DS punched in the face at reception today

[slaveofsolitude]

I started this thread a few days ago

//www.mumsnet.com/Talk/primary/1573330-DS-being-repeatedly-hurt-by-another-boy-in-reception-What-to-do

Today DS was punched in the face by the same boy. The teacher really doesn't seem to know what she's doing.

I don't think I can return him to that class now - can I insist that DS is moved to another class? There are 3 reception classes with 30 children in each - so if he moved it would mean one class would have 31 - is that legal?

DS is so sad and keeps sayng he doesn't want to go back to that class (he wants to go back to school though). What an awful start to school for him - I feel devastated.

The other child clearly has some behavioural problems - I just don't believe this is normal for a 4 year old child.

[cutegorilla]

Your poor DS :(. Kick up stink that shouldn't be happening. Do you know if it's just your DS getting the brunt or are other children getting hurt too? The more people complain the more likely they will do something. For the sake of the little boy doing the hurting too. He clearly needs more support than he's getting.

[schmee]

Ask the school how they are going to ensure your child is protected. This is their problem to sort out. Presumably the playground will still be an issue if your child swaps classes even if that is possible?

Put the onus on the school to explain to your child how he is going to be kept safe. I.e. go in with him and ask to speak to the teacher saying "ds is very worried because x punched him in the face. I know you will be able to reassure him that he will be safe in the future".

[BabylonPI]

More than 30 in a reception class isn't legal I'm afraid - complain to governing body if you don't feel teacher/headteacher is handling it adequately.

[Pooka]

I don't think they can have class later than 30 - so changing unlikely to be ossible unless someone swaps. Unlikely, but you never know.

When you say he's been punched in the face, and reading the list of incidents in your ith thread, are these incidents being communicated to you by your ds or by the school? Are they even aware what is happening? Does your ds tell the teacher at the time? Do you have any info about how the class is supervised?

What I'd do next would be informed by the responses to above. If I had no confidence tht the school were keeping my child safe I would go to school on Monday morning and ask to see the head teacher before school. I would want assurances that they are going to be keeping my child safe and actual info on how they would do this, including discussion about moving classes if possible.

[slaveofsolitude]

are these incidents being communicated to you by your ds or by the school?

The bite and the punch by the school (the most serious incidents) - they also reported some shoving and scratching. My son reported the head push (headbutt?) and pinching. He also told me this week the boy got hold of DS' arm and made DS hit himself in the face.


Are they even aware what is happening?

Yes - aware of it all - I've reported everything DS has told me. I've spoken to the teacher about it. This week she told me she felt she "had done everything she could do"!!!!! I sent a note in this week asking that a close eye be kept on them and anything concerning reported to me straight away. We didn't find out about the punch today until pick up (happened earlier in the day, DS had to have a cold compress)!! Why didn't they phone me?? Am so shocked by this, almost more than anything else.

Does your ds tell the teacher at the time?

He says he does but I can't be so sure - but she has seen some of it.

Do you have any info about how the class is supervised?

Teacher, TA and 1 other float person. The biting incident happened at lunch time so don't really know what the set up is then.

If they can't move him, I feel I have no option to take him out of the school. Not prepared to put him back in that class with the boy in question and I have no faith in the teachers ability to deal with it (or the TA who has 18 years experience!).

[Pooka]

I think it's time to talk to the head teacher (unless you have already).

I would be seriously pissed off by this - they are not supervising the kids properly if there are repeated incidents like this and they are aware of them at the time. Your ds deserves to be safe at school and to be protected and the teacher saying there's nothing she can do is awful. :(

If you're not satisfied by the heads response I'd be minded to write to the chair of governing body. lea too, though I don't think that would apply if it's an academy.

Don't know how practicable this is for you - but I'm a SAHM and I think I would be inclined to keep my dc off. I'd also probably be putting my child's name down on waiting lists for other schools just in case.

[Wobblypig]

Surely the your child should not be moved- appears to suggest that he is the problem and being punished. Rather they did to address the behaviour of this troubled , aggressive child. I would be up there every day until I got a result on this and make it clear that you will be escalating the issue unless a resolution is speedy.

[UnexpectedItemInShaggingArea]

So sorry

You need to speak to the head teacher.

I don't see why your DS should move class - he hasn't done anything wrong, the other boy should be inconvenienced!

[defineme]

Head teacher -in my experience channeling your upset rather than your anger is the best strategy-accept nothing less than your child or the other child being moved.
Listen to your instincts-I have heard so many people say they regret not taking their child out sooner in this situation.

[slaveofsolitude]

Thank you all. It's a relief to hear that other people agree this is not tolerable. The teacher's reaction has been almost to "brush it under the carpet" because she doesn't know how to deal with it.

I just don't think I can put him back in the same class as this boy. They wo't move the boy - that requires pro-active management of the issue on their part which I don't think they are currently capable of, if that makes sense (the school is in special measures and being forced into changing into an academy). The boy's mother would also kick up a stink about it I'm sure. To be honest, I'd prefer DS to move to have a sort of fresh start - plus, I have lost faith in this teacher pretty much altogether.

But, from what previous posters have said it is not likely to be an option as all the reception classes are at 30 - so he cant move. Which basically leaves me with no option but to take him out, which is dreadul for him and us in so many ways. But I'm not putting him back in a class with this boy - what if next time he hits him with something that could seriously injure him...scissors or something? Just not taking the risk. Would rather bloody give up work and home school!

If he comes out though we are f*cked - no state schools with spaces (inner London); not religious and would really struggle with private school fees (and they are probably all full anyway).

[Malaleuca]

It is a horrible problem and one which I have experienced as a teacher, where one child had unpredictable and quite violent outbursts of aggression towards other children and staff. The aggressor had a full time aide (he was autistic, dyspraxic, ADHD) but we still could not get on top of the unpredictability. It was improved considerably when a parent complained to the principal, and the school got the services of a specialist to come in and observe the situation. over a few days. This specialist identified triggers and gave good advice on management. The parent who had complained the most did remove the child from the school. Over time the aggressor child's behaviour was managed increasingly effectively, but it was hard on everyone, especially in that first year of his schooling.

It certainly made me think very hard about inclusion!

[LauraSmurf]

If you want my honest honest opinion. Take him out. I am currently teaching a class with a very violent child. He is close to the brining exclusion but not quite there. The children in his year have been suffering his outbursts, disruptions and general stress and anxiety for 6 years.
Now I have a DD of my own and I saw this unfolding in earl school I would moved child. It is so unfair on the rest of the class.

Even if he is moved class he is on th playground, in the year group and may end up in classes together in the future.

In my very honest, but completely against my teaching 'ethics, opinion, I would move schools.

Sorry you are in this position.

[slaveofsolitude]

Thanks all. This is what I'm planning to do:

I have done a chronology of everything that has happened since Day 1. I am going to keep DS off school and phone up and tell them that he being kept off because do not feel he is being kept safe in the classroom and that he will not be returning until my husband and I have met with the Headteacher. I will then ask for the first available appointment.

At the meeting, I am going to explain everything and strongly lobby for DS to be moved into another class. If I don't feel the HT provides a satisfactory response (either allowing a move or some other plan) then I am going to take hm out of the school and will probably write to the Governors about it (cc to Ofsted?).

This is where my plan runs out - Christ only knows what we will do if we take him out. There are so few options available. Cannot believe this is happening :(

[cutegorilla]

Good luck!

[rrbrigi]

I am so sorry to hear what happened to your child. Of course it is not tolerated. If you already spoke to the teacher, head teacher and nothing happened involve the other child parents as well. As you responsible for your child, they are responsible to their child behavior. Probably they are not aware of the situation at all.

In the meantime if I were you and if the communication with the class teacher did not solve the problem, I would go and stay in the school with my child (yes, in the classroom). If the school has any problem with it, I clearly would tell them that they are not doing their job not even in a satisfactory level (keeping my child safe), so I will come and stay every day until they won't solve the problem and I am 100% happy that my child is safe and happy.

I cannot believe these things can happen even in Reception year.

Please do not leave your child alone, your son needs you and you have the right to look after him to make sure he is safe. I think the other child should have a time out from the school, so their parents realize how serious the situation is.

Good luck, and keep us posting.

[NotWilliamBoyd]

Hi OP, how did it go with the school?

[iseenodust]

Having been there with DS and gone all the way through the school's complaints procedure to be fobbed by the HT & chair of govs, I'm sorry to say I would be looking at ways to get him out of there. We let the school have more than a year to put things right (way too long in hindsight) and the number of incidents/injuries just kept growing. Moved DS to another school and from day 1 there were no more tears and we haven't looked back.

[steppemum]

I remember your other thread. You need to phone and ask to speak to head. If she/he is out, say you have an issue with a child safety, and would like to make an appointment to speak to her today.
Write down the incidents. This is VERY IMPORTANT. You need paper trail to prove you are not just moaning. Make a list of dates and inciidents your ds has told you about. Include the times you have spoken to the teacher.

When you see the head, take the approach that you don't want to criticise the other little boy, he is just a kid, BUT your ds is not safe in that class. He is being hurt on a regular basis. You have tried nicely to leave it up to the teacher. This has failed. You now expect the school to take action.

Be very clear. It is up to the school to protect your child. It is not your problem how they do it, or what happens to the other boy, but the school has a safeguarding issue here around your child.

Sorry just seen your last post. Yes you are doing all the right things. Remember that you need to be nice but firm I say that because as soon as you get angry etc they stop listening. be like a broken record. My child is not safe, it is your responsibility to ensure he is safe.
Keep copies of your log, and give school copies. If the head doesn't help, send copies to chair of governors and ask them to take it up with the head.


I know of a couple of kids with sn who can be aggressive in school. Both have 1;1 TA. One of them the TA was asked to do something else and so was not alongside the child. he then bit another child. The parent (of SN child) pointed out that he had a 1;1 for exactly that reason, he was fine a lot of the time, but when he wasn't he needed an adult there close by. The TA has never been called away since!

[steppemum]

one more thought, if you need to speak to teacher again, don't do it on the school gate, I don't think those conversations get taken seriously. Make an appointment, see her in private. It is then more formal and more serious

[FrameyMcFrame]

Good Plan to keep him at home until the situation is resolved to your satisfaction.
Good luck.

[THERhubarb]

They can have children over the 30 limit. Our tiny village school has 32 children in one class. They have to apply to the council but it is possible.

[steppemum]

therhubarb - the legal limit for key stage 1 is 30. they are allowed to go over in keystage 2
If they go over 30 they have to add adults

In mixed classes they can have more, bu the extra adults come in somewhere along the line

[THERhubarb]

This is keystage 1 I am talking about.

The village school has reception, year 1 and year 2 in together. They have 32 children in that class. They got special dispensation from the local council to allow it.

[steppemum]

also (sorry keep thinking of you op and what a worrying situation this is)
they will not discuss the other boy directly with you. Don't expect them too, that is his confidentiality right. They can and should discuss how they will safeguard your child.

[THERhubarb]

OP, if you have to take your son out, then so be it. He's young enough to adapt. They have a responsibility to keep your child safe and they are failing. Huge questions need to be asked and you would be within your rights to mention this to the Education Dept of your local council. With your boy gone, it's only a matter of time before another child becomes victim to this aggressive behaviour.

He may well have special needs but in that case there should be a specialist TA with him. The fact that he has special needs does not overrule your son's rights to be educated in safety.