Please, please, please help me

[houndsoflove]

I've posted before that I was concerned that I was developing agoraphobia - I sort help from my GP and am awaiting a CBT assessment in a few weeks. Sadly, despite repeated efforts to get out of the house every day - even if its just a short walk to the park or shops - I am now making myself effectively housebound. This has all happened in such a short space of time (4 - 8 weeks) that I'm terrified that eventually my life will shrink to the size of a fucking walnut.
I have coping techniques for panic attacks including breathing control/paper bag/ rescue remedy but now I'm suffering from 'fear of the fear' IFYSWIM - I now hate going out in case i have a panic attack with my 18 month old DD, and I am TERRIFIED of passing out or losing it when I'm responsible for her.
Is this symptomatic of PND ? GP tried to diagnose me with it recently but I was unconvinced - this was before all this happened.
Please help me leave the fucking flat. I hate feeling like this and am starting to think a life lived confined isn't worth living at all - I am OBSESSED with this disorder, and going out or not going out are all I think about, without exception.
I need to go to town to get some things and I can't face the crowds, the shops, the distance from home. I can't go with DD and I can't go without her. I can barely wobble to the fucking park and I feel that she is suffering as I am, being indoors all the time. Up until recently we would go out all day every day to groups or the beach. At the moment we just play together in the lounge. How has this happened ? i used to be super confident!
I'm due to have a Hypnotherapy appointment on Wednesday -anyone had experience of Hypnotherapy for panic or anxiety disorders ? If it doesn't work I'm fucked.

[BeckyBendyLegs]

So sorry you are going through this. I don't have any experience of agoraphobia but I wonder have you had any / many panic attacks while out? If you are scared of what could happen, what has happened that has been so awful? What is the worst thing, in your mind, that could happen to you if you go out?

I've had hypnotherapy in the past, my mum is actually a hypnotherapist, and I think it is marvelous stuff. It has really helped me with anxiety and insomnia related to the anxiety.

[madmouse]

Ok this is going to sound so helpful but.....calm down!

It's been going on for a few weeks you say, so you're not about to spend your whole life this way. Stop thinking thoughts like 'a life confined is not worth living'. Just yell stop to yourself every time they appear. Don't let that idea add to your panic.

It is possible to have pnd at 18 months but normally it would have happened earlier. here is a pnd test that you can do for yourself. A score significantly over 10 would suggest pnd.

Your 18 month old is not suffering like you are so stop beating yourself up about that. You wouldn't go to the beach in December anyhow and by spring you'll be much better.

It's very common to be worried about passing out in public, and in charge of your child, but I assume she would be in a buggy, so she won't fall. Passing out is quite rare and you would be round again in seconds (your body uses it as a reboot trick if you start hyperventilating too much, a paper bag or holding your breath should prevent you passing out). Don't make it bigger than it is .

In short you are catastrophising what is happening. Always and never are very unhelpful words. There is at least one poster on here who has benefited from hypnotherapy for anxiety. Give it a go!

[madmouse]

Ah I see the poster who had hypno types quicker than me - hi Becky

[BeckyBendyLegs]

Hi madmouse! Wise words from you too - I know all about catastrophizing, it never, ever helps and actually just serves to make you feel much worse. It is hard work to catastrophize, it is much easier to say to yourself 'what is the worst that can happen? It probably won't happen, I may as well just take the chance and see and if it doesn't happen I will feel wonderful about it and if it does, I won't die, nobody will die, I'll get through it because I have done before.'

By the way houndsoflove I'm very jealous you live by the sea.

[schobe]

Am in a rush so just a quick one but you've reached a point where thinking about going to the park or town is just too much.

You need to scale right back and start by taking a toy just outside the front door of your flat with your DD. Even if you stay there for 10 seconds, that's a start. Then you can work up at your own pace.

I'm being way too simplistic, but you need to start by taking the pressure right off and taking tiny steps.

[NanaNina]

Agree with all the posters (I have a history of catastrophising too) but I think schobe has a really good idea - baby steps - as with most things that scare us. Going from not getting out of the flat to going into town with the christmas shopping crowds is not the way to go............you need to do as schobe suggests and then a little further each day, even if only a few steps more, and then maybe to a nearby shop, or to put you in control you could think "just as far as the next lamp post" - it doesn't matter how few steps you take -you will be out of the flat even for a very short time.

Have you got an H or P or anyone in RL who knows about your difficulties and could accompany you on a few very short trips. Do you know what brought this on as it sounds as though it is quite a ecent event. It doesn't sound like you are depressed but you are certainly very anxious, so it might be worth a visit to the GP, to get some advice. Anxiety is the medical word for fear and panic is fear +++++ Glad you have the hypnotherapy appt on Wed. But you are not "fucked if it doesn't work" - there are many other things to try. Youreally really must stop thinking the worse and I know how easy it is to say that when I do the same thing, but know that it just makes everything worse.

See if you can take the toy outside the front (or back door) of your flat and stay outside for 10 seconds with your little girl and come and tell us if you managed it.

[houndsoflove]

Thanks for your responses, all - I'm aware I sound highly dramatic and I am guilty of over-thinking things, so it helps to have the finer points of this put into perspective, thank you!
Being afraid to go out is so alien to me - I've traveled the world and lived abroad briefly, and I think part of it is that I feel the responsibility of DD weighs on me quite heavily, certainly disproportionately. That PND test was very useful madmouse, the score has changed since I spoke to my GP so will revisit.
BeckyBL Brilliant to hear that hypnotherapy has worked for you - what a marvelous occupation your mum has! I'm really looking forward to it, and looking forward to having some new coping strategies. I have two sessions booked so will see how I get on. You asked me about the roots of my fear ? I think it is essentially fear of loss of control and passing out with DD - a while ago now I had two Grand Mal seizures, both on busy streets, both completely out-of-the-blue. I woke up in an ambulance both times, assuming a member of the public looked after me. I was very frightening and neuro and epilepsy tests revealed nothing wrong with me - however I was partying quite hard at the time, living wild and getting very drunk very often so I've always thought that may have been the case - its certainly the complete oppostie of me now. Now I drink shandy.

madmouse have never heard of 'catastrophising' before - it is EXACTLY what I'm doing isn't it ? A lot of fear stems from anticipation and projection about leaving the house before I've even showered in the morning. I usually tend to lean more toward positive thinking than I am seeming to in the OP, but the depth of this I'm really struggling with. Your post made me feel lots better, thank you!

schobe that was what I was trying to do this week - take DD out a little further each day - and I managed it up until yesterday when the thought of all the Christmas shoppers in town overwhelmed me so much I couldn't go. And it was that setback that triggered the spiral of self-doubt despite the fact I'd done relatively well all week. I'm just sick of struggling to go to the library, or wanting to leave somewhere as soon as I arrive. But it's baby steps, you're right.

[Antidote]

Something very positive to remember is that anxiety disorders like this are very responsive to treatment, especially if the history is short. The fact it has come on fast is a very good sign.

Agree with the poster who suggested baby steps, not going for broke with the shops.

There are self-help tutorials on the web for anxiety, I think it is called "fear fighter". Am on mobile so can't link.

Good luck.

[Antidote]

www.llttf.com/index.php?section=page&page_seq=8

Might be worth a look.

[flakemum]

Try to remember however bad it feels now its not forever its a blip it will pass. Im sure Hypnotherapy will help you sort it out. Good luck be kind to yourself be your own best friend don't push too hard too fast wait till you feel a bit better before challenging yourself.

[houndsoflove]

X posted with you there Nana & Flakemum - I did take DD out this afternoon just to the park and back to look at the Christmas decorations and fairy lights etc - it does get easier the longer I remain outside, it's just gritting my teeth against the initial fear is so draining!
The agoraphobia has come on suddenly but I do have a history of panic attacks - for which I had counseling and have been successfully managing up until recently. I think thats why I feel so low - because it feels like a regression.
I'm hoping I can get the CBT fairly soon as well - I've read very positive outcomes in cases like this.

Tomorrow I'm hoping to take DD to a toddler group about a ten minute walk away. Will have to see how she sleeps tonight though - she still wakes three or four times a night so I am battling tiredness and broken sleep since she was born - I imagine that is making me quite fragile too!

Antidote I've just had a look at that link - their Panic Attack booklet is very reassuring - apparently adrenaline runs out after 30 minutes anyway so your body couldn't sustain panic beyond that, which is very useful to know.

[JanetPlanet]

www.ocdonline.com/articlephillipson3.php

This might help. I know you didn't say OCD but i thought I'd post anyways

[NanaNina]

Houndsoflove - so pleased you have been to the park (and here we were talking about 10 secs outside of your door!) I think the trouble with any kind of mental illness is that recovery is not linear but is usually subject to ups and downs, and that in itself causes us so much distress. Physical illnesses tend not to be the same do they, though I know you can have relapses with some physical illnesses.

Hope the toddler group goes well. I think the tiredness is exacerbating your anxiety (3 or 4 times a night is a lot) my gr/dghtr was doing this up until she was turned 2 whereas the first one had slept through from 12 weeks. Just the luck of the drawer I think. It will of course pass......

[BeckyBendyLegs]

NanaNina that is sooo true (that recovery is not linear) and it is so easy to be disheartened if after a run of goods, there's a 'bad' but houndsoflove you should try not to let a bad day set you back, recovery does go in a wave formation, two steps forward, one back, three forward, maybe two back, one forward, etc.

Lack of sleep will of course make you more fragile. I hope you feel bright enough today to make it to toddler group :) but if you don't, it's no biggie, there is always the next day and the next, etc.

[houndsoflove]

Morning! Terrible night last night - DD was awake from 3.00-5.30am having a good whinge - think maybe molars are making their presence felt. Feel as though I could brave toddler group today but it starts in an hour and we have ony just woken up so think will skip it. I desperately need some stuff from the shops although may wait until after I've had Hypnotherpay on Wednesday when I may feel more prepared to face it IFYSWIM ?
Nana & Becky Thanks for the reassurance, its good to know that I will have strong days again and not just a series of progressively weaker ones. And you're right, if I don't it's no biggie, I need to stop agonising over my limitations.

Incidentally Becky its lovely to live by the sea, you're right, but as I come from Cornwall with 'proper' beaches (craggy, looming cliffs, powdery sand) and I'm now living in a seaside 'resort' its a bit different. Trashy and really tacky and pebbly.

[NanaNina]

Oh HofL - sorry you had bad night again with your LO - are you a single parent btw, if you don't mind my asking. Try to get out for a little while later (not something that is an ordeal) but just a walk as far as you can manage - with you controlling how far you can go - even if it is 5 mins that's better than nothing. Does your LO sleep in the day, if so , can you nod off on the sofa for a while. I hope you find the hypnotherapy useful but I wouldn't have thought it was a cure-all and I'm just warning that if you don't feel as you want to after the session, try not to go into a downward spiral.

I know nothing of hypnotherapy (although a friend did it to stop smoking) and it worked for her, although she did start again about a year later, so will be interested to see how you get on.

Ooh loved your phrase "stop agonising over my limitations" - I must remember that one. I'm very good at giving advice but can't always follow it myself - part of the human condition i think.

[houndsoflove]

Well we made it to the park for an hour this afternoon - it was freezing! I was so tired i couldn't see straight and just about managed to keep the panic to a low rumble.
DD does sleep in the day Nana and I try to have a siesta with her when I can, just to recharge - and I do have a DP but he works full time and while he is lovely and very practical he is emotionally quite barren and doesn't understand what I'm going through. If it does not compute he can't quite grasp it unfortunately, so I don't communicate too much about it. Funnily enough I spoke with my mum this afternoon and it turns out both her mother and my father are agoraphobic - my grandmother severely so - and while I have no recollection of this from her I wondered if it may be genetic ?

I do know what you mean about the hypnotherapy and am not pinnig my hopes on just breezing out of the session fully recovered but even some improvement is some improvement to how I feel now. I'd have a lobotomy if I thought it would make the fear chip off.

[NanaNina]

Oh well done hoflove - an hour in the cold of today would be a challenge for anyone who wasn't having the sort of difficulties that you are experiencing. No wonder that you were tired - relentless broken nights are no joke. Glad you have a DH - could he not take a turn with DD sometimes in the night - I know he has work but then so do you, because you have to look after DD all day and if that isn't work I don't know what is! I think may men don't understand our emotional needs, but I don't think that should stop you from talking to him about how you feel - even if he doesn't understand he might be able to be more supportive. Could he not get up in the morning with DD at the weekends to give you a chance for a bit more sleep. I might be wrong but it does sound a bit like you are being a martyr, and keeping all these worries to yourself is hard on you.

I have no idea whether agrophobia is genetic - but it is a condition that responds very well to psychological intervention. I have just looked back at your OP and see you are waiting for CBT and hope that is helpful.

You are taking bigger strides than baby steps...........so congratulate yourself and it won't always be winter and you won't always be tired......honest.

[BeckyBendyLegs]

Hi houndsoflove well done for making it out to the park :)

[jomal]

Hi houndsoflove, you're making huge inroads in a short space of time. I've posted on other threads about it but the linden method would help you with this quickly. Look at the website and then google charles linden on youtube , especially have a look at the video where he's doing a presentation to medics about the linden method . PM me if you want an y more info - it worked so well with my daughter and so quickly that I just feel I have to spread the word about it

[madmouse]

jomal not everyone is convinced of that and I'm not sure you should be posting this advertising on every single thread even though you claim to have no stake in the company.

[NanaNina]

I agree with Madmouse, that the Linden method may not suit everyone. My niece bought all the books/videos etc but she wasn't that impressed with it. I suppose if something works for you, it is tempting to think it will work for everyone and jomal I am sure you are just wanting to pass on something that worked for your daughter, but I don't think it's helpful to be so sure that it will have the same effect on everyone. In fact I think this is potentially quite dangerous because when we are rock bottom we are very susceptible to what others say, and someone reading your posts and not getting any benefit from the method, could think that it was their fault for not "getting it" or think themselves inferior.

Those of us who suffer from mental illness know that there is no "one size fits all" either in counselling/therapy/medication, and what suits one person may do nothing for the next person. Sometimes meds that were very beneficial in one episode of depression may be ineffective in a future episode.

Anyway how are you today HoundsofLove

[houndsoflove]

Well we went to the local shops and park today - I had another bad night with DD - she tends to do this when she is teething so I'm just going with the flow at the moment.

Was planning on getting a taxi to the library in town but we were both cranky from the cold and lack of sleep so ended up indoors painting and making cotton wool snowmen. Part of the problem for me is that town is a twenty five minute walk away and the buses are slow at the moment as they are digging the road up - I've had numerous panic attacks en route to town and so view it as 'hazardous' and currently have an almost complete mental block on getting down there.
Had hoped taxi may make it easier but by the time I'd got us both ready was so giddy and washed out with anticipatory anxiety that we didn't go :(

I'm going to mention this to the hypnotherapist tomorrow and see if we can work on that as well as my 'fear of fear' - I'm hoping she'll give me a trigger to use (thumb and forefinger pressed together or something) if I feel panic coming on. I seem to live in a perpetual state of high anxiety and have noticed an ache in my kidneys recently - apparently this is where your adrenal glands are located. Who knew ? Not me. I thought they were in my neck, for some reason. Little buggers, I wish they'd give me a break.

[NanaNina]

More progress HofL - shops and park, even though you were sleep deprived. Painting and making cotton wool snowmen sounds lovely (hope you got a bit of a doze on the sofa) will your LO watch a bit of TV so you can at least lie quietly for a while.

Town is the big ordeal at the moment, so why keep trying to push yourself to go - is it essential. The fact that you have had so many panic attacks en route to town is obviously going to make you extremely apprehensive to say the least. You will be expecting to have one and the giddiness is a sure symptom of anxiety. I know so well that feeling "fear of fear" which a lot of the medics I have been in contact with don't seem to understand. They have said to me "but what are you afraid of" and sometimes I have thought it would be easy to say spiders, or something rational but that wouldn't be true.

A very wise conslt psych back in 1995 when I had my first serious episode of depression told me not to do anything that was an ordeal and it was good advice.

Be interested to hear how you get on with your hynotherapist tomorrow.

[houndsoflove]

Hi Nana,thanks so much for all your support, it's good to know someone knows how it feels to be afraid of being afraid.
Really tired today - DD was awake three times in the night so I've only had four or five hours of broken sleep. She looks awful today and I look like a four thousand year old Keith Richards. Taking it easy today to say the least. Baking a cake and tidying the house slowly. The thing with nighttimes - and I am a martyr to DD, you were right there - is that she is still BF and wakes once or twice a night for a feed - more if she's teething. As she was EBF for the first six months I have done all the night wakings with her, and all the ones afterward as she wouldn't settle for anyone but me and I was too tired to implement any sleep training. DP and I have discussed it and we're going to nightwean once he has finished work over Christmas - it won't be pleasant but will hopefully give me a bit of a break. I just have to tough it out for twom more weeks.

I sound really fixated on getting to town don't I ? Truth is, I hate town, hate it. It is a byword for hell as far as I am concerned, with the shopping centre and the crowds and the people in general. But there is a lovely library which, up until a couple of weeks ago, DD and I would go to and hang out - and I'd take her for a hot chocolate as a treat once a week as well. I have a few things to do there too - I'm slowly running out of toiletries and need to pick up reserved books from the library - also need to do a few Christmassy bits. Plus part of me feels that the longer I avoid going there the harder I will find it in the future.