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"What about the men that get raped?"

(231 Posts)
thefinerthingsinlife Thu 04-Nov-10 15:59:59

Whilst talking about Reclaim the Night to a friend, a male asked what it was about I explained, he then questioned "what about all the men that get raped and are victims of domestic violence??" I explained to him that I think that only 3% of men are victims and the stats are roughly the same for Dv (i'm not a 100% that these stats).

He then said "I thought you believed men and women are equal therefore Reclaim should be about men victims too"

I didn't really know what to say to this so can someone give me some guidence


Lougle Thu 04-Nov-10 16:05:30

I agree with him.

sethstarkaddersmum Thu 04-Nov-10 16:09:23

point out that men are welcome to organise their own marches and other events to raise awareness about male rape and domestic violence victims but you happen to be marching for women.

and tell him he is a cheeky fucker for telling women how to run their liberation campaign and that it is a bit rich to expect women to do all the work of sorting out male rape given that it is men that do the raping.

MadamDeathstare Thu 04-Nov-10 16:09:32

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

scurryfunge Thu 04-Nov-10 16:09:47

Men can offer support by joining the London pro-feminist Men's group and march too.

scurryfunge Thu 04-Nov-10 16:11:51

Tell him that men are already taken care of in the judicial system and women need to represented as their rights are traditionally ignored.

HerBeatitude Thu 04-Nov-10 16:12:40

Ask him if he thinks any other group which are systematically discriminated against, like Muslims, Black people, Irish people, travellers etc., should always include every other unmarginalised group in the protests they hold to protest against what happen to them.

And then tell him that sometimes, women have the right to stand up for themselves without referring to any other group. If he wants to set up a reclaim the night march for men, he is free to do so and if he wants to exclude women from that, or invite them, it's up to him.


booyhoo Thu 04-Nov-10 16:14:29

totally agree with sethstarkaddersmum.

why teh hell shoudl women also be organising support groups for men that don't have the gumtion to do it for themselves. if they want the support then get it themselves. women have had to.

HerBeatitude Thu 04-Nov-10 16:15:04

And also I agree with Seth, he needs to understand that his assumption that he is entitled to tell women how to run their campaign to be treated as full human beings, as valuable as men, is the result of his male privilege and is very unattractive.

sethstarkaddersmum Thu 04-Nov-10 16:15:34

and point out that by not doing anything himself, just criticising the way you choose to conduct your campaigns, he is like the man sitting idly in his armchair watching his wife hoovering and shouting 'You've missed a bit!'

booyhoo Thu 04-Nov-10 16:16:05

and agrree with herbeatitude

HerBeatitude Thu 04-Nov-10 16:16:09

Yes, ask him what he is doing to stop rape.

booyhoo Thu 04-Nov-10 16:17:18

apologies for my appauling spelling. blush

thefinerthingsinlife Thu 04-Nov-10 16:25:09

I did say to him that if he felt that strongly about it then he should organise his own march. To which he replied "I'm just saying that maybe there should a joint one, instead of singling out one sex."

booyhoo Thu 04-Nov-10 16:30:38

if men who were raped felt the need for a joint one there is nothing stopping them creating a joint one.

HerBeatitude Thu 04-Nov-10 16:35:25

Well, when men are raped and sexually abused at the rate of 1 in 4, and the perpetrators are equal numbers of men and women, then perhaps it would be appropriate to have a joint march.

But seeing as though that is not the case, it would be utterly inappropriate to invite men to a place where it might be expected that a large proportion of the participants have been raped. Women have the right to feel safe, and their right trumps his assumption that he has the right to elbow into their safe spaces.

sethstarkaddersmum Thu 04-Nov-10 16:36:13

Thing is, you don't have to justify it to him.
If I was talking to someone who was really involved in the issues - someone who was actually working against violence and had well-thought-through reasons why they thought it should be done jointly, even if their view differed from my own, I would feel I owed it to them to discuss it properly.
But if they are just making an idle comment, have never really thought about it or done anything about it themselves, and are not likely to change their view, why waste time or brainpower on them?
In that situation I would be inclined to just say in a slightly bored way, 'No, there shouldn't, singling out one sex is better.'

ElephantsAndMiasmas Thu 04-Nov-10 16:43:50

I would say "well when you've organised it let me know when it is and I'll try to come along".

The point of the march is that the streets aren't safe for women at night. Some men also get attacked but it is more dangerous for women hence the reason that men walk their female friends home at night rather than the other way round. This is the one night of the year where a loud, visible presence of women reclaims their right to walk through the streets at night unaccompanied by men, without fear of rape or assault, in solidarity with the thousands of women who have been killed or injured because of their sex. It would hardly have the same impact were men to march as well.

Also many women on the march have been raped, and they deserve to have a safe space to protest about this without being jostled alongside men for a change, not matter how well meaning. Maybe point out to him that a woman at Reclaim the Night last year was groped by some fucking arsehole who was just passing by.

ByThePowerOfGreyskull Thu 04-Nov-10 17:04:28

I have mixed feelings on this, on so many levels he is right, and they are part of a much smaller group so it would be much much harder to gain the level of numbers and support for a big march.

I agree however that for these women it is a powerful statement about women being safe.

HerBeatitude Thu 04-Nov-10 17:16:32

Re well-meaning men coming along to the march - if men were invited, it wouldn't jsut be well meaning men coming, would it? It would be abusers too.

And women hav ethe right not to be in the same space as rapists when they are protesting about rape.

booyhoo Thu 04-Nov-10 17:19:21

totally agree herbeatitude.

Saltatrix Thu 04-Nov-10 17:21:39

Your stats regarding DV for males is not 3% it is closer to 30%

edam Thu 04-Nov-10 17:23:05

Men are entirely free to set up organisations campaigning about rape or violence. I haven't noticed any. When your friend makes an effort to create one or join one, then he'll be entitled to an opinion. Until then, it's just the usual sexist attack on anything women do to campaign against injustice.

(Btw, re. DV, significant number of male victims are the victims of male perpetrators).

thefinerthingsinlife Thu 04-Nov-10 17:30:57

Is it really that high Saltatrix?? I must say i'm suprised.

Saltatrix Thu 04-Nov-10 17:32:27

Actually edam the number is not more significant than female > female related DV cases. Certainly the vast majority of DV which occurs is from the opposite sex.

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