Baby who never naps, can I have some advice on the sleep thing, what can I do now which might pay off later?

[tenacityflux]

Hello, my DD is 11 weeks and hasn't ever slept well, I know she's very little but I want to try something to get us into good habits. So far we have been trying a bed time routine which seems to combine lots of ideas I've gleaned in wide eyed frantic sleep deprived internet searching - I find I need a quiet evening to function, so we bath her at 5.30 to 6.30 (Not for an hour but just at some point during this time) and then she has her feed - she is breast fed the rest of the time but for some reason will never feed at this time, she gets upset and comes on and off the breast - so although we always try she usualy has a bottle of ebm and if she's really hungry, her only few oz of formula. Then I walk around winding her and telling her a story and put how down awake, with my hands on her and on her side and a musical toy playing. One time she went to sleep in ten mins, but the usual thing is I sit with her until she cries and keep my hands on her, if she doesn't calm down I pick her up and sooth her and put her down, when she is eventually quiet I sneak out - I hate her crying but I have my hands on her and I never leave her until she is asleep - I'm hopping she will eventually link the music to sleep time and be able to go to sleep without much more. Tonight she was hard to settle and woke up twice more but that is ( I hope) unususal - she is then usually asleep until midnight when she wakes for a feed and I then take her into my bed where she sleeps and feeds the rest of the night. I Know I should probably try and make her settle again at 12, but my DH has a driving job which means he has to get up early and he needs to sleep, so we've decided this is better for now as I would rather he got sleep and didn't cause a motorway pile up. But during the day, DD will sit happily in her day bed looking at the world for an hour or more, yawning away, but won't ever sleep, just eventually cries. I feed her lying down sometimes but she rarely falls asleep feeding, if she does it's for 5 mins tops; the only way she will sleep during the day is the baby sling - and then she will complain about being put in if she's tired and fights sleeping. Everyone says napping is essential but I don't see how I can get her to nap without her screaming, and so far even my hands on screaming technique hasn't come close to getting her to nap. I'm hoping that she she's bigger/eating more she will gradually push the midnight feed back, especially if we move her bed time back a little, but should I continue having two day time sling naps with her to get her used to the idea that napping is good? Sorry this is such a long post, and very me me me, but I feel like such a novice!

[dizzyjingles]

she's still quite young to be getting into a routine, I've only just managed it with DD3 at 18wks and everything miraculously just fell into place. I certainly didn't do anything different

what about walking in the pram or driving in the car? does she like motion to help her sleep at all?

my DD1 slept in her pram the most and DD2 seemed to need to be in a moving car!! there are never 2 the same

[tenacityflux]

I can take her out in the pram and she does sleep but the sling is easier, first floor flat you see, and I don't drive. I know she's young and I'm not really expecting her to be in a routine, I think she's doing pretty well to sleep as she does, but I guess I just worry she is getting so over tired in the day time because her tired cry sounds so nasty! I run through the feeding/changing/winding/hot/cold check list so she must be tired, I guess sling or pram naps are ok in the whole scale of things? I just hate the way people with no kids say stuff like 'she she sleeping through the night yet?' and those with all seem to have babies who sleep 12 hours every night with naps all day!!!

[dizzyjingles]

ignore them, it seems to be one of those bloody questions that people ask the minute you have a baby like

oohh who does she/he look like
are they sleeping through
when are you having another

wtf?!? if they can't give helpfuil advice seriously ignore them

sling/pram are both good and keep you sane as well does she take a dummy/suck her thumb or go to sleep when she's feeding?

[Aitch]

people are idiots, they just want to Say Something. i love it when they ask 'is she a good baby?' as if you're ever going to turn round and reply 'well, no, actually, we're thinking of returning her'.

slings are BRILLIANT! and i've never tried to have a routing with dds1 and 2, really, it will all fall into place. i don't buy into the whole 'habits' thing particularly, my dds are like goldfish, they don't remember things from one week to the next, so i just try to please myself. although having said that dd2 is 15 weeks now and falling into a nice pattern.

but that's her choice, not mine,iykwim? i'm happy enough having her around in the evenings tootling on my chest or wherever, certainly i'd rather do that while watching the telly than impose some sort of routine on myself that meant that i spend my evenings in a darkened room patting and shushing.

[dizzyjingles]

did you keep your reciept aitch you might not get what you originally paid if you didn't

cannot believe your DD2 is now 15wks when did that happen?!?

[Aitch]

I KNOW!!!

she's still teeny... not a great deal over 7lbs. i'm going to the paeds tomorrow for an appointment, they're going to kick my arse.

[dizzyjingles]

why on earth would they kick your arse?

[Aitch]

cos she's not HUGE. in fact she's dropping off the charts. but she can smile and say goo-goo.

[dizzyjingles]

well don't let them knock your confidence, you know your baby best

I'm at the other end with DD3 now 20wks and looks more like a 9month old but she'd still just bfed and not weaning yet and they're still moaning at me

they're never happy are they?

[Aitch]

i'll try, thanks. they do make me feel like i'm being dangerously cavalier with her health for exc bfing her (and because it never worked out with dd1 i am not confident about it so find it hard not to feel undermined). and well done you, btw, your baby sounds DELICIOUS.

[dizzyjingles]

thank you I certainly think she it

they are all different though, just remember that. DD1 fed like a dream for 8months till I went back to work, DD2 was hell on earth so got 6months purely because of maternal guilt

DD3 has had some harsh moments but we take it one feed at a time and we're doing ok - as long as she's having wet, dirty nappies and sleeping then you know best that she's happy and if they can't be supportive just ask to speak to someone else!

[tenacityflux]

My DD is over 9 pounds now at 11 weeks and they still try and make me feel like I am neglecting her even though she is rising up her own curve in quite big jumps - there is one HV whom unfortunately I'm under the remit of, who seams hell bent on undermining me in the nicest possible way - I've been getting DD weighed at a BF support group to avoid her and she rang up to see where I was and when I told her that she'd put on 9 oz in 10 days said 'And you're happy with that?' when frankly, who wouldn't be! She also had a go at me about sling wearing, see previous rant, well, DD is happily asleep on me, so that's one nap I wouldn't have managed without the sling!

[Aitch]

it's amazing how they can undermine, isn't it? cos tbh it sounds to me like you're doing brilliantly.

paed was nice today, thank god.

[tenacityflux]

Had a terrible evening - DD is having real problems feeding again and no one has any idea why or can offer me anything which works All day she refused to BF, fussing, coming off after one suck and screaming,not really feeding but just mouthing my nipple - Finally at lunch I tried to feed her and she screamed and screamed hysterically for 20 mins, then when calm fed for 10; she slept for an hour in the sling in the morning and for 20 mins only in the afternoon, then in the evening would not feed, she got upset, I got upset;finally we gave her a bottle of ebm and then formula; put her to bed awake after her bedtime routine - then she was awake for AN HOUR - as I and DH took it in turns to sit with her, not crying but just awake and yawning; then she began hysterical screaming, I finally got her calm and she fed for 10 mins,we put her down, and finally she went to sleep. She had been awake for 5 hours, at her age, is this normal?!I get so upset, I'm so tired, even thinking of seeing a sleep specialist.

[Aitch]

oh you poor thing. it sounds very much like a night of colic, it's awful, isn't it? dd2 gets it sometimes, so while she's not what i'd call a colicky baby cos it's intermittent.

have you ever had trapped wind? it REALLY hurts. do you think it might have been that?

[LisaJasper]

I think your dd is very overtired, at that age a baby should definately not be awake for more than two hours at a time (I guess it varies from baby to baby a bit though). I think for the time being you should not worry about trying to get her into a routine as that will change pretty much weekly anyway (in my experience!!!) but just concentrate on getting her to sleep every two hours - in a sling, on your lap, at the breast, pram, whatever works really. Once she has caught up on some sleep and is less overtired she should feed much better and then sleep much better, then you can try to get her to go to sleep by herself now - trust me you won't ruin things by letting her sleep however she can! Oh and if she does have trapped wind give two drops of infacol before every single feed (even if it is just 20 mins apart) and try to keep her uprightish for between 10-30 mins after a feed.
Sorry for the long post but just wanted to give some advice!!!

[SleeplessinSwansea]

Hi- my baby was the same at 11 weeks, just wouldn't nap. he is still a terrible napper at 10 months but my advice is don't get stressed by it. I really regret all the wasted energy worrying about a bloody nap. In the end they stop napping altogether so don't worry if you can't get it together at the moment. Go with the flow.

Give it a go at putting them do when they look tired. Try for 20 mins ^if it doesn't work give up for a while. Don't drive yourself demented. the shhh pat thing worked for us sometimes and the pram was my saviour.
Mind you I lost about 15kg in 3 months i did so much walking and breast-feeding!

[Aitch]

oh yes lisa that thing about the two hours is golden. someone told me that with dd1 and it made a big difference. don't be afraid to wear the sling A Lot, tenacity.

[tenacityflux]

I'll try doing two hour nap attempts in sling or whatever,well, it will be sling, nothing else works during the day!Maybe that will help with her feeding, who knows....`i'm loosing the plot, everything which works for me is exactly what everyone (sleep professionals, HV, books) tells you not to do!

[Aitch]

well, babies can't read...

[ReinDIORdroppings]

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[Aitch]

DIOR! i was looking at your blog today. you are HOT HOT HOT!

[ReinDIORdroppings]

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[Aitch]

must've been someone else's blog then, cos the bird i saw was gorgeous...

[ReinDIORdroppings]

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