Overnights and maintainance

[Starla268]

Honestly not sure how to think about this issue so would appreciate any thoughts and guidance from others in similar situations (long time lurker but not posted before)

Been with DH for 6ish years, married for 2, new baby on the way in a couple of months. DSD is about to turn 10, I've known her since she was 4/5, we have a wonderful relationship and I love the bones of her. Things are pretty harmonious between us and her mum (DSD was the result of a one night stand so there was never any real romantic relationship there) and we manage childcare between us but DSD spends the majority of her time at her mums.

Since our baby news I'm being asked/expected to take on more of the childcare for DSD (I've had a lot of leave to use up so have done most of summer hols for example and am down to do holidays for the year I'm off work) which I'm more than happy to do - I love spending time with her and think it will be lovely for her to spend time with her new sibling.

On top of this DH and ex are now discussing a new arrangement whereby we would have DSD mon/tue/fri/sat/sun one week and mon/tue/fri the alternate week as well as me doing the majority of the holidays (DH works so most of the childcare will be down to me while she is with us). On top of this I'm the only car driver amongst us and DSD lives around a half hour drive from our place which is also where her school is so I'll be doing that run every school day that she is with us plus for all drop offs/pick ups from her mums.

Having worked out the numbers this looks to me like DSD will now be with us over half of the nights in the next year and so I'm wondering what should happen to maintainance payments in this case? I really don't want to upset the applecart but am already slightly anxious about how I'm going to manage for cash on my year off work without all the extra petrol/food/washing/treats etc that having DSD with us will entail.

Haven't discussed with DH yet but wanted to get some thoughts from you guys?

[popthisoneout]

I do think you're taking in a lot with committing to the school run with a newborn. There's no way I would have been able to do that with my first. A 30 min journey in traffic can feel like a life time with a crying baby. Plus leaving the house that early is difficult while you are finding your feet.

[JacquettaWoodville]

Absolutely review maintenance. And you shouldn't be going through your savings on ML just to keep up "your" contribution.

[Starla268]

I wouldn't want to go down the parental responsibility route, it's not up to me to make decisions about her schooling etc and putting myself in her mums position I wouldn't be happy at all to give that responsibility to someone else. We do all discuss her progress at school etc and reports are always shared with us all etc but the final say in any big decisions are down to her mum and DH - that's the way it should be.

I've taken on board what you have all said about the drive and the new baby and I think I will also discuss with everyone that while I'm very happy to give the new arrangement a try that I don't know how I'll feel as a new mum and that we might need to discuss again if I struggle. However if I'm going to say that perhaps it isn't fair to then start talking about reducing maintenance? I thought this was a straightforward question but I'm more confused now than when I started the thread I think!

Will talk with DH in the morning and come back with a progress report!

[NNChangeAgain]

the final say in any big decisions are down to her mum and DH - that's the way it should be.

In which case, they should take responsibility for following through on those decisions - such as transport to and from the school they have chosen, for instance.

What appears to be happening is that you are stepping back from being involved in decision making, but being relied on to action the decisions that your DH and his ex are making.

[JacquettaWoodville]

Also, OP, if DSD is to apply for schools in your area, that usually means her primary residence would be with you, and councils do check this.

[followTheyellowbrickRoad]

OP I think you sound lovely. I would broach the reducing maintenance with your partner and see what he thinks. Have a check on the cm calculator and see what the reduction is for more nights.

Don't worry about the school run, it's doable. With my youngest I was doing the school run when he was 6 days old. And it was a hour round trip as I didn't drive. I just made sure I had plenty of time to feed him before we left. And I had a good routine so I was organise.

[AvaCrowder]

Why are you talking about reducing maintainence? I don't care, but I think you do. Not cool.

[LondonSouth28]

I think you may end up resenting your DSD, her mum and your DH with this new arrangement.

You don't yet know what your baby will be like. My DS would have happily done the car journey but my DD up until about 6 months old would have screamed the whole way (she liked to be on me a lot). I cannot tell you how stressful driving with a small screaming baby is - it's truly awful.

Also this is your special time with your first newborn baby, you won't want to be thinking of what you need to do with your DSD, especially if it's on the back of a sleepless night (you're unlikely to avoid those altogether!). You want to be able to snooze of the couch with your baby, go for a walk when you want with baby, allow ZERO noise in the house while baby sleeps etc! You (ideally) need the flexibility to be able to ensure you and your baby get a good start and routine.

I would suggest you make no amendments to the current arrangements but at the 6 month mark you could reevaluate and see if you could do more. This your maternity leave and I do sense your DSDs step mum and your DH are slightly taking advantage of it because they know you adore DSD. You are the only potential loser in this proposed arrangement and changing it back will be tricky.

[cexuwaleozbu]

By the way, if dsd is about to turn 10 and is therefore in year 5 you are only 1 year away from needing to make choices about secondary schools (it's not a couple of years away as said upthread). Given that it will be more difficult to manage going to open days when you have a baby under the age of 12 months this time next year it might be wise to be going to open days this month.

[Marilynsbigsister]

AvaCrowder wtf ? OP is looking after her DSD way more than the child's own mother, to whom maintenance is currently paid. Of course it should stop. !! Not 'cool' ??? Wtf are you on about .

The real questions are : why has ops DSD been pushed off to her DSM (not even over to her dad as he is at work) and how much will her mother be paying you in maintenance.?

What has caused the change.? Has DSD been pushed out of home since her DM married and had other children. ?

You are very kind but being taken for a mug. Absolutely should be a 3 person discussion. If you are being expected to do all this work, cheeky feckers agreeing this on your behalf .

As for you paying ANYTHING, no! We have 2 of dhs Dcs live with us, I do not pay, they are his and ex wife's responsibility. I will 'front ' any costs if out with them, DH then transfers to me. I have three of my own, the costs being shared between my ex and myself. You have really got to start standing up for yourself a bit more.

As for DH not driving ?? Unless it's for medical reasons he needs to learn !! My pet hate are spouses of either sex who cop out of this as its a bloody pita being the only driver in a relationship-especially with Dcs as they get older and start doing stuff. Inexcusable not to bother to learn unless legally prevented from doing so .

[Penfold007]

Your being used a cheap childcare by both this child's mother and father

[lilydaisyrose]

You sound so lovely OP and do dedicated to your DSD. Please let us know how the chat with your DH goes.

[lilydaisyrose]

*so dedicated

[howtodowills]

Don't do it OP - your mat leave is for your new baby - not ferrying around your SD for her mother.

Think very very carefully!

[Starla268]

Wow - all these replies! Thank you so much to everyone for commenting, its really helped me think things through.

Jaquetta, yes I suppose decisions need to be made in a year - I meant it would be two years until she changes school (she just started yr5) - its an ongoing discussion between everyone at the moment (DSD included) as ideally she would like to stay in the area shes in at the moment in terms of moving up with some of her existing friends but there are big concerns about the school in her catchment (poor performance, bullying highlighted in the latest ofsted etc) so we are all concerned that she doesn't end up in a school she is unhappy at. Its not a decision that's going to be made right now but we are all aware that her main residency would need to change if she did decide on school here and that we need to be able to prove the new arrangement to the council.

followTheyellowbrickRoad, thank you - it's reassuring to hear that others have managed it :)

AvaCrowder, ?? Not quite sure what you mean...

LondonSouth28, I really appreciate your thoughts and concern, obviously if we had no other children then my mat leave would be a time exclusively for me and baby but the reality is that there is another child who also needs caring for. I honestly don't feel resentful, I knew DH had a DD when I met him and I've fully embraced our life as a family. I know other SM's like to keep things quite separate in terms of childcare/money but it's just not the way we've worked things. I love spending time with DSD and have gained such a lot from my relationship with her - I'll admit that I am particularly lucky as she is such an easy, good natured little girl and she accepted me completely since day 1.

I know the arrangement benefits her mum and I potentially 'lose' but for me it's not about the adults, its about a little girl who potentially benefits a lot by not having to go the childminder, seeing a bit more of her Dad on the weekday evenings (and me of course!) and spending time getting to know her new sibling.

Marilynsbigsister, you make a good point and yes things are not perfect at home for DSD. She has a new little sister (2yo) and she doesn't get on with her new SD. Her mum is a brilliant mum but has been let down by her new partner who does nothing to help around the house or with childcare which mans DSD is often with childminder, after school clubs, friends house etc or is at home looking after her new little sister while mum gets on with things round the house. It's not an ideal situation for DSD and she has said she would like to spend more time at ours. As I said before I'm so aware of not wanting her to feel pushed out when the baby comes. The arrival of her new sister at her mums has completely turned her world upside down (they got pregnant very early on in the relationship so it was new step dad, step brother, house and baby sister in a matter of months when she had lived her whole live being just her and her mum)

Oh and DH has already started driving lessons - don't worry! He won't be ready to take his test for a little while yet but I've absolutely made sure he'll be driving too!

I'm a bit worried I've painted myself as a cinderella character here which isn't the case! While the main discussion has been between DH and the mum he has consulted me and I've also always said in the past that I'm happy to help with childcare stuff if it means DSD can be with us a bit more. And while I'll be doing a few long drives a week with the new arrangement I don't have a whole heap to do at home as we have a cleaner and gardener so I don't want you you all feel unduly sorry for me!

[NNChangeAgain]

I'll admit that I am particularly lucky as she is such an easy, good natured little girl and she accepted me completely since day 1.

As she gets older that may not always be the case.

You need to consider the possibility that your time with her may not always be as rewarding for you and that she may openly resent and reject you.

A recalcitrant, resentful teen and a toddler will be very different to a new born and a 10 year old with a sunny disposition.

[Starla268]

That's quite negative Change. I'm well aware that as she grows she will change but regardless of that she will still be DH's child and my stepdaughter and she will have a place in our family despite any difficulties we might experience as she grows up. In that way it's really no different to if she was my child - we'd have to find a way to work through it as a family.

It's not really relevant to the current question anyway - at the moment she's a great kid and we enjoy each other's company so unless she has an overnight personality change it think we'll be ok in the short term :)

I've had a long chat with DH and we've agreed to drop the Monday pickup but keep all the others for the meantime and if I find the routine ok with the baby we can look at changing around. In order to still help out DSD's mum on the Monday he's going to talk to his parents about them taking that one on which would mean she could be dropped off at ours potentially and still have the night here, or be dropped at her mums so we'll keep that flexible. DH has also said he is willing to do some pick ups as his work schedule allows by train (not ideal as its a long round trip but good to have as a back up if I'm struggling). We've also had a think about what we might do if I do struggle with screaming baby on school runs and we can pull in support from his parents, my mum and step mum (I have a big blended family too!) and our dear friend who lives with us and has said he would be happy to either watch baby for an hour or come along on the school run with me.

If we aren't taking on the Monday full time then I don't think it's appropriate to talk about changes to maintenance but DH has agreed that if we do end up doing it full time he will have a discussion with her mum about reducing it to give us a bit more for petrol while I'm off on mat leave.

Thank you all for your insights and comments, this was my first ever time posting on mumsnet and it really helped me think more clearly about what I'm taking on and hopefully the conversation with DH has helped us troubleshoot any potential issues before we're thrown into the middle of this new routine and a new baby.

[Somerville]

That sounds really positive, Starla. Have to say, it's unusual to say the least for some of the maintenance money to come out of a step parents pocket (as I understand it that has been happening?) which is why you've been met with a bit of bemusement I think. But you sound happy with the situation so it's all okay I guess.

It's also unusual, though less so, for a step parent to do as much for their step child as you're taking on - it's sometimes viewed as the father being out of order to prioritise his career over his new partner's AND time with his child. But again, you're happy with the arrangement and you'd be taking the mat leave and drop in earnings anyway.

You should make sure that when you go back to work you don't directly lose out financially because of extra responsibilities you're taking on - for either child actually. So if you shorten your hours in order to continue dropping DSD at school and baby at your mums, your DH should take over paying more of the bills and mortgage, to the point where you both have similar disposable incomes for extras. Does that make sense?

[JacquettaWoodville]

The CSA would also allow a drop in maintenance following the birth of a new child to the NRP. I am not recommending this if you can manage as of course the expenses of the first child haven't changed, but it but one to bear in mind for the wider discussion.

You will apply for secondary school by 31 October 2017 so you need to decide by then where her primary residence will be going forward.

[JacquettaWoodville]

I also think that your DH and ideally her mum need to be able to participate in journeys.

Separately, I have a couple of male friends who only got round to learning to drive when their wives were pregnant in order to drive them to the hospital and around afterwards (in case of c section) and I would definitely suggest DH does this it if possible. You may be very tired and it would be fair to share the weekend driving at the very least even if you didn't have dsd to consider.

[NNChangeAgain]

Good point about c-section, woodville - OP your DH and his ex need a backup plan for the school run and any collections/drop offs they rely on you for - because you won't be able to drive for over a month after delivery if you've had a c-section, so the month you're planning to adapt to having a new baby won't be long enough.

[yodaonthebars]

Firstly you sound lovely and it must be a relief for Mum that she has someone who so clearly cares in her life.

As long as you have been consulted on the change and are happy with it then the only thing I would suggest is that your dh contributes heavily to the extra costs/treats/days out and petrol you will gain as a result of the extra days.

It is absolutely not your position to take on all the extra costs involved.

[yodaonthebars]

What I mean is don't be in a position where dad and Mum both have time and money to go out and do stuff or buy stuff for themselves but you can't because you are paying most of the day to day costs and most of the childcare.

How is this arrangement going to work with baby too? If you are with baby everyday and he only usually pays the costs when he has them?

[Starla268]

Somerville, the way we work it is with a spreadsheet for all household expenses which includes car, mortgage, bills etc and maintenance. I've always been happy with that as to be honest the car is much more per month and it is me that gets the majority of the benefit from it as its my transport to and from work. We then split the bill dependant on our incomes (which has changed over the years - used to be half and half, currently more like 1/3 to 2/3rds and dropping to be only paying 1/5 when i finish work).

DH does do a lot for DSD, it' just that his work gives him less flexibility than mine does and he doesn't drive (yet!). While it looks like a lot that I'm doing all the lifts etc he does do a lot with her in the evenings (help with homework, games, stories) and I'm happy to facilitate with lifts if it mean they get to spend more time together, and we get more time as a family. I think we have a pretty good division of labour overall in the home so I'm not too worried on that front.

Wrt careers, DH earns way, way more than me so there would be no doubt that my work would need to take a back foot while we build our family and to be honest, I'm quite glad to be taking a break! I've worked bloody hard to build myself up to a very good position in the field I work in but I'll be able to go back at the same level part time and have plans to advance a bit further (MSc and Phd hopefully) when my DC are a bit older and DH is fully supportive of that.

And yes, it makes perfect sense re: splitting the bills when I go back to work and we plan on that. It's hopefully only this year that will be a bit stretched for us as DH's salary and bonuses are looking set to increase so he'll be able to take on more of the household stuff in a year or so we hope. As a result of this thread and our conversation we've actually realised that we hadn't added in the rent we are charging our friend (who only moved in last week) into our calculations so we've agreed I can have all of that each month which puts me in a much better position :)

JacquettaWoodville, there is no chance that DSD's mum would be able to help with journeys without a car and with her other DD as well. To be fair to her it was us that made a decision to move further away (we did all live in the same place). She will occasionally drop DSD off by train if I'm away/unavailable. DH will be doing what he can once he has his licence but unfortunately that isn't going to be before baby arrives now.

And really good point about the c-section, we will be able to manage with grandparents help but it might mean that DSD's mum has to arrange some childcare for that period too so we will definitely make sure we put a plan in place in case that does happen.

Thank you all again for all your comments, I know some of you think I'm a bit mad doing what I do but I've really valued all the thoughts and I feel much more prepared than I was before (for eventualities I probably hadn't considered!)

[Starla268]

Yoda, thank you that's very kind of you to say :)

When I say I tend to get stuff if I'm with her and DH if he is, I'm really only taking about treats on days out - so for example I took her away for a couple of nights in summer hols and paid for dinner and lunch out etc, if they were having a daddy and daughter day he'd pay for that. We of course do a lot as a family too and he tends to foot the bill for most of those days out.

In terms of the baby, it's not going to be having 'treats' in the same way that DSD does when it's only a tiny baby so it shouldn't be an issue and of course he would never see me short of there was something I wanted to do with baby that cost a bit.

I will of course make sure I'm not missing out on my own disposable income while I'm not earning and we've adjusted household stuff to account for my reduced earnings. I've also been putting away a bit over the last year so I can keep paying myself a little 'salary' for my treats. I also have a couple of holidays booked without DH so I'm not being hard done by :)