So in the wake of a massive public spotlight on rape, the priority apparently is to protect the reputations of the tiny % of men falsely accused of rape

[FastidiaBlueberry]

FFS FFS FFS

Is it very cynical of me to think that this new demand to enable anonymity for men accused of rape (most of whom are guilty, but get off anyway) is a psychological need to re-establish what is most important to these woman-haters?

Stop talking about the mountain of rape victims who never get justice and FGS start talking about the anthill of men who get falsely accused.

Enough of Steubenville, Delhi, Frances Andrade, Jimmy Savile's victims, the 1 in 4 women who are raped or sexually assaulted.

Let's get back to talking about the really important issues - the miniscule number of men who will be falsely accused of rape or who will be the victim of mistaken identity. Fools, don't you know they're more important than all those rape vicitms? That that's a much bigger issue? So what 25% of women are subjected to rape or sexual assault? So what if 85-90% of rape victims don't report? So what that of those who do, only 6% get a guilty verdict even though only between 2-6% are lying or mistaken? Let's get some perspective on this - men matter more than women, stop imagining they don't.

Fuming but off to bed.

[AbigailAdams]

Yes that DM article is a classic in not hiding its agenda, bias or misogyny.

[CabbageLeaves]

Brilliant points on this thread Fastidia. Thank you

[twofingerstoGideon]

The focus should be on helping the thousands of women who are raped by men.
Indeed.

[Ilovexmastime]

This thread has completely changed my opinion regarding anonymity. I had fallen for the media view and believed that it would be the right thing to do.
Not after reading this though. I will be re-reading this thread so that I can get all the arguments against anonymity straight in my head, ready to argue the case with friends and family.

[CabbageLeaves]

I browse the feminist threads and often my opinion is shaped, tweaked or I roll my eyes and wander off. This thread as you say Ilovexmastime, has really made me think and change how I see the way rape is portrayed. Excellent points showing how massively biased and unbalanced it is against women and in ways you don't even recognise because they are so 'normal'.

Let the trolls starve

[Ilovexmastime]

Exactly! I'm embarassed to say that I hadn't even thought about women coming forward after reading about a rapist in the paper, and yet it is so obvious.
[Blush]

[twofingerstoGideon]

Oh yes, my local paper reports virtually nothing else - page after page of stories about women being raped, along with pictures of the poor accused, who haven't even been found guilty of anything. Chock-a-block it is - there's barely room for any other stories. In fact, it's just like the national press with its insatiable need to vilify men and its insistence on printing stories about women walking around in short skirts and not even getting punished for it up a dark alley somewhere...

Rape victims have never had it so good.

[twofingerstoGideon]

Sorry, that was to "feminist" 12312.

[TheDoctrineOfSciAndNatureClub]

Angel, I'm so sorry

Is the anonymity of rape victims really so very different to the rest of the law?, when a case gets to court, the victim is not the accuser, she (or he of course) is a witness. The case is not "ms X against Mr Y". And our court system has always made provision for the protection of vulnerable witnesses (screens, video evidence, anonymity etc). Did the right to anonymity for victims come from a decision that all such witnesses have a high probability of being vulnerable?

Not a lawyer so the above may be incorrect.

Fastidia, I want to be you when I grow up.

[JuliaScurr]

Doctrine yes, she's a witness and the defence try to show she is unreliable. That's their job. The accused is innocent until proved guilty. Not his word against hers, two evenly balanced sides, but hugely in his favour. The vast majority (over 95%) never get to court anyway.

yesmeansyesblog.wordpress.com/2009/11/12/meet-the-predators/

[JuliaScurr]

The 'yes means yes' piece shows how many men admit to rape - if it's not called rape, and sometimes if it is :(

[TheDoctrineOfSciAndNatureClub]

Thanks Julia.

[edam]

I'm glad this thread has been so thought provoking and has helped people think about the damaging effects of special treatment for those accused of rape.

[edam]

Good grief, just followed the link to the surveys of men. Horrifying how many confess to rape and repeated rape if you describe it rather than using the word rape.

[maisere]

FastidiaBlueberry-"It is simply untrue to say that an untrue rape allegation is more disastrous for a man than any other type of untrue allegation of a crime."

I really wish you could spend an hour with my husband ..he is a broken man...broken by a women who accused him of historic abuse and rape, a crime I know 100% he had not commited. He has been fully investigated and has NO CASE TO ANSWER. The sheer hell of being investigated for 6 months finished him.There are many men in the same position up and down the country.
To say that being accused of rape is not more disastrous for a man than any other crime just shows how narrow minded you are.
If you are going to pass comment on this very emotive subject at least have the decency to do it with an open mind please.
Maisere

[TheDoctrineOfSciAndNatureClub]

Maisere, I'm sorry that happened to your husband. But a six month investigation for fraud or murder might well have been equally devastating. Or do you see it differently?

[maisere]

chibi Sun 17-Feb-13 11:53:09
there is a fundamental lack of understanding here of how policing works- do posters think you can just pootle on down to the police station, announce that someone has raped you, and that's it, they are arrested?

i would be very surprised to hear if this were actually the case

YES THEY CAN AND DO

[TheDoctrineOfSciAndNatureClub]

Maisere, was it mistaken identity or falsification in your husband's case, if you are able and willing to say?

[maisere]

TheDoctrineOfSciAndNatureClub Yes it is very different unless the man is a rapist because he won't give a hoot anyway.....
For an innocent man to be accused of such a crime is soul destroying, ask yourself one question if it was you accused how would you feel, what emotions would you suffer ??
Maisere

[maisere]

It was falsification in my hubbies case.

[Trekkie]

I always think that there are loads of crimes that are just as bad / worse to be accused of than rape of an adult. Things like paedophilia or child porn or torture or murder or pimping or trafficking children for slavery or trafficking adults for prostitution against their will.

Yet it's only rape of an adult woman by a man that people want to see anonimity for.

Why is that I wonder...

[thezebrawearspurple]

Falsely accused men are victims too, as are their wives, daughters, sisters, mothers... Being falsely accused means having being threatened with and being on the receiving end of vigilante violence, it means harassment for the family, it means loss of job/career and all future job prospects even when found innocent (because most people think like you do, that they were probably guilty anyway and got away with it), it means social ostracisation for the whole family including children.

I don't see anything feminist about supporting destroying the lives and reputations of innocent men and their families.

The fact is that so long as you are going to prosecute someone on the basis of anothers word with no other evidence necessary, then you have to provide anonymity until it is proven in court. If we were to prosecute people on charges of drug trafficking or murder on the basis of one persons allegation without any proof to suggest such a thing ever took place, I'm sure there would be many innocent people being prosecuted of those crimes on the basis of malicious allegations and many more allegations of that nature being made as certain people realise the power they can wield over neighbours/colleagues/strangers who have slighted them in some way.

Some people (a tiny minority) are just liars, they lie about all sorts of things, my friend was a victim of her neighbours making false claims to ss because they were trying to drive her out as they didn't want blacks there (yeah right, women don't lie, those nasty, racist women tried to destroy her family), whether it is about being malicious, attention seeking for themselves or revenge, there are people who lie and that needs to be recognised, liars lie about all sorts of things, including abuse. Denying that doesn't help rape victims, allowing innocent people's lives to be ruined doesn't further anyone's rights.

Most rape allegations are genuine, keeping names out of the headlines until convicted means that will be far less public attention to the small number of false allegations as those men won't be publicly victimised and branded. Putting the spotlight on men who are later found innocent makes people (future juries) more suspicious of rape claims in general. Juries will be far more hesitant of convicting where the evidence proves that he did it if their heads are full of stories of wrongly accused men, you need them focused on the case in hand without prejudice.

What we really need to discourage rape is harsh sentencing upon conviction and a culture where rape is unacceptable. Keep the media exposure to those convicted and the attention is on rape victims, let the pubic get angry about that.

[TheDoctrineOfSciAndNatureClub]

Do you also support anonymity for those accused of murder?