Trying hard to be reasonable. Have I been unfair?

[Onmyownwith4kids]

Husband had an affair. Level of deceit and lies terrible. Kept us both on the go while he told me I was his soulmate, do anything to keep me etc. I found out affair ongoing started divorce proceedings. He accused me of ruining his life but moved straight in with ow. Children were upset did not want to meet her. He said they had to but if they didn't like her they would not have to see her again. Since this meeting he's not seen them at weekends or holidays for 6 months ( does some childcare in week while I work) every time I see him he says he loves me not her and is miserable. I was delighted when he said he'd like to take them out for the day. Kids said they wanted to go but not if ow was there. He said it would just be him but she managed to mysteriously "turn up." I have no issue with them seeing her but very upset by the lies. I've also told him I don't want to hear more of his talk of love and wanting me back. That to me is deceiving her. Was a bit aloof with him today and wouldn't let him come with me for our son's birthday meal. Don't want to play pretend families. His mum has just phoned me, launched a tirade of abuse and accused me of upsetting her son. Have I made a difficult situation worse. In tears as tried so hard to keep this civil for the children. How do I stop this getting even nastier.

[MNR77]

So sorry you're going through this. Sounds like a very complicated situation, I don't blame you for not wanting to play happy families. It takes super human effort sometimes to keep things amicable. Don't be too hard on yourself, things will get easier. A kinder approach with your ex would help now to get back to being civil. It is not easy to do I know!

[Guiltypleasures001]

A kinder approach to your ex? Oh please call him a cab and tell him to fuck off to the far side of fuck, and tell the cab driver to pick up MIL on the way.

He's a cunt, he knows it , you know it the ow will find out at some point, any feelings you may harbour about being unfair are because you are a decent person, he isn't nuff said.

You can't be amicable you can be civil if it suits you, this is to be on your terms, he's lied to you and the kids, it's about time you got mamma bear on his arse and let him know the score.

Sorry you've been out in this position, his mother will always support him even though she knows he is an inadequate human being, he however is no longer your concern the faster you show him that the better you will feel.

For you

[LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726]

I don't think you were unfair. He could easily have arranged something with your son (including his mother, or not) as he wished. It's not as if you've stood in his way at any point. He's the one being unfair and you did quite right to tell him to stop talking to you about loving you when he doesn't know the meaning of the word.

I would keep it formal now; discussions only about the kids and if he doesn't stick to that, by e-mail and next stage by solicitor as necessary.

I would tell MIL to focus on her relationship with her grandchildren if she wants one and to leave you alone with her complaints about her poor pathetic son.

[1FluffyJumper]

You
Have
Not
Been
Unfair
.

[Onmyownwith4kids]

Thanks for your replies. Mother in law just sent a series of texts accusing me of brainwashing the kids against her son. He lied to them. They saw it. How can I be to blame. I am so distraught she thinks it's my fault.

[uglyswan]

Is there any reason for you to stay in contact with your MIL? Can you at least give yourself a break from her bullshit and block her number? Because none of this is your fault and it really isn't your problem she raised a lying crybaby.

[CurlyWurlyCake]

Oh dear god.

Do you have to speak to her or text her?

He made his bloody bed. You are not at fault here in anyway

[Drumdrum60]

Goodness me ! You know you have the moral high ground and do not let them think otherwise . Do not let them upset you because that is what they want . He had the affair . End of.

You sound really dignified and doing the right thing. God it's hard enough on your own as it is . He's twisting the truth because he can't stand being the bad guy. Setting his mum on you is a bit playground ? It must be so disappointing for you.

[Joysmum]

All you can do is not enter into game playing. Be a rock for your kids, the one person they can trust in not to lie to them.

Their father has not only deceived them whilst in the family untitled, but has shown that he still doesn't understand how his deceit means that even his own children (who would want to see the best in him) can't trust him. That's no way to parent.

Be their rock and don't let others sway you in your mission.

[MellowAutumn]

You mil is a twat as is your exdh. Tell her her son ruined his relationship with his children , not you and that she needs to think how her grandchildren are feeling not grown man who has made his own decisions and needs to live with them and take responsibility for the consequences.

[KiwiJude]

Oh good grief, MIL and father of your children sound hideous. What your MIL thinks is not important in the overall scheme of things. If you don't need to talk to her block her or get caller ID so you can avoid her calls and delete the texts without reading them. As if you haven't had enough grief already.

[dollius]

Well we can see where he got his ginormous sense of entitlement, can't we?

"I will not tolerate this abuse. If you cannot be civil, as I have been throughout this ordeal inflicted by your son, then you will be barred from contacting me at all. You can make arrangements to see the children through him from now on, when he can be bothered to make time for them."

Then don't answer any more calls/texts etc from her. Cut the bitch out.

[Thumbscrewswitch]

Stop caring what your MIL thinks. She might be a nice person but your H has form for lying to you - what on earth makes you think he will be telling her the truth? Sounds like he wants everyone to think the best of him (difficult under these circs!) so he will blame ANYONE and EVERYONE else before he takes any responsibility for fucking up himself.

Your MIL has, I'm sure, been fed a pack of lies, while he's painted himself to be the poor victim - so to some extent you can't blame her. But you don't have to put up with it either - so text her back and tell her that if the abusive texts don't stop, you'll have her for harassment.

Or, of course, she could just be as bad as him, in which case she's a dead loss anyway.

How old are your DC? Old enough to talk to granny without your intercession? If so, AND they want to talk to her, then put them straight on and tell her you have no further need to talk to her.

[Onmyownwith4kids]

Thanks for all your advice it's really helped. I've blocked her but feel bad as she sees the grandchildren through me. I'm not doing that any more her precious son can take them to see her. She says I'm vindictive and have used the children as a weapon. Him and her are very cross the kids know affair ended the marriage and say because of me being open about it that's why they don't like ow. My son discovered their texts so it would have involved me lying too to disguise what had gone on. I'm so upset about it ending in all this nastiness. Irony is she's spent 30 years spouting vitriol against her son's father. He had an affair and she has never stopped being bitter. Even tried to run her husband's affair partner over. She can't see the hypocrisy!

[Thumbscrewswitch]

But again, bear in mind that she's going on what her pweshus son is telling her, I'm sure - so she's not got the truth of the matter.

I don't know why I'm standing up for her in any way, really, except that it IS possible that she's been fed a heap of shit by him.

[Onmyownwith4kids]

He did admit he lied to them about the ow being there but she agrees with is reasoning that he had to lie or they wouldn't have gone with him. Her text said "he's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't' is it just me or would the reasonable thing have been to stick to the promise he made the children and not pretend he'd "bumped into her" my 8 year old daughter saw through it straight away. "So if he bumped into her why was bowling booked for her already" mil thinks it's my fault they see their dad as a liar but no brainwashing needed here! I've been up all night worried sick and now have to go to work. It's over a year since affair discovery. Will this ever end?

[BitOutOfPractice]

Here's the text to send back to your exMiL

"One of the very few advantages of your son being a lying, cheating adulterer, is that I no longer have to pretend to give a damn about what you think. Do not contact me again."

Then ignore her.

Hope you're ok op. Sounds like a vile situation.

[Thumbscrewswitch]

Oh I like that message. Unequivocal. But will put paid to any civility between you again I feel.

Please stop worrying - what can she do? Nothing! Your children are clever, they don't need brainwashing, they've already made their own minds up about their father. Your MIL needs to accept that, and so does their father.

[Anniegetyourgun]

"he's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't"

What a very meaningless statement in this context. He's only damned if he does. If he doesn't (pretend she won't be there and then bring her anyway) there's no problem at all. Unless she means that OW would have given him a hard time if he hadn't brought her, but that is hardly your fault is it?

There's really no way you can get round that weird way of thinking as you'd have to be as mad as they are to even understand it.

[UptheChimney]

Here's the point of view of a "child' ha ha ha with grey hair & wrinkles of divorce, I had no desire at all to have anything to do with my father's bits on the side. And even though my parents have been divorced for about 20 years, I still don't want to meet his girlfriends.

His betrayal of my mother felt like a betrayal of the family, and this is my response.

As an adult, I know it's probably a bit unreasonable, but I'm allowed to feel what I feel about my father's behaviour. I was first aware of his tendency to be unfaithful when I was 16, but my mother hung in there "for the children" till I was 30-something.

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

I think you'd be entitled to be unreasonable, although I don't think you are particularly. He's an established liar so that's just the landscape you're working in.... not a lot you can do about it. The ins and outs of why he left the family are not in doubt but the DCs don't really need to be caught up in what is ultimately an adult matter.

The practical sticking point appears to be access and that has to be separated out. With the best will in the world, you can't prevent his new girlfriend meeting his children for ever. That's a decision he has to make for himself as their parent, same as other decisions when he is responsible for their care. I think, if you could make peace with yourself over the access and swallow your hurt and pride a little, the other issues would resolve themselves.

[springydaffs]

Dear, dear me. What a carry on. Her, that is. No wonder he's a lying, cheating, entitled rodent with a mother like that. That#s not to excuse him, he's an adult.

really, stop listening to his, and her, complete shit. Block him, block her. The truth is looking them both in the face and they don't like it. Too bad, there are kids here.

You have been admirably dignified. Please, stop expecting them to be decent people. They have amply illustrated they are nothing of the sort and, probably, never will be. I dread to think what your marriage was like if he's capable of this highly manipulative rubbish - all the best to the ow (not).

Stop engaging with them both. Keep comms with him to the bare bones minimum, businesslike. He's not your friend. Goes without saying neither is she - who is she anyway? She's nothing in this, it's between you and your adult husband, stbx (thank goodness).

dust yourself off, you have the chance of a decent life now. Stop letting these spoilt children in adult bodies affect how you feel about yourself xx

[Onmyownwith4kids]

I have no issue with his girlfriend seeing the children. It's the lying I hate. I'm trying to encourage him to get his own house so him and her can see them in their own space and have the kids at weekends sometimes but he says I'm controlling. It's just so hard having him in my space the whole time and I then clear up all the mess he makes. I'd love there to be a proper routine but while he lives with her parents that can't happen. I'm so tired, I feel at breaking point. It would be nice for them to do a whole weekend of squabbles, washing, cooking etc and this woman who wants to be part of my kids lives to see there's more to it than bowling and a meal out once in a while. Is it horrible of me to feel smug when my 13 year old told me 6 and 4 year old ran wild. There was lots of tutting and shouting and she looked a bit fed up!

[Thumbscrewswitch]

I don't see, Cogito, why the children have to meet the OW if they don't want to. I don't see why their father gets to trump their wishes over that. I don't see it that it is HIS decision to make, more than theirs.

He can see them if he comes alone - not a problem. They don't want to meet OW - not a problem. The only problem comes when he lies about it and forces them into a situation they have said they do not want.

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

It's HIS decision because he is the parent and they are his responsibility during that time. As parents we're in a position of authority and we get to decide all kinds of things that DCs may or may not go along with. Barring actual neglect or harm, we have the final say. If the OP thinks there is neglect or harm taking place then that is a child protection matter that would have to be pursued at court level and supervised access put in place.

Clearly, if the man has any sense, he won't deliberately set out to alienate his own children, but it's ultimately his mistake to make... not the OP's and not the DCs'