4 year old eating problems

[MummaEllie]

So, I don't know where to start.
When My little boy was 6months old we started the weaning process. At first I went straight for Jar food, pouches, breakfast and yogurts. My son didn't take well to being spoon fed and would spit out anything that went into his mouth. He started to eat yogurts from spoon feed eventually. Fast forward doing this for 3months with little progress and my little boy now being 9months old and starting nursery I took some advice from the children's centre staff. I was advised to start Baby led weaning.
Little man took better to this and started putting food to his mouth to eat however was still not eating massive amounts and only certain parts of meals. I kept getting told that food for under 1s is just for fun and not to stress out. (I cried so much during this process as I felt like he wasn't eating much at all)

So fast forward to him turning 2.. and we was still having troubles getting him to try different foods. He would eat pizza, any form of potatoes, rice, macaroni, breads and fruits. He would also eat biscuits and crisps.
At nursery he was only able to have cooked meals on site, he would sit and refuse to eat, only eating the fruit at snack times. He would come home so hungry.
He would still refuse any meats and unfamiliar foods and would demand his safe foods.
We tried modeling meal times and giving him the same meals as us, we tried adding a safe food to a dish so he could eat something but also be exposed to other foods.
Fast forward to 4 years old.. at a new nursery and he can have packed lunch, so he eats his typical sandwich (has to be cheese spread) and crisps and fruits. When he comes home he is refusing our dinners even more!! He is literally living off pizza, macaroni and potatoes!
We don't watch tele while eating, he will make every excuse to get down from the table.
We encourage him to try and when we do, he attemps to put food in his mouth but then is gagging when it hits his mouth.

I have spoken to many people about this and I'm being told he is just being fussy. I feel like the gagging just isn't normal. He won't eat any other yogurt apart from cheap ones with clear pot and won't eat any other pizza apart from cheap tesco ones.

I feel my son has some additional needs but when I share this with nursery they say they don't see the same things I do.

Basically I'm asking.. what do I do! Who do I turn to? Am I being dramatic if I take him to the GP about this? Dinner times are causing us so much distress.

Sorry for the long winded explanation and thank you to anyone who has made it to this point of my message. HELP IS NEEDED!!

[Beamur]

Yes go to your GP. Being referred to a nutritionist might be helpful.
This sounds beyond 'fussy' to me..
Have you heard of ARFID?
What else have you noticed that the nursery have not?

[MummaEllie]

It's refreshing to hear someone actually tell me that it sounds beyond fussy. Everyone keeps telling me to just keep going and he will 'grow out of it'
I haven't heard of that but I will look it up and see if it fits with how he eats. Thank you!

So he has hearing loss and glue ear, he has had this since birth. This resulted in very little speech until he was approx 2. At that stage he had very repeated play patterns, liked to stick balls in a twist tower and watch them fall for ages. He would then try this with all his toys.
he becomes obsessed with tv characters and would quote lines from the shows randomly and when excited.
In the last 10months he started his new nursery and he has made significant progress and now talking more sentences. His conversation seems quite normal but he will still randomly quote the TV shows. He also likes the same seat on the bus and will get distressed if someone else is sitting there. He will rather stand than sitting somewhere else.
He likes his routines however doesn't get as distressed when they are changed anymore.

The nursery have said he doesn't have 'visable' concerns. I have raised autistic concerns and they have said that they don't think so as he's very 'high functioning' (I hate these terms so I'm sorry in advance to everyone reading)

[Pashazade]

This sounds like something is going on to me. He could well be on the spectrum. I'd definitely see the GP and try for a referral. In the meantime please don't panic, they can eat very restricted diets and still be healthy.
For now I would let him eat what he is comfortable with.
The gagging is what's making me feel there is more to this he's potentially got sensory issues.

[mynameiscalypso]

I don't know about additional needs but I have a 4 year old who is very similar (in fact, probably eats even less variety at the moment). Yesterday he had his breakfast but then refused all food at nursery (lunch/snacks) and would only eat a yoghurt for dinner. It's not great, obviously, and I rely on the fact that he'll drink smoothies to get any nutrients in him but I'm just trying to ride it out really. I don't suspect any kind of additional needs with him though so I wonder if that makes it easier for me to rationalise away than if you have other suspicions if you know what I mean? In any event, I thought I'd give you some sympathy because my DS seems to exist on bread, pizza and plain pasta.

[MummaEllie]

@Pashazade

This sounds like something is going on to me. He could well be on the spectrum. I'd definitely see the GP and try for a referral. In the meantime please don't panic, they can eat very restricted diets and still be healthy.
For now I would let him eat what he is comfortable with.
The gagging is what's making me feel there is more to this he's potentially got sensory issues.

Thank you!
Our worry is that he is starting to eat even less of his 'safe' foods. At dinner time he is now asking for breakfast or a biscuit.
We are at the point that dinner time is super stressful.
Should we just offer him a bowl of cereal instead of his dinner?

[ManchNic]

Hi, I am a speech and language therapist that specialises in feeding difficulties. This does sound more than typical fussy eating and I would see your GP and request a referral to your local speech and language therapy Dysphagia Service, or alternatively see a private dysphagia therapist (look up ASLTIP).
Not all NHS therapists will take on aversive/sensory related feeding issues but it sounds like this might be his issue. How is he about things like teeth brushing/getting messy/dirty/different textures etc?

[MummaEllie]

@mynameiscalypso

I don't know about additional needs but I have a 4 year old who is very similar (in fact, probably eats even less variety at the moment). Yesterday he had his breakfast but then refused all food at nursery (lunch/snacks) and would only eat a yoghurt for dinner. It's not great, obviously, and I rely on the fact that he'll drink smoothies to get any nutrients in him but I'm just trying to ride it out really. I don't suspect any kind of additional needs with him though so I wonder if that makes it easier for me to rationalise away than if you have other suspicions if you know what I mean? In any event, I thought I'd give you some sympathy because my DS seems to exist on bread, pizza and plain pasta.

It's so difficult isn't it!
We are the same and give him as much fruit and milk he could possibly want to ensure he gets some goodness.

Because my little boy presents as so 'mild' it's hard for people to take me seriously and alot of the time I feel like maybe I am just a crazy first time mum!

[Beamur]

I'm no expert (beyond parenting 2 children with varying degrees of restricted eating) but it sounds very sensory to me. Whether it's ND or NT I don't know - but the reassurance in routine and repetitive stuff is both very normal in kids who are NT and ND.
Kids who eat a narrow diet are extremely risk averse with food. I found with DD that she was more likely to try something very similar to something she likes already - dry and crunchy being her preferred food texture. She also dislikes certain textures together. For example she would never eat pizza as it has too many textures together! Things which reliably always taste the same are safer too - like crisps.
Most kids do grow out of this but it can take years. A supplement can help assuage your anxiety and you can get calorie rich drinks that can be taken too.
Try not to listen to other people too much - most people have no idea what a truly food avoidant child is like.

[MummaEllie]

@ManchNic

Hi, I am a speech and language therapist that specialises in feeding difficulties. This does sound more than typical fussy eating and I would see your GP and request a referral to your local speech and language therapy Dysphagia Service, or alternatively see a private dysphagia therapist (look up ASLTIP).
Not all NHS therapists will take on aversive/sensory related feeding issues but it sounds like this might be his issue. How is he about things like teeth brushing/getting messy/dirty/different textures etc?

Thank you so much for your comment and for the advice. I will call my GP tomorrow for an appointment.

He has never been a fan of brushing his teeth and has been a struggle over the years. Recently he has noticed a staff member at nursery who has bad teeth and he asked me about it. I explained to him about brushing teeth to keep them healthy and now he will let us do it. He Will still protest a little but we manage a quick brush.

Hes not to bothered if his hands are dirty however I'm not sure if he plays with different sensory textures. I will give it a try myself over the weekend.

He is sensitive to sounds but I'm not sure if this is due to his conductive hearing loss.

[SiouxsieSiouxStiletto]

Some excellent advise from ManchNic.

Another vote here for reading up on ARFID. My DD was very similar at that age and she's now on the Pathway.

As well as the referral suggested above I'd get in touch with the HV. Tell her your concerns and ask her to score an Ages & Stages for you and to have a look at him.

If he has glue ear did you know that you can join NDCS for supper and it's free?

I'd also have a look at the Birmingham Food Refusal Service.

[SiouxsieSiouxStiletto]

You can get tasteless toothpaste but not sure if it's suitable for a 4 yo. If it is, is might help as he could find the taste and foaminess a bit overwhelming?

[MummaEllie]

@Beamur

I'm no expert (beyond parenting 2 children with varying degrees of restricted eating) but it sounds very sensory to me. Whether it's ND or NT I don't know - but the reassurance in routine and repetitive stuff is both very normal in kids who are NT and ND.
Kids who eat a narrow diet are extremely risk averse with food. I found with DD that she was more likely to try something very similar to something she likes already - dry and crunchy being her preferred food texture. She also dislikes certain textures together. For example she would never eat pizza as it has too many textures together! Things which reliably always taste the same are safer too - like crisps.
Most kids do grow out of this but it can take years. A supplement can help assuage your anxiety and you can get calorie rich drinks that can be taken too.
Try not to listen to other people too much - most people have no idea what a truly food avoidant child is like.

Thank you for this message, it is quite reassuring coming from someone else who has children who have restricted diets.
I have tried to get vitamins in my son but he won't take it.
Most kids like sweets and will take the gummy but mine won't eat sweets. He will only eat chocolate.

[Girliefriendlikespuppies]

It does sound sensory, I think in this case I would allow as much of the foods as he likes and totally remove the stress around food, no pressure on him to eat or not.

Also allow for distractions when he's eating so let him watch telly or an iPad.

I know it sounds like the opposite of what you'd normally do but the more you make it a battle the worse it will get imo.

I was your Ds and this is what helped me.

[MummaEllie]

@SiouxsieSiouxStiletto

Some excellent advise from ManchNic.

Another vote here for reading up on ARFID. My DD was very similar at that age and she's now on the Pathway.

As well as the referral suggested above I'd get in touch with the HV. Tell her your concerns and ask her to score an Ages & Stages for you and to have a look at him.

If he has glue ear did you know that you can join NDCS for supper and it's free?

I'd also have a look at the Birmingham Food Refusal Service.

Thank you.
I saw the HV this time last year as at my sons Audiology appointment I became upset about nursery professionals not taking me seriously and a comment they made about him understanding and just not wanting to cooperate. They referred me and she was amazing. She told me she agreed he was slightly delayed on the charts but as he was moving nursery she wanted me to see how he got on. He made such good progress in such a short time she then asked me to wait out abit longer and see how he got on and now I'm being told that when he starts school in Sept they will pick up on any concerns.
He is making progress but still have little concerns.
Thank you for letting me know about the support available. I will look into that.

[tigerlillyxxx]

It could be some sort of sensory overload with all the different textures and tastes in the mouth alll at once my 1 year old is like this it's very frustrating I could make him 3 meals one night and he will not eat sometimes i feel like he doesn't even give it a go I'll spoon feed some food into his mouth and he'll pull his face straight away and scoop the food out with his fingers although my parter is soooo fussy with food he hates all veg and he especially hates onion not because of the taste but because he hates the crunchy sound while he chews he's the same with peppers so I'm now starting to think it could me genetic🤔

[MummaEllie]

@Girliefriendlikespuppies

It does sound sensory, I think in this case I would allow as much of the foods as he likes and totally remove the stress around food, no pressure on him to eat or not.

Also allow for distractions when he's eating so let him watch telly or an iPad.

I know it sounds like the opposite of what you'd normally do but the more you make it a battle the worse it will get imo.

I was your Ds and this is what helped me.

Thank you.
I have spoke with his dad and told him to try not pressure him to much.
We have tried the tele and tablet but sometimes he will then completely stop eating and be transfixed on the tele.

I think you are right, it's starting to be more of a battle because we are more stressed about it and trying to encourage new foods more.

[AuntieJune]

Some kids have problems swallowing (dysphagia as mentioned above) if he has problems with his ears it could be linked, it's all a similar area.

I would push again for referral to investigate. Sometimes you have to battle to get anywhere, I'm afraid.

[MummaEllie]

I just want to say a huge thank you to you all for your replies and reassurance.
Weaning has been the hardest part of my parenting journey and it really makes me so upset and feel like I'm failing him. You have all helped me and given me ideas for support. Thank you! X

[ManchNic]

@Girliefriendlikespuppies

It does sound sensory, I think in this case I would allow as much of the foods as he likes and totally remove the stress around food, no pressure on him to eat or not.

Also allow for distractions when he's eating so let him watch telly or an iPad.

I know it sounds like the opposite of what you'd normally do but the more you make it a battle the worse it will get imo.

I was your Ds and this is what helped me.

This is excellent advice and exactly what I tell my patients 😊
The less pressure/more control they feel they have, the more comfortable they will be to eat/eventually try new foods.

[Beamur]

I was also popping back to say let him eat what he wants and resist the temptation to keep trying new foods. It just makes eating more stressful.
Good luck.

[shhkj]

My 7 year old has a very restricted diet, linked to autism.

Our dietician tells us to let her have what she will eat and let her play/explore foods she won't eat. Back to basics basically in terms of exploring the texture and smell.

Also you'll have people tell you to say things like 'no desert until you've eaten x amount'. Apparently this is one of the worst things you can do where the child has these real sensory issues with food.

Speak to your GP about it

[24Dogcuddler]

You mustn’t blame yourself. It is so hard to get help and support with restricted diet and as parents you do tend to feel it is your fault. Meal times and trips out become so stressful
Try to relax if you can and let him eat what he eats for now.

Our daughter had a really rigid extreme brand specific diet alongside a diagnosis of ASD and Sensory Processing Disorder.
We were fortunate to work with the authors of this book below. Two excellent Clinical Psychologists, experts in the field.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1785923188/ref=sspa_mw_detail_0?ie=UTF8&amp%3Bpsc=1&amp%3Bsp_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9waG9uZV9kZXRhaWwp13NParams&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-21

https://infantandtoddlerforum.org/health-childcare-professionals-factsheets/

2.1 2.2 and 2.3 factsheets

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Cant-Eat-Wont-Difficulties-Disorders/dp/1853029742?tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-21

[24Dogcuddler]

Oh and re toothbrushing. You may need to stick with Milk Teeth paste or whatever he’s used to.
You can get silicone finger covers like a mini brush for you to help clean his teeth if he can tolerate this. The musical battery operated toothbrushes for children are really good for children with sensory sensitivity.

[lifehappens12]

Hi, my son is 5 and has additional needs. He had speech delay and we put his speech as being a year behind.

Your warning sorry sounds familiar where my son didn't really start solids till after 1.

He mows has a set range of meals - about 6 meals in total that he will eat that we will rotate as safe foods. When he started school he ate nothing all day till school adapted the
Menu for him.

He also has a high need to chew. He chews so much stuff when he gets a chance.

To try and expand his diet we are slowly again trying to introduce more food. Little steps.

Something left field. My son loves blippe - blippe did an episode where he ate pizza. After years of trying to get him to eat pizza .... blippe managed it.

[Timothhorton]

I have a fussy one too, some brilliant advice from others thank you. There might be a combination of factors firstly the poor kid is still really little, if he has ear issues that is going to link in with the back of the throat, the gagging may be mechanical for him, think about how hard it is to swallow if you have a sore throat, a slice of pepper or apple will be tough.

Kids have little power but sense acutely when they have it, don’t let it be a battleground. Try and act completely indifferent about what he eats for a while and make it more about talking rather than nagging (I was terrible). What comes across most in your post is that you love him and want the best for him but it’s absolutely not a reflection on you as a parent and remember he’s doing the best he can for you as well as he is able.

Allow things to plateau for a bit, make mealtimes enjoyable but chances are you are in this for a longer haul so don’t exhaust yourself and beat yourself up. The supports people mention make sure you reach out to them and I hope things improve for both of you soon.