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Chat with other users about all things related to working life on our Work forum.

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are my employers in the wrong??

101 replies

Weenie1 · 22/11/2013 21:29

Before i booked our family holiday in feb this yr i filled im my daughters holiday form and asked my employer if i also needed to fill a form in for holiday leave. was informed No i did not need to, to then in april of this yr be asked to fill one in after i had booked and paid for my holiday, request for leave was declined but i went on holiday anyway. IM now having to have a disciplinary hearing for unauthorised absense from work which is classed a misconduct. My question is this i am being punished for taking leave but other work collegues have taken time off also and are not going through the same process, and it states in all our work contracts we are not allowed to take holidays during school term time as we are dinner ladies, so why am i having a disciplnary hearing and no others?? can my employers do this?

OP posts:

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VerySmallSqueak · 22/11/2013 22:15

Please do join your union Weenie!

They will not be able to act for you in this case however as you are already 'in dispute'.

Weenie1 · 22/11/2013 22:16

will i be able to join my works union even at this stage?

OP posts:

GlaikitOfGallifrey · 22/11/2013 22:22

If your contract says no holidays in term time, then that is what you should expect. If others have been given holidays during term time that is their issue not yours. The reasons do not have to be disclosed to you.

I think you need to forget about what has gone on with others and if their holidays were legit or not and concentrate on your case. In your employers opinion you have done wrong and your colleagues haven't.

Call acas with all the facts as you see them and see where you stand. IMO you have breached your contract by taking unauthorised leave, it will be tricky to prove otherwise.

Spherical · 22/11/2013 22:24

One of the requirements for employers applying disciplinary procedures is that they should be applied fairly and consistently. If your employer has failed to do this, you can raise it as part of your 'defence' at the disciplinary hearing - citing the acas code of practice on discipline which employers are supposed to follow unless there is a very good reason for not doing so.

VerySmallSqueak · 22/11/2013 22:25

Weenie AFAIK you can join the union at any time,but they will not represent you if you are already in dispute when you join.

VerySmallSqueak · 22/11/2013 22:26

Now that sounds like Spherical is talking sense and knows what s/he's talking about!

Weenie1 · 22/11/2013 22:27

yes fair enough but does that mean that everybody who does not attend work should be at risk of losing their job?? surley there are rights. And why should i be treated diffrently from the others??, and punished but not them?? thats singling me out as their holidays where also declined along with mine.....

OP posts:

Weenie1 · 22/11/2013 22:30

Thank you for that spherical...at last someone else who can see it from my point, i dont dispute that i should not be punished for breeching my contract as i did wrong, but the others did also but are not being treated like me. I will use it as part of my defence at my hearing for sure.

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GlaikitOfGallifrey · 22/11/2013 22:40

yes fair enough but does that mean that everybody who does not attend work should be at risk of losing their job?? yes if you do not attend work without good reason your employment should be at risk.

surley there are rights yes there are, this is why you have been suspended pending an investigation and will have a right to reply to the accusations and not just turfed out with no explanation.

What you don't know for sure right now is the status of your colleagues leave and if they were in fact off unauthorised. There could be an explanation for their holidays being approved after they were declined. If you then establish that you are being singled out for a misdemeanour that you colleagues haven't been pulled up for, can you claim discrimination.

What you do know is you were contracted to not take holidays during term time, you asked if it were possible to take some as a special case, this was refused, yet you still chose to take the leave even though you knew it wasn't authorised. Unless you can categorically prove others have acted in exactly the same way as you, and not been reprimanded, then you a standing on a very shoogly peg.

I am assuming, possibly wrongly, that you work in a school? What impact would you just not turning up for the first week of term have in them?i know if couldn't just take a week off work and there been no negative impact on my colleagues.

Weenie1 · 22/11/2013 22:52

I gave them advanced notice of intended holiday, asked if i need to fill in a form before i booked and was told by my line manager "NO" there was no form for us to fill in. So i booked holiday, for them to 3month later decide we have to fill in forms and ALL staff holiday where declined full stop, but they like me took their holidays but yet are not being punished.

How is that fair?? and there was cover for me not being at work for 9days which had bn organised beofre the school summer holidays as the informed the relief dinner lady she would be working.

OP posts:

mariefab · 22/11/2013 22:58

Who organised the cover?

Weenie1 · 22/11/2013 22:59

it caused no disruption to the kids as someone was there to take them to dinner...i could iunderstand if it left them short staffed with no cover, but they had organised the cover weeks before we broke up for summer.

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Weenie1 · 22/11/2013 23:00

My line manager organised the cover.

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EnlightenedOwl · 22/11/2013 23:00

You took unauthorised absence. Also you don't know the precise circumstances of the others you keep referring to. You need a better defence argument than the one you currently have.

mariefab · 22/11/2013 23:02

When did your line manager organise the cover?
Was it before the start of the summer holidays?

Weenie1 · 22/11/2013 23:03

so them goin on holiday to the seaside is ok??? but me goin to see my parents who have lived aboard for 9 yrs is not??

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VerySmallSqueak · 22/11/2013 23:04

Has it been quite usual for people to take holidays during term time (despite what the contract states) for a period of time?

Repeatedlydoingthetwist · 22/11/2013 23:12

I think others are correct OP, you need to concentrate on your own actions and defence. You can bring up the fact that you think you've been singled out but that alone won't save you. IME all that will happen is that everyone will end up under investigation. I'd be very surprised though if your employers did something as drastic as suspending you and no one else without good cause to.

VerySmallSqueak · 22/11/2013 23:13

By 'a period of time' I mean is it something people have been doing for a few years?

Preciousbane · 22/11/2013 23:16

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Weenie1 · 22/11/2013 23:18

line manager organised cover before we broke for summer hols.

i will bring it up at my hearing because it relavent to my case, they have had investgation into their time off during term time which they took before me. I have a good work record andhave had no issues with co workers etc and have not had any warnings etc either my record is clean apart from this.

My point is with this that i feel we should ALL have bn under investigation for taking unauthorised leave when holidays where declined for ALL of us, not just me on my own.

yes others have taken time off during term despite what our contract states.

OP posts:

mariefab · 22/11/2013 23:21

So, although your holiday had been refused your line manager arranged for the relief dinner lady to cover your holiday weeks before the summer holidays started.

Did he tell you this before you broke up for the summer hols or did you find out when you returned?

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Weenie1 · 22/11/2013 23:23

yes they have bn doin it for years (all while i have worked there of 3 and half yrs ).

No.... other colleagues had between 6 and 12 school working days off for holidays not one day at a time.

surely if i dont fight my corner then there is no point even attending the hearing. i have bn told they will ask me question relating to the absence to which i will answer, i wont sit and say nothing.

OP posts:

Weenie1 · 22/11/2013 23:24

i found out while still working my shift as they asked the relief if she could cover when she was in for someone off ill.

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VerySmallSqueak · 22/11/2013 23:27

Well I wonder if you could have an argument that it has become 'custom and practice' for people to take leave during term time?

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