Worsening relations with Employer - Advice required

[Varanasi]

Hi,

I work in the IT industry and I have just appealed against a decision refusing my part time working request where no sensible reasons where given (ie employer just copied reasons from website without explanation). ACAS pointed out this is totally unacceptable. However in my appeal meeting I asked my employer what he thought of my appeal document and he refused to answer!!! I had thought the appeal meeting was meant to allow me to challenge my Company's objections to my part time working request but they clearly don't see things the same way.

I am asking for just a tiny bit of flexibility that I feel I can show is justified.

Not only that but my employer is implying that I will have to travel up North more often that I used to. They keep saying I was 'lucky' not to have had many overnight stays in the past. However the real truth is that when I took the job there was a dedicated team up North which appears to have slowly disintegrated. However this didn't affect me. All of a sudden now I want to come back after having a baby my employer is desparate to make the point that I need to be aware of the fact that I may be required to work weeks on end in a location where I am enforced to stay overnight. This seems incredibly harsh considering I never used to do that and considering that last year my boss told me 'he would make every effort to reintegrate me into the workplace'... I was even told that I should expect that the very first job I work on may require overnight travel...

I can understand of course that my Company's situation may have changed since I went on leave but I see this tactic of making overnight travel such an issue (when I hardly ever had to do any in the past) as a bullying tactic to try and getting me to resign. At the appeal meeting they actually refused to talk about my appeal document or even a role change I'd requested previously (as an alternative) and just kept pushing me with this travel issue...

Its making my life a nightmare. I want to get another job but haven't started a search because I honestly didn't think my work would be this difficult with me as they indicated last year that they would be accommodating. The situtaion obviously has changed and it is pretty clear to me they don't want me back and I am upset that they are not being upfront with me....

This has had me in tears... It may be that my employer is calling my bluff and will back down but in the meantime they have really hurt me and causing me to feel really depressed as I cannot afford not to go back to work and I feel that they don't really want me back. It looks as if they are going to decline my appeal but then surely at the appeal meeting they should have at least been prepared to offer their opinions on my appeal. I personally suspect that they just want to exploit what they see as my weak spot (ie change in circumstances) and try to convince me to resign.

I am planning on seeing an employment law specialist at some stage on this as I don't feel I can let my Employer get away with the way I am being treated as it is starting to make me feel ill. At the very least I feel my Employer must be upfront with me and offer his opinions and explain the difficulties he has accommodating my circumstances. But I keep hitting a brick wall. I have found that there are still avenues to explore so we'll see....

I am still awaiting the result of the appeal but given that my employer refused to discuss my appeal document in the meeting I feel I should preempt a second refusal. Any advice on what I can say to my employer to try to be just a little bit more accommodating. I have done everything ie offered a trial period, offered to be negotiable on my exact start date, offered to change my role but still nothing back at all!!!

[avenanap]

Hi, I'm so sorry you are having these problems, I don't think employers want women working for them after they have children and it's such a waste of experience and talent. Your employer can only refuse you the right to flexible working/part time working if it affects the business. I would phone the equal opportunities commission as this sounds like a sex discrimination problem. It can be classed as constructive dismissal if they have made your job so intolerable that you are forced to leave. This sounds like youre going to have to take this further. Employment tribunals can get very messy and they always recommend that you follow the company's grievence procedured first. The equal opportunities commission have an advice line and can even represent you if they feel that your case can be used as a land mark case. Good luck.

[flowerybeanbag]

varanasi not sure there is anything you can do pending hearing the result of your appeal.

Were there any aspects of how your request was handled where your employer didn't follow the required process? This is a lengthy link, but have a read through it all with a fine tooth comb. If your appeal is refused and you have to put in a grievance, it is meatier if you can point out that they haven't followed the required procedure, as well as challenging the substance of their decision. For example check carefully the timings they have to follow. Check the list of business reasons that are allowed, not only do they have to give at least one of a set list, but they also have to explain why said reason applies in your case.

If you have offered trial period and/or compromise arrangements as well it will be difficult for them to refuse it. Don't assume that not being given an indication at your appeal meeting is bad news - it may well be that your employer was taking or planning to take legal advice as to their position and didn't want to say anything ahead of that.

If they do refuse your appeal you can either give up and look for another job, or you can bring a grievance. There is no shame in walking away if that is the best decision for you. It is important some people take these things 'all the way', that's how the law evolves, but you should not feel any personal sense of responsibility to do that if it's not the right thing for you. It will be stressful and time consuming, although there is lots of support here and elsewhere if you choose to do that.

I would spend a few days reading through the link I've posted, getting things clear in your head, waiting for their response. It may well be as I say that they are taking advice themselves, it's not necessarily negative that you haven't been given an indication. Once you've heard back, post again if you would like to.

[Varanasi]

Hi Flowerybeanbag and avenanap,

I will definitely look at the BERR link closely.

I have spoken to ACAS and they told me that my employer has broken procedure by not providing any explanations to why my application was rejected. They have refused (so far) to correct this mistake even though I have pointed it out to them. However it is true they may be calling my bluff (since they know they were in the wrong)...

I will let you know on the outcome.

Thanks

[Judy1234]

Yes, all those things. Also if they really want good staff employers genuinely do all they can to keep them. They just don't want to lose good people so they're shooting themselves in the foot doing this to you.

Mind you a night in a hotel without the baby from time to time is a wonderful luxury. May be you could look on the working away as a plus point and leave the child's father to do a few bed times and get some wonderful sleep.

[googler]

I'm really sorry you are having these problems, I would seek the advice of an employment lawyer asap. I once had a terrible situation where one of my employers (I have two part time jobs) a large University was basically making me work double my contracted hours, not only did I not want to but they were not paying either. I know my situation is different, but I happened to meet an employment lawyer at a dinner party after and he said, the big mistake is that people take their companies on by themselves, a lawyer can check over wording appeals etc.
I hope you can get it sorted out!

[Varanasi]

There has been a new development in my 'Right to request Flexible time' case. Since an awful appeal meeting where I was told by my Employer that I could possibly face having to be stationed up North for weeks on end ie Selby even on my first assignment (even though I have never had to do this type of travel in the past). In addition to this he kept making statements such as 'You have a child, thats your problem. Its not ours' and 'If you were saying you planned to come back to the same role and just as prepared to commute anywhere in the country then we'd have something to discuss'! I have these comments on tape!

Anyway I explained to my employer in no uncertain terms that on my return to work in March that I expected a suitable role to be found for me. I explained I was prepared to commute but to be posted in Selby for weeks on end indefinitely was unacceptable. I have also now said that forcing me to travel somewhere I can't commute to would effectively be blocking my return.

After I sent an e-mail clarifying my position HR phoned me to tell me she had been surprised by this (????) She let slip that a letter had been sent in the post and that it had been scrapped and now they were reconsidering...

My belief is that my employer felt forced to scrap a letter because they are starting to worry about a Constructive Dismissal claim.

The situation has become so convoluted and so unacceptable that I spoke to a Employment Specialist today. I was told that I may have a good case under both Constructive Dismissal and Sex Descrimination acts. Hurrah! Obviously just one opinion but he was very certain that my Employer has broken the law. He claimed that I should be able to do most of the leg work myself too.

Solicitor claimed I can argue that the Flexi Work Process has been used to try and enforce my resignation. He reckoned I should claim even if my Flexi Work Request is accepted ie result of request has now become immaterial.

However to claim Constructive Dismissal I need to resign which means potential loss of earnings so Im scared now... However my Solicitor argues that I cannot return as it clear that there is actually no role for me to return to really and I may be forced up to Selby, Newcastle etc at some stage for an indefinite amount of time (not exaggerating, could be indefinite).

I have actually now spent time analysing what was said in the Appeal Meeting and whichever way you look at it my Company would rather I resigned... I was bombarded with questions on whether it was ok to commute for 2.5 hours each way, start at 7am etc, go to Newcastle knowing I'd be there for weeks on end etc.. I was also told that there were a lack of jobs for me to do but at the same time when I said I wanted to change my role I was simply asked whether this meant that I was not committed to Consultancy!!!! The meeting left me in a state of shock.

I think on reflection I am going to take my Solictors advice and lodge a grieveance regardless of the outcome but I will wait for the letter first. Even if I get an acceptance letter it will simply because the Employer has realised that they are behaving unlawfully.... So it changes nothing.

I have nothing to lose with this win or lose. I don't think I can go back so I will lose my earnings anyway... However I'll get second and third opinions before handing in my resignation.

[llareggub]

Think very carefully before resigning. Constructive dismissal is very hard to prove. Did your employer hint at any other avenues?

[Coachbeth]

I agree that constructive dismissal is very difficult to prove. I think you're solitictor is right in that they has acted un-lawfully in regards to the Sex Discrimination Act. The key is to make sure you have good legal advice.

Another option is to get a pay-off from the company - the danger in this is that you might get alot more if it goes to tribunal. The benefit is that it will save you months of grief and you should have some money to sort you out untill you find another job. I'm not sure how you could suggest this - employers can do it but have to be careful about how they suggest it so they could have dropped some hints at the meeting.

[Varanasi]

Yes true - I would only do so if I can also claim under sex discrimination. On its own constructive dismissal doesn't appear that attractive an option.... I do have a sex discrimination case too apparentely so I think the Solicitor feels I must make a joint claim. However I will certainly not resign unless I get a lot more advice!

Its early days and a messy situation but hopefully sounds as if I can do something.

Certainly if my employer had hinted at other avenues things wouldn't be like this. In fact I have hinted at other avenues myself and I have been ridiculed for doing so! I even wrote a document full of project proposals which the Company requested and then refused to give feedback.