Doing up a mid 1700's Cottage, not listed.

[speedbird17]

Hi all, just that really - DH and I are very keen on a mid-1700's cottage we have found, but would like to re-wire and re-plumb ideally - it's not essential but house has not had any attention since early 1950's in either department.

Are we crazy to take this on or will it be a satisfying and fulfilling project. We have estimated work to be done at £20-25k and the vendors have suggested they will accept £10k less than asking price. The house is £25k below our top budget, so at £10k under asking we would have a maximum of £35k to re-wire, re-plumb, new kitchen/bathroom and putting up one stud wall as the stairs open into a 'landing room' and we'd like to use this space as a nursery.

It's not listed so we are free to do what we wish, we are not extravagant and will be happy.with a basic but clean and functioning bathroom and an Ikea sort of Shaker style kitchen (2.8mx2.5m so not big).

Does this sound doable and has anyone else got any experience of doing up a period property to good safe standard but also quite modestly?!

I guess any info at all will be helpful :)

[hangoninaminute]

Go for it! We're doing it now on our 1870 cottage. Expect mess, dust and fun! :-)

[speedbird17]

Oh I was hoping for that answer :) (I am going to ignore the fact we have a 2.8 DD and a DS due in May)

[bilbodog]

I would say go for it - but be prepared for t hings to cost much more than you think. It might depend where you are in the country as to what prices you pay but we've just spent the last 4 years doing up a victorian cottage in buckinghamshire and we've spent over £100K!!! Depends on how much you need to do and if you are able to do much of the work yourselves?
Good Luck.

[bilbodog]

further advice - you could mix Ikea free standing kitchen units with antique/vintage/junk things which can save a lot of money and old furniture always looks good in a cottage.

[speedbird17]

Ahh just lost message!!

We are expecting things to cost more and have added ~20% to each estimate we've been given. We are quite happy to get the wiring, plumbing and replastering out of the way then slowly and surely do everything else. Good tip about the kitchen! We have a sideboard

[speedbird17]

Oops, phone playing up!

Have a sideboard and dresser which we are happy to use for kitchen items, so don't need masses of fitted units, and we have a spare Belfast sink kicking around!

As above not adverse to getting the big jobs out of the way and then doing smaller bits/decorating/rooms one by one.

Quite excited by it all and hope we do get the property. I think although daunting, if we do it it will be such a good feeling!

[speedbird17]

We are in Somerset and have tradesmen in the family who often get us things at trade prices and offer discount/recommend fab but cheap other tradesmen. So anticipate it being toward the cheaper end of the scale (not London prices!!).

[CatsClaus]

i would check, check and check again that it wasn't listed. We looked at a Toll House and the vendors airily assured us it was just the facade that was listed, Estate Agents were also suitably vague

a brief amount of research revealed that it was CatA listed (we're in Scotland)

So you practically need permission to change the loo rolls :) also that the recent modern UPVC windows had been a cash deal, and I scandalised the local Planning Officer with a few queries as he always presumed the house belonged to the next area, what with it being on the river and border between "counties"

The folks that did buy it had a fair amount of dealings with the listing people I believe.

Other than that...Good Luck! :o

[georgeousgeorge]

"Age and rarity: all buildings built before 1700 which survive in anything like their original condition are listed, as are most of those built between 1700 and 1840"

I would 100% check it's not listed!

[speedbird17]

It's not :) we phoned the national listing office and checked as we were v surprised, but it is in a row of 3 and none of them are listed!

Next door was renovated then sold last year and looks lovely!!

[HumphreyCobbler]

I live in a 500 year old house that is not listed, it is certainly possible.

[BoffinMum]

It's actually straightforward but really do your homework and use tradespeople who are used to period properties.

£2000 spent on an architect might be the best money you ever spend with regard to this. It feels a lot but they make sure everything is compliant, and they often know good people you can use for the work.

[speedbird17]

Thanks boffinmum perhaps I am way out of my depth but why would we need an architect if we aren't building anything extra and just replacing existing kitchen/bathroom for new? Is wiring/heating something architects get involved in?

Sorry for my ignorance I just honestly had no idea there was a need for one!

[RaphaellaTheSpanishWaterDog]

Costs definitely creep up. We bought our last house in 2011 (admittedly it was being marketed as an 'unfinished project', although as it was unmortgageable that was an understatement!) and originally budgeted £50-60k to extend, rewire, re plumb and decorate including plastering (walls were mostly exposed stone) and flooring.

In the end we spent in excess of £100k and this figure would have been much higher but we did tons of the work ourselves. Despite being experienced renovators, that house was the biggest moneypit ever - not the largest at 2500 sq ft, just the most problematic.

The old timber sash windows turned out to be beyond saving and just to replace the front - there were seven - cost around £10k as, being anal purists, we wanted painted timber not UPVC.

Oh, and regarding listed buildings - ours was a stone, thatched Georgian house, but not listed.....none of the houses in our vil?age were, even the 400 year old one. Only listed buildings were the pub and shop! We were most surprised as ours and several others were very characterful, but no, not worth listing apparently!

[speedbird17]

Ok, so this little cottage is 725sqft, 6 single sash windows, kitchen is a 2.8mx2.5m lean to type extension with a corrugated roof. Back boiler system currently.

So forgetting all redecoration which we will be happy to do over time, our max budget of 35k may just do rewiring, heating, bathroom and kitchen?

Our current kitchen is 3mx1.9m and the total cost of kitchen inc appliances was just over £3k...

[cooper44]

hello - I've just done exactly the same on you (1800 stone cottage) and pretty much the same budget....although I thought it would be less before I did it. but there were some surprises that I didn't realise until having builders round - like the drainage was totally useless and not really fit for use so I ended up spending quite a lot on things I hadn't anticipated. Inside it was sort of impossible to really see walls because the previous owners had the place jam-packed - but once it was empty it was apparent walls had to be totally stripped back and reboarded, skimmed etc.
can't think of any other shockers apart from vermin nests and all sorts in every wall and crevice/attic etc. oh and rotting windows - some of which I still have to do.
and also what is the cottage made from? having stone walls makes things a bit harder with pipework/electrics etc.
good luck!

[speedbird17]

Thanks cooper that's really helpful! There are birds nests in at least 2 of the chimneys and it is made of stone. We were planning to go right back for re-wiring anyway so had planned for all the chasing out and then re-boarding and plastering already (which fil can do, hopefully at cost of materials plus food)

Really want to see your before and after pics cooper!!

[BoffinMum]

An architect can come in and do a fully costed schedule of repair works for you, make practical suggestions about whether your new upstairs wall is really going to be in the right place, help you decide whether there are any whizzy things worth thinking about in terms of the kitchen and bathroom replacement, check out potential damp with a hand-held damp meter, spot things in terms of damaged window frames and plasterwork and so on that you might have overlooked, that kind of thing. There's a scheme called 'Architect Your Home' that lets you have a couple of hours of time more cheaply without committing to a full on £2000 type thing.

Architect Your Home

I reckon the worst case scenario for this refurb is something like you find a big crack in a major wall once you start fiddling about, and it's coming away from the rest of the house, meaning you suddenly need a load of scaffolding and major works. A good survey before you start will help avoid nasty surprises like that.

It is really helpful you know local people to help out as that will make the project a lot easier.

[FrancesNiadova]

We moved into a very rural, 1700's stone cottage when our youngest was 15m.o.! 11 years later, wiring, windows, plumbing, roof done, we're still doing it up; I don't think that it will ever be done.
I love it here. It's never easy, but it's always beautiful!

[cooper44]

oh yes good point Boffin. Make sure you get a proper building survey done - try and find someone local and recommended. A good surveyor should have a pretty good take on any potential issues.

[lavendersun]

We have spent the last five years pouring money into a 300 year old house.

Prior to that I have renovated an Edwardian, Victorian and Elizabethan house (only the last one was listed). All have gone over budget tbh.

We have spent a lot of money on this house (still spending), more than we will get back when we sell it at present.

We got ripped off with a couple of jobs at the beginning here (new area to us), someone charged me a fortune to overhaul the roof. He had initially said it would be a good week's work for two ... it took them less than a day, he reckoned that they had just cracked on with it and that I had agreed a price for the work - completely ripped off. I had a very ill child in hospital and my husband was away for months so I just paid it because I didn't have the mental energy to argue.

Really overcharged on another electrical job about the same time.

After that I found someone I trusted and even now I source all my tradespeople through this man. I don't even ask him for a price anymore, he tells me when he has finished .

So my one tip would be to make sure you know who you are using for the work, recommendation is best. My two rip offs were from the local town's newspaper, small town, but interestingly I didn't have to tell the person I trust now who had ripped me off, he told me!

[RaphaellaTheSpanishWaterDog]

lavendersun makes a very good point re: getting ripped off. We are also seasoned renovators (Tudor that was dismantled in the '30s and rebuilt elsewhere, several Victorian & Georgian - none listed!) yet have still been victim of rip-off builders. Many people advice steering clear of checkatrade and whilst we've never actually searched there for builders, our three most recently used trusted trades are on checkatrade.

We only found this out after using them.

Previously we also used builders/trades that advertised locally and were based in or close to our vil?age/nearest small town. We were new to the county and had no friends/family there that could recommend. A couple of these were crap and/or charged way too much.

[speedbird17]

So much good advice! We have put our initial offer in today, going to view again with a builder on Monday to see about damp etc and go through our estimates to see if they are as realistic as we think!!

[OliviaBenson]

Careful with getting advice in damp etc- a building of that age works differently to modern buildings- do not go down the route of chemical damp proof courses, cement mortars and moderns plasters- these will cause problems. Plastering and repointing should be in lime and will cost more in that respect.

The SPAB have loads of advice for owners of old buildings (listed or not!)

Good luck with everything- it sounds a really interesting house :-)

[missmargot]

Go for it! We bought our mid 1700s cottage four years ago and although ours is listed which makes everything a bit more complicated we would definitely do it all over again. We aren't finished but got the essentials done pretty quickly and are taking are time over the rest.

I do still shudder at the memory of the plaster dust from the re-wiring though