To not have this child over anymore?

[letsblowthistacostand]

I have been thinking about this a lot and would like to get some other opinions. I have 2 DDs, 6yo & 4yo. DD6 has a friend who is creative, clever and interesting. She can be really good fun to have around as she is interested in everything. However, she and DD6 sometimes torment DD4--not just teasing, they scream at her and throw things (friend is quite inventive with her tortures).

DD6 does not behave this way when friend isn't around. With other friends, they either ignore DD4 or do much more mild teasing or chase games (sometimes they even all play together!) DD6 & DD4 squabble plenty, neither is an angel but friend just seems to add an element of meanness to the equation.

I have spoken to friend's dad (main carer) and he is of the opinion that although tormenting younger siblings is not acceptable and children must be told off for it, there is no way to stop it happening as it is a natural part of family life. I agree with this to an extent but there is a level of unkindness that was never there in my own family, and that DD6 does not have when friend is not there. I have spoken to and sanctioned DD6 many times for this behaviour but it just doesn't stop.

So AIBU to just not have friend over again? Her dad thinks I am--he seems to think that it's DD4's lot in life to put up with it (he has seen DD6 & friend at their worst). I think she shouldn't have to.

[SarkyWench]

I would allow her round but say to both girls that if they are mean to your dd2 then the friend will have to go home immediately, and your dd1 will have some suitable punishment.

But emphasize to your dd1 that it is her responsibility to make sure that they both behave and to not allow her friend to be mean to her sister. You can't punish/discipline her friend but you can make it very clear to both your girls that you won't tolerate this.

[cosysocks]

If they want to play together and her dad has that attitude I would allow your dd to go to her house, but not let a child come into my house and bully my child.

[RuleBritannia]

I agree with SarkyWench

[seeker]

Why don't you just stop the girls being horrible to you 4 year old?

[baffled emoticon]

[WorraLiberty]

Totally agree with Sarky

[dillnameddog]

I agree with sarkywench too. I struggle with this as well, but it is a bit more equal.

[seeker]

" You can't punish/discipline her friend"

Why on earth not?

[Pandemoniaa]

You don't ban the child coming over but you do send her home at the first sign of any tormenting. It's not fair on your younger dd to have to deal with this. Sibling squabbles are one thing, this sounds like thoroughly nasty behaviour.

[Groovee]

Have you told the "friend" off. I did that and it soon stopped

[boredandrestless]

If a child were in my house being unkind I would tell them off. They are in your care.

I would have her round once more but warn older dd and her friend thatany unkindness towards younger dd would result in you calling friend's dad to take her home.

[hattifattner]

My sons friend did this with younger ds. I pulled them both (DS1 and friend) in and told them if there was another incident, friend would go home immediately and NEVER be allowed back to play. Plus dad would be told why.

It was enough to stop the taunting. I obviously gave them a hard stare and had my most serious grump face on.

[botoxschmotox]

Sisters can be nightmarish to each other, however DD4 will absolutely not have the mechanisms to stand up for herself to two bigger girls. I wouldn't have it under any circumstances and would make sure DD6 understood this. Therefore I might allow one more opportunity for the girls to redeem themselves, but I'd spell it out very clearly what the situation would be if there is a repeat of past behaviours (in 6 year old language obv). If they didn't change their attitude to DD4 after this, I'm afraid I would bring the playdate to an abrupt end and let the father of the friend know that in your opinion there are a lot of ways to 'stop it happening', and not having his daughter round again is one of them.

[letsblowthistacostand]

Have told friend off many times. They are very sneaky, I can't leave DD4 alone for a minute or they're on to her. It has gotten to the point where I really don't want the 3 girls to be together at all but friend's dad thinks AIBU (we have spent time with the whole family, DH & friend's dad like hanging out.)

Thanks for the opinions, I really think it is damaging for DD4 to be treated like this but it has been suggested that I am coddling her too much.

[bigTillyMint]

I agree, just tell them both to stop (in no uncertain terms!) - ask them why they are doing it and say DD doesn't usually do this, so why are you doing it today.....

Having said that, are you sure your younger DD isn't being a pain - trying to join in when they don't want her to, etc? Make sure your older DD knows to come and tell you immediately if the younger one is getting on their nerves, so that you can sort it out.

[anklebitersmum]

YANBU.

If I were in your shoes I would explain to DD6 that her friend can not come over for a week because the two of them were mean to DD4 and that's not how we behave in this house.

After the week (or so) I would give DD6 a brief as regards behaviour and offer her the opportunity to prove that she and her friend can behave and play nicely with DD4, making it clear that any mis-behaviour will lead to double the initial ban.

The trick here is to convince DD6 that this is about her conduct and so that is why it is up to her to stop or report to you any bad beahiour towards DD4 because otherwise she gets punished-because DD4 is her sister and we have to be nice to our family because that's the rules.

We do this in our house even when you want to tie the offending child to the nearest chair Victor Meldrew style we maintain the 'your sister/brother, your family, your responsibility to enforce niceness'.

[bigTillyMint]

Don't expect them to play with your younger DD - she needs to be apart from them, doing something else. No children like to have to accommodate a younger sibling when they have a friend round.

[SarkyWench]

And I think that the key point is that while it is to some point inevitable that your younger DD will have to put up with some meaness from her sister, it is hugeyl important that she knows that you don't think that this is acceptable.

[Bluebell99]

I had a similar situation when my children were a similar age. Ds's friend would tell my DS to do things to his sister, and I watched him through the window hiding something of hers that I would never have found if I hadn't seem him do it. I stopped having that child round to play and the friendship dwindled. I have no idea why that child took against my dd but I am very wary of a child who is that mean and sneaky but well behaved to your face.

[girlsofsummer]

I agree you should be talking very sternly to your DD1 and putting some responsibility on to look out for her sister. I would come down like a tonne of bricks at nastiness and tell her she can?t play with her friend if she is going to be like that.

Siblings should stick together I had lots of moments of anger and jealousy with my younger sister (similar age gap) but woe betide anyone outside the family who dared to pick on her. My loyalty always switched to her at that point. This dynamic is not right and I would be nipping it in the bud.

[all4u]

Excellent reply from sarkywench above! I have two strong willed DS and DD and they have always known that I mean what I say no messing! However they are encouraged to negotiate and argue their case and we can come to an agreement - I loathed my parents simply laying down the law arbitrarily and using violence when I tried to argue and vowed never to do that to mine! If they are clever they will understand if dim KISS
Learning to like abusing power is not good so stick to your instincts here - if DD6 is easily led by her friend that too will have to be tackled if she is not to get into big trouble as a teen :)

[keepcalmandeatcupcakes]

If its that bad that you cannot leave your DD4 alone , I would not allow her back into the house, and would explain to your daughter and the friend ( if she came to the front door asking to come and play) why. Tough if the father thinks she should put up with it - its your house - your rules!!!! What a lovely mum you are to stick up for DD4 and not allow her back :)

[girlsofsummer]

If your DD1 is normally nice and caring to her sister that is a beautiful quality to be preserved and encouraged. You need to sit with your DD1 and explain to her that anybody who tries to poison her relationship with her sister is wrong. Ask her how she would feel if she was in her sister?s shoes and if she would like someone to do it to her. And explain that when friends ask her to do things she is uncomfortable with she needs to be able to say No. That?s the real issue here your DD1?s confidence to stand by her own convictions. If she can do this then it doesn?t matter who she is friends with.

(I have two girls by the way and am middle child of 6)

[Viviennemary]

I'm afraid I would give a final warning and if the very bad behaviour continues then I would say that this girl could not come round to your house for the time being. As you are sorry but this constant teasing and being horrible is just simply not acceptable and if they can't stop it then the friend can't come round until you can be sure the behaviour won't happen. Why should your little DD have to put up with this.

[letsblowthistacostand]

I do try to stress the importance of their relationship to both of them but I will do more to reinforce it with DD6. DD4 doesn't try to play with them (she's a quick learner!) but if I leave her alone at all they will call her to come upstairs or they will run down and do something unpleasant. Think I will just stop having her over.

[AKMD]

YANBU. Your primary duty is to ensure your DDs' safety and if that can only happen by this friend not coming over then that's what I'd do. Anything else is very unfair on your younger DD, who cannot be safe in her own home. Maybe one final warning and that would be it.