Rape sentencing America - rehabilitation vs punishment

[Felascloak]

I've just read an article about a US college student who raped a semiconscious student at a party. He received a 2 year community sentence and 20 years on probation because the judge thought prison would not rehabilitate him.

www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/austin-wilkerson-boulder-rape-prison_us_57abb86ce4b06e52746f3b22

This reminds me a lot of the recent Brock turner sentencing.

I'm not sure in cases as serious as rape that "rehabilitation" should be given a higher priority than "punishment".
Also surely such a light sentence works against rehabilitation by sending the message that rape isn't serious enough to result in acustodial term (I'm pretty sure this only applies to white middle class rapists though)
Very glad I am not living in America

[Bitofacow]

"power I would be fascinated to know sentencing for rape broken down by gender, race, income/economic status/class. "

Indeed. If this crime had been committed by a black man what would the sentence have been?

[SenecaFalls]

In the American system I expect this is more to do with sexism and not thinking rape is important than anything else.

As I said earlier, average sentences overall are about the same as in the UK. I do think that there is a sense among a significant number of people in the US that campus sexual assault is somehow different because of alcohol, partying and perhaps sexual experimentation. There's a high level of victim blaming. I think that some of these lighter sentences reflect that sense. It's an unfortunate state of affairs, but one that a significant number of people, in private and public life, are working to address.

For anyone who has not seen it, I recommend the documentary The Hunting Ground which has brought a lot of attention to the issue. Here's the trailer:

[BungoWomble]

The problem is context. In the American system I expect this is more to do with sexism and not thinking rape is important than anything else. Outside the US, I sympathise with the need to punish, but the fact is that Finland has a legal system focused on rehabilitation and they have the lowest re-offending rates in Europe. If you google Finnish legal system rehabilitation there's a lot of information. I don't know how they handle rape though.

[SenecaFalls]

I agree. And I'm not very optimistic at all that men who abuse women can be rehabilitated.

[venusinscorpio]

What exactly is wrong with punishing someone, proportionately, for committing a violent crime? It's not just about them and their "rehabilitation" back into society, it's also about justice being done for the victim. If you can't do the time, don't do the crime.

[anyhue]

Here are two other facts that must be considered when people discuss punishment and rehab options. These comments on based on material/books I've read in the past.

1. There is a VERY high repeat offense rate for rapists.
   

Sex offenders in the Sample and Bray study had 1-year, 3-year, and 5-year rearrest rates for any new offense of 21.3 percent, 37.4 percent, and 45.1 percent, respectively.
www.smart.gov/SOMAPI/sec1/ch5_recidivism.html

These numbers are much higher in reality, since these are the ones caught again (most rapes unreported, most rapists not caught).

1. Many rapists are serial rapists. I can't find the source now, but even rapists with a single conviction typically have MANY victims
   

In summary, sentences should be MUCH more severe.

[SenecaFalls]

Felascloak I did not see your assertions or questions as confrontational; it's an important discussion to have.

There is heightened concern in the US these days over campus sexual assault and the failure of law enforcement and universities to respond adequately and so these cases are getting scrutiny that they would not have had even a short time ago. The Obama administration, particularly Vice-President Joe Biden, who authored the US Violence Against Women Act in the 1990s, has made addressing these issues a priority, but there are limits to what can be done at the federal level because sexual assault laws are primarily a state matter.

[Scarydinosaurs]

power I would be fascinated to know sentencing for rape broken down by gender, race, income/economic status/class.

Horrific how these white men are essentially told "this isn't a crime" and actions are condoned by these sentences. Rape culture is alive and well.

[Felascloak]

Thanks seneca. I was just asking because you are in the US, not to be confrontational btw. I'm pretty horrified at what appears to be a direction of travel, it would be slightly reassuring (although not at all acceptable) if it's always happened but is now being reported more widely.

[powershowerforanhour]

The average sentence for rape in the US is 8-9 years
This is average for all rapes I take it.
What's the average for a rape commited by a frat boy?

[SenecaFalls]

I do think that it has always happened and is now being reported more because there is more awareness and more outrage. I hope that the publicity these cases have received will make judges less likely to impose these lenient sentences.

[Felascloak]

So seneca do you think it's coincidental that we've seen three of these rich athletic white boys get barely more than a ticking off in the last few months? Or do you think it's always happened and is being reported more?

[Shoxfordian]

The sentencing in this case is ridiculous- he won't even be put on the sex offenders register. He's learnt there are no real consequences to his actions & will probably end up doing this again

[SenecaFalls]

I don't think that the Turner case has emboldened judges to apply lighter sentences; it has likely had the opposite effect because of the criticism that the judge in the Turner case received.

The average sentence for rape in the US is 8-9 years, which I think is roughly equivalent to sentences in the UK.

[Felascloak]

I don't know whether it's being reported more because interest was raised by brock Turner. Or whether the Turner case set some kind of precedent that opened the door to misogynistic judges feeling able to make these kind of judgments.
It makes me sick that a supposedly moral country treats it's women this way. I really hope we don't follow suit here.

[SenecaFalls]

There are significant limits to what presidents can do because sexual assault, like most crimes in the US, is a primarily a matter of state law. The Obama administration has made improving the response to survivors of campus sexual assault a priority.

[AyeAmarok]

Something tells me Donald Trump would think it was a suitable punishment too.

[AyeAmarok]

How much longer is this going to be allowed to go on for before someone, Obama? Hillary Clinton?, steps in and says enough is enough?

What is the point of minimum sentences if judges are allowed to do this?

[Xenophile]

Lovely. No record at all, and that delightful nickname.

But there aint no such thing as male privilege now.

[Felascloak]

For fuck sake. Here is another one.
www.attn.com/stories/10890/david-becker-charged-with-rape-serving-no-jail-time

It is so shocking and unfair. Not surprised there is such a frat culture if the sentencing is like this. Disgusting.

[VestalVirgin]

I'm interested in knowing what is going to be done to rehabilitate this....creature.

Teaching him how to get away with rape, probably. For a rape case to go to court in the first place, the woman has to be very lucky, or the rapist very stupid, anyway, so ... I suppose they'll teach Brock Turner to take his rape victim to a more secluded space next time.

It is very obvious to me that those judges don't consider rape a crime at all.

[OneFlewOverTheDodosNest]

You know rehabilitation would be a really admirable aim except for the fact that it seems the only time it seems to be considered is when it's linked to rape cases.

Personal drug possession? 5 years minimum.
Petty theft? 18 months for a first time offence
Walking whilst black? Lock him up and throw away the key.
Oh but just a little bit of rape, we wouldn't want to ruin his life for a few moments of action would we? He's got such a bright future - you're all being mean. We'll make sure that he can be super successful and that will be sure to fix his massive entitlement issues and raging misogyny.

[JedRambosteen]

What indeed?

[Felascloak]

Ugh I need to step away from Google. Judge Persky (who sentenced Brock turner) has given a man 4 DAYS in prison for accessing child abuse images when most offenders get around 6 months +
What the fuck is wrong with the guy?
www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/aug/09/stanford-trial-judge-child-abuse-image-brock-turner

[Felascloak]

Here's a more detailed article. The guy sounds scary and manipulative.
www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/08/13/first-brock-turner-now-boulder-how-two-sex-assaults-amassed-headlines.html

Also I'm struck be the resemblance between wilkerson and turner. Freaky.