity? Indeed the idea of rationalism is a tenet of Humanism or perhaps more specically from what you describe Naturalism (although you may have people thinking of you as a worshipper of David Attenborough is you say that's your religion.)

On strict definitions Atheism is defined as a disbelief in a deity - that is a completely fine as part of a belief system (Buddism says the same for example). But people who describe themselves as Atheist, almost always do so with so much more doctrine and a rejection of religion message that you've described. Obviously not all as there is no central body controlling the doctrine so what one person believes is often different to another, but it's a religion and the most aggressive atheist is terrible for trying to convert people to their view, one of which is the rejection that they have a system of belief, ie a religion.

[FredFredGeorge]

(of course the ex-atheist who got too annoyed with his co-religionist that he now rails against atheists is another person you should watch out for - particularly engaging them on forums...)

[LoopsInHoops]

The 'God is Good' FB post - surely was posted for comment? Isn't that what statuses are for? I think the 'what's he done now?' response is perfect and not rude in the slightest. Rude would have been 'you believe in bullshit' or somesuch. That comment was just funny. No need to get all huffy.

[OxfordBags]

If seeing someone express a view on religion that you don't agree with feels aggressive, invasive, offensive and unnecessary to you, OP, then maybe you ought to consider that you expressing a view on religion feels exactly like that to people who don't agree with your views, either.
Perhaps you should see this friend's post as a taste of your own medicine. How is it okay for a friend to write 'God is good' or other statements of her BELIEF SYSTEM but not okay for another friend to write a statement of her BELIEF SYSTEM?!

The problem I have with Christians (and I single them out because I just don't come across it with people of other faiths, for the reason I'm about to outline) is that their beliefs are privileged in Western society, however much they like to delude themselves they are a persecuted minority whenever anyone has the audacity to not agree with them. So, coupled with the strength of their religious views, they begin to truly, unconsciously believe that their views ARE the truth, are innately the right ones, the correct and superior ones. So, if there is a history of their beliefs being given priority and seen as correct, they find it then hard to fully grasp and properly accept and respect that other people have views equal to their own, which are allowed to be expressed, spoken and discussed just as freely also. People of other religions don't tend to be like that as much because they don't have that background of their views being privileged.

What I basically mean is that Atheists have every right to speak their views as religious people. I get sick to the teeth of every expression of Atheism being automatically and knee-jerkedly described as aggressive, and the like. What they mean is "I'm not used to seeing the status quo being questioned like this and it makes me uneasy". Stating your beliefs as an Atheist has nothing to do woth trying to convert people, btw, FredFredGeorge. I have no interest in coverting anyone. What I believe in is fact, logic and provable stuff, and you can't convert people to those as they just are what they are regardless of subjective opinion.

PS Sharing the gospel is not exactly ramming it down people's throats?! WTF? You are intruding on people to ask grown adults to believe in 100% totally unprovable, illogical lies but that's not ramming it down people's throats? Riiiight.

[Wallison]

Oh honestly. Atheism is not a religion. Nor is it a belief system. It is the absence of belief. Trying to define it in religious terms is a favourite trick of a certain type of believer, who cannot imagine the issue framed in any other terms than doctrinal, because they cannot see beyond faith. Not all believers are like that, thankfully.

[Goldmandra]

Goldmandra just out of interest why are your children defined in your previous post as believers in the church like your DH? How old are they?

15 and 9. Is there a minimum age for Christianity?

What you defined about atheists not believing supports what Wallison" has said about being an atheist I think.*

Sorry I didn't realise I was only allowed to post if I was disagreeing with Wallison. Are questions not allowed?

[fatsatsuma]

madmouse I read through the whole thread hoping to find SOMEONE who understands the difference between 'evangelical' and 'evangelise' - and was so pleased to see your post - thank you!

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

"So why an atheist when you oppose so much more than a deity?"

I'm not any 'ist' as far as I'm aware because that suggests I'm part of some group. I'm a person for whom the whole business of religion (and corresponding superstitions) are academically/sociologically/traditionally interesting but largely irrelevant except when it bumps up against me in some tangential fashion... .such as the 'click like if you love Jesus!!!' posts on FB. :)