My dog chased sheep

[Cath2907]

I am so upset and embarrassed. Was walking my dog yesterday afternoon off lead down a country lane. He is 15 months old and normally very reliable with recall. He is nice with other dogs, comes back when called and disinterested in people. We walk there daily and he's never shown much interest in the adjoining fields and the animals in them. Totally out of the blue he winkled his way through the hedge along the lane and shot into the field and chased the bloody sheep. I was with my Dad and we both went into the field attempting to call the dog back. He was totally oblivious. The farmer turned up (he happened to be passing) and told us off - all the time the dog was belting round the field after his poor sheep. Finally I caught the dog but only once he'd isolated a sheep in the hedge.

He is a small dog and wasn't trying to bite the sheep (he had plenty of opportunity to do so) but I do know that his behavior can still kill the sheep and had they been in lamb he could have caused them to abort.

I am still struggling today to look at the dog. I can't believe he nearly got himself shot and was at risk of killing a poor flock of sheep. I am so upset and ashamed of him and myself for letting him get into this situation.

His walk today was almost entirely on lead as there are so many sheep around here and I can never risk that happening again now he has a passion for sheep.

Not sure there is anything else I can do. I appologised to the farmer, the sheep were ok and the dog will be now treated by me and the family as high sheep risk and never allowed off lead anywhere there is the slightest risk of him coming into contact with sheep.

Anyone had similar? Will I eventually forgive myself for being so stupid?

[OnlineAlienator]

No one is saying it’s okay to worry sheep but let’s not pretend they are anything other than as a money making exercise.

Thats part of it, but not the whole story. No one is pretending, sheep are more than just money

[pigsDOfly]

I know this is not what this thread is about but I think it's indicative of the stupid attitude of a lot of people towards their dogs.

I was in a very well known pet stores this morning, they sell rabbits and guinea pig that are on display in open top runs.

Some idiot woman was holding her medium sized dog up so it could look over the top to the run and see the 'bunny rabbits'.

And yes, I'll probably be told that it's none of my business but I did pull her up about it. She said the staff allow her to do it, apparently they're not allowed to stop people doing this sort of thing, so she's going to go on doing it.

With stupid people like that in charge of dogs is it any wonder there are so many incidences of livestock worrying.

We're semi rural here so one or two towns surrounded by farms and there are sheep everywhere.

Sometimes I just despair.

[geekone]

I walk my dog round the same Loch every week. Today I stopped at a different section (I fancied a different cafe at the end 😳😛) and we went along a section I have been but never with a dog. It’s a great dog friendly area there are nature reserve area where dogs are not allowed they are clearly marked we don’t go there. It’s surrounded my fields normally they are ploughed fields so carrots hay etc. However today I happened to look up and see sheep, as I say not an section a regularly walk the dog but lots of off lead dog walking as it’s away from everywhere (or so I thought.) my dog is just about 13 months and right in the teenage phase but also 45kg of pure nonsense. I am just recovering from an operation so I had to think quickly which is difficult. Rather than make a fuss and get the dog on the lead I turned round said let’s go back “geekdog” and also sausage and he ran full pelt back the way we came. I think we were far enough away for him not to notice the sheep, however he was my responsibility it would be his nature to “play” with the sheep and I wouldn’t ever take that risk.
Your dog didn’t do anything wrong you did and your are lucky you have a dog and are not fined. Anytime I ever am near sheep I would put my dog on its lead. Normally I know this was a surprise as it is a dog walking area, clearly though a nice area for lambing too.

[backinthebox]

It's shocking when dogs do something like that out of character

It's not out of character. Too often these issues arise when dog owners don't understand that their dog is a dog, an animal that for the entire existence of dogs and their relative species, as hunted other animals to kill them and eat them. The very name for the teeth that all other animals use for killing and ripping meat is the same as the descriptor for dogs - 'canine.'

There is solid evidence that dogs have been evolving into efficient killing machines for 40 million years. A few thousand years of domestication has taken dogs and honed their natural skills so that we now have distinct breeds which either hunt to kill big things (hounds, all of them, even cute beagles and lazy whippets,) or little things (terriers, specialised in crawling into small spaces and shaking the animal it finds there till it is dead,) or chase down and pick up things humans have killed, (retrievers, including spaniels, labradors or other loveable breeds,) or defend property from predators too much for a human to take on (shepherd dogs were not originally developed to round up sheep, they were selected for their braveness in killing mountain lions or bears that might attack your herd in the middle of the night.) Even the poodle developed from Puddelhunds - an old german breed of dog used in hunting and retrieving ducks.

It is fair to say that the very nature of dogs has evolved as a direct result of their enthusiasm in working as hunters and herders with humans. It would be out of character to say they don't have a prey drive!

[Doggydoggydoggy]

It's shocking when dogs do something like that out of character

It isn’t out of character though, that is the thing.
We are so used to seeing our dogs as beautiful, kind, sensitive little fur babies that snuggle with our kids and know when we are sad that we completely forget, or completely refuse to believe that, they are in fact predatory animals who derive great pleasure from chasing, and sometimes killing small animals.

Most dogs have some degree of prey drive, something as simple as chasing a ball is a manifestation of prey drive in fact.

[Pinkbells]

Our local farmer helpfully puts notices on gates to say when sheep are in residence, so we know to put the dog on a lead. He did have a problem with a large dog that killed one of his sheep once, and he told me that if he saw it again he would shoot it. So I would definitely keep your dog on a lead at all times. It's shocking when dogs do something like that out of character, though. My last dog used to go crazy around horses, so I always had to keep her on a lead in case one suddenly appeared, but the first time was a real surprise.

[UrsulaPandress]

My spaniel did this when he was a youngster. He was off the lead at the stables which were in the middle of moorland. I saw traffic stopping on the road and went to look and there he was, herding a load of sheep up the main road. The sheep are allowed to roam free on the moors so he has been on a lead ever since. A local farmer did suggest that he should be left with an angry tup in an enclosed space and he would never go near a sheep again...

[Nesssie]

I would not allow you to walk your dog off lead with my horses
Nobody asked to.

[Doggydoggydoggy]

I don’t understand why the public are allowed on farming land full stop.
It is business premises.
It should be all fenced off in my opinion if possible.

Sad but people are too selfish and too stupid.

As a previous poster said, dogs must be acknowledged as the predators they are.

I think the current trend for ‘fur babies’ that must be treated as surrogate children, never told no or disciplined in any way because it’s ‘damaging’, spoilt with constant treats and toys and not properly trained because as long as they are not aggressive who cares has a LOT to answer for.

Dogs are dogs.
They are predatory animals and they all run the risk of livestock worrying.

They should be treated like dogs, spoilt with nice walks not parties and treats and trained to verbal control, walking at heel (and therefore under control), leashed anywhere near livestock and returning when called.

But people can’t or won’t.

[huhpuh]

If you think being a few fields away from sheep, or walking him off the lead around horses is going to work, then you're going to end up with your dog shot or being fined. Sorry to be blunt, but he needs to be on the lead at all times in rural areas, particularly at this time of year.

[Confusedbeetle]

I would not allow you to walk your dog off lead with my horses

[Confusedbeetle]

Sorry, but once he has chased sheep he will always chase sheep unless you take him aversion training where he will be attacked by a ram. You should never let any dog off lead in the country, anywhere where there may be livestock. He was not playing he was acting instinctively. I am sorry to be blunt, he is a dog, not a child. Some posters are anthropomorphising. Any dog, on the lead on all lanes near livestock. The farmer is entitled to shoot any dog chasing his sheep. Even without biting they get shocked, abort their lambs etc

[Scrowy]

I wish it was socially unacceptable/against the law to have dogs off leads on farmland full stop.

Farmland isn't somewhere to exercise your dogs (or have a picnic, put up a tent/ play frisbee). Footpaths are there to allow you to pass through private land to get from A to B.

I've said this on so many threads on here but I don't know how we have got to a point where this has become socially acceptable for pet dogs to run amok and crap all over the countryside.

Every single dog owner says 'I always keep my dog on a lead' 'my dog has excellent recall' 'I always pick up after my dog'.

Except we know that's clearly not true otherwise we wouldn't be seeing a massive increase in sheep worrying and there wouldn't be dog crap everywhere causing abortion in the nation's cattle.

[HoraceCope]

my dog would chase a deer but they are far too fast, i put her on a lead if any chance of any animals nearby, as should op.

[Backinthebox]

A few points about livestock worrying by dogs.

• it is governed by the Dogs (Protection of Livestock) Act 1953. This clearly sets out what constitutes livestock, and what constitutes worrying by a dog. You dog does not have to actually get hold of livestock to worry it. Merely chasing it can cause substantial harm and even death of the livestock.
  
• livestock is more than just sheep. You can be prosecuted if your dog worries sheep, cows, horses, pigs, goats or poultry, or any subsections of these species such as donkeys, ducks, geese, etc. Game birds such as pheasants are not included.
  
• even though game birds are not included, and nor are deer, rabbits, squirrels, etc, it is considered irresponsible to allow your dog to chase wildlife. Firstly, they can acquire a taste for chasing things and dogs are unable to differentiate between being allowed to chase a pheasant but not allowed to chase a domestic chicken. Secondly, if your dog is chasing something it is unlikely to be under your immediate control. A dog that is not under your control because it is chasing a deer could run across a road, into someone's land, etc. Thirdly, if your dog is chasing wildlife in a wild area, you are probably unaware they could be doing damage to protected habitats. Currently groundnesting birds are trying to build nests, but will not do so if there are dogs charging around. The numbers of birds such as curlew, larks and nightjars is declining year on year, and dogs off leads is not the only factor but a significant contributing factor that dog owners can control.
  
• a landowner is entitled to shoot a dog worrying livestock, any livestock as described above. However it must not be a premeditated act and can only be done if there is no other solution to controlling the dog. To spell this out - a landowner would have to have had a dog worrying their livestock for long enough to go and source a gun, come back and shoot it. If a dog owner has failed to get control of their dog during this time, there is a good chance considerable harm has been done. Even if the dog has not actually bitten an animal.
  

From the point of view of a livestock owner here, I do not cut anyone any slack. When you take on the responsibility of owning a dog, you need to treat it as a predator from day 1. You are the owner, take responsibility. Every dog that has killed one of my hens or ducks has had an owner trailing along behind saying 'I had no idea he would do that! He's never done it before.' This year we lost 2 hens as a direct result of dog attacks, and 6 more which were not killed directly by a loose dog but died within 12 hrs of a dog attack as a result of the dog's actions. My children's pony has been chased and bitten by loose dogs. I've had 4 visits from the police as a result of dog attacks (by 4 different sets of dogs, so this is a widespread problem) and one visit where I had to go into the police station to give a statement as a result of a more serious attack. My neighbour who has land half a mile away has had hens killed, another friend who farms loses dozens of sheep and lambs a year, every year.

As a dog owner, you should be mortified if your dog chases an animal that belongs to someone else. Your dog is programmed to chase and catch it's own dinner, it will take some considerable effort from you to limit it's hunting drive but it can be done. My mother's dogs sit in my yard and would not dream of chasing a pony or a hen, due to their training from a young age.

To the poster who poo-pooed the idea that once a dog has chased an animal it is more likely to do it again, it is a fact. If an animal runs, the dog experiences an emotional 'reward' that it will be keen to experience again, most often by chasing another animal. Unless this behaviour is nipped in the bud or prevented altogether, it is likely to result in what the dog sees as valid prey animals being attacked and eventually killed.

My end point is that if 4 dog walkers were more aware this year of their dogs' capabilities as hunters, I wouldn't have had to explain 4 times to my children why their hens are dead and their pony more fearful of dogs.

If you own a dog and do not know where it is at all times, it is out of control. The dogs that hunted and attacked our pony in a pack now only need to set foot in my field for the police to seize them as out of control dogs. They do not need to be chasing anything, they do not need to attack anything. The mere fact that they are in my field means that the dog owner is not in control of them any more. So know where your dog is, keep it under control, and yes, be embarrassed and mortified if it chases someone else's animals because the only reason it has done that is because you allowed it.

[RMogs]

We live rurally and if sheep are about dogs are on leads, however my parents golden retriever she*tbag scaled cliffs once and tried chasing sheep on the cliff top while we scrambled to get him...never done it before.
There was a few bolshy (angry) old ewes that butter him and gave him a scare, now if he sees a sheep he cowers by us.
When we got our lab I spoke with my landlord who keeps sheep and he has a particularly grumpy ram who we introduced our dog too (supervised by us both). She has shown no interest in sheep since. Perhaps finding a farmer who may help in this way?
Otherwise a long line lead is great as still got freedom to run/explore to and extent but you are still in control

[NicoAndTheNiners]

Please don't use the horse fields unless the owners of these fields say it's ok. Dh owns fields which we rent out to horse owners and the amount of random people who seem to think it's acceptable to use these private fields (no footpaths) as a dog exercise area astounds me. I've known people argue the toss when they've been challenged about it. Claim they're not doing any harm and that they'll carry on, etc.

[ItsAllGoingToBeFine]

please ask permission of the owner of the horsefields before using it for exercising your dog

This, also:

"Dogs on open access land
You must keep your dog on a lead no more than 2 metres long on open access land:

between 1 March and 31 July - to protect ground-nesting birds
at all times around livestock
On land next to the England Coast Path you must keep your dog under close control.

There may be other local or seasonal restrictions. These do not apply to public rights of way or assistance dogs."

And

"Keep dogs under effective control
When you take your dog into the outdoors, always ensure it does not disturb wildlife, farm animals, horses or other people by keeping it under effective control. This means that you:

keep your dog on a lead, or
keep it in sight at all times, be aware of what it’s doing and be confident it will return to you promptly on command
ensure it does not stray off the path or area where you have a right of access
Special dog rules may apply in particular situations, so always look out for local signs – for example:

dogs may be banned from certain areas that people use, or there may be restrictions, byelaws or control orders limiting where they can go
the access rights that normally apply to open country and registered common land (known as ‘open access’ land) require dogs to be kept on a short lead between 1 March and 31 July, to help protect ground nesting birds, and all year round near farm animals
at the coast, there may also be some local restrictions to require dogs to be kept on a short lead during the bird breeding season, and to prevent disturbance to flocks of resting and feeding birds during other times of year
It’s always good practice (and a legal requirement on ‘open access’ land) to keep your dog on a lead around farm animals and horses, for your own safety and for the welfare of the animals. A farmer may shoot a dog which is attacking or chasing farm animals without being liable to compensate the dog’s owner.

However, if cattle or horses chase you and your dog, it is safer to let your dog off the lead – don’t risk getting hurt by trying to protect it. Your dog will be much safer if you let it run away from a farm animal in these circumstances and so will you.

Everyone knows how unpleasant dog mess is and it can cause infections, so always clean up after your dog and get rid of the mess responsibly – ‘bag it and bin it’. Make sure your dog is wormed regularly to protect it, other animals and people"

www.gov.uk/right-of-way-open-access-land

[adaline]

Even if a field has a public footpath through it your dog should not be running about the field you are supposed to stick to the footpath

Yep, it surprises me how many people aren't aware of that. I live in the Lakes and one of the key things is STICK TO THE FOOTPATHS. You're not meant to traipse right across people's fields - a public right of way means you're allowed to cross someone's land on the path or around the edges if there's no path present. It doesn't mean let your dog loose across the entire field.

[Floralnomad]

Even if a field has a public footpath through it your dog should not be running about the field you are supposed to stick to the footpath .

[Heyha]

Also worth pointing out that the iron shoe with half a tonne behind it is just as likely to hit a human if you are nearby or end up in the way as they are scattering about. And in either case you wouldn't have a leg to stand on as you incorrectly assessed the risk of letting your dog run around amongst horses. The only restriction on animals in fields with footpaths is that you can't have a beef bull without his cows, or a dairy bull full stop. Other than that it is a case of use the path at your own risk.

[Doggydoggydoggy]

Horses are prey animals and frankly, a bit dim.
They are more likely to run blindly straight into a fence or whatever if chased by a dog.

Use great caution around horses OP.

[Heyha]

If it's got a public footpath through it it would be very difficult to stop anyone exercising their dog through it and the horse owners will be painfully aware of that. Presume it has because obviously without a right of way it would be trespass. But at least if a dog starts on a horse it will most likely get an iron shoe launched at it by half a tonne of muscle and think better of it.

[greenelephantscarf]

please ask permission of the owner of the horsefields before using it for exercising your dog.

[Cath2907]

Just a quick update. New walking routes have been found as well as much much more care about how many empty fields there need to be between ddog and sheep before he gets off lead. We have identified a couple of privately owned horse fields with excellent fencing that are at least 2 fields with good fencing away from a sheep field. We are also checking these horse fields in real time for sheep before letting ddog off as the sheep seem to move home every day at the moment and I am now paranoid they'll turn up even in fields that aren't used for sheep!

We live in a small village in Wales down a long valley. Currently pretty much all the surrounding fields seem to be used for sheep at some point although apparently never all at the same time. It is hard to find a place to walk where sheep aren't somewhere around so just taking him "somewhere else" to walk isn't an option. We are new to the area and the field the dog chased the sheep in had previously been empty and I didn't know he could get through the hedge. None of this excuses the fact that I let him get in a field full of sheep but it certainly wasn't intentional, he had always been on a lead in fields with sheep as I know dogs can't be trusted. I just didn't know he'd squeeze through that hedge into that field to chase those ones. Now I do!

He is spending a lot more time on the lead and up the disused quarry where there are no sheep fields or in the carefully pre-checked horse fields. It is not as easy or as fun for him this way but a lot safer for the sheep!