toxic nightmare exw .

[wowis]

Hi all,
Dp exw is just toxic . She uses the dsc to reflect her feelings of dp ( she left him years before we met ) any time she is unhappy with dp ( usually when she doesn't have a boyfriend ) or most recently because their shared home is due to go up for sale as agreed by them both five years ago in a court order and she can't afford to buy him out. She then tells the girls everything . Everything! From her point of view About how their dad is 'kicking them out on to the street' is lying to them, etc etc . They are 8 and 12 and sadly can come across very spoilt and entitled as exw has influenced them as such . They have a great time with us but half an hour before going back to mum they withdraw earphones in , 'I feel sick 'etc etc or if we discipline they phone mum and say they're unhappy and mum withdraws access etc so they know what keeps mum on side and when they get back to mum its we were bored , we don't want to go again which fits in with exw critical view of dp. We have all been to family therapy the therapist has told us exw has brainwashed them but she's so intimidating and defended honestly I think the therapist is out of her depth... I've read a few threads where people seem to have been through similar .... Suppose I just wanted some support or stories of how this stuff can turn out . We are now going for court ordered access but are mindful she coaches the kids just like she did in therapy and the therapist said they are trained to agree with and protect mum. Just .... Help?!

[wowis]

Hi all thanks for your posts, she agreed because she thought in five years she'd be able to buy him out but she started her PhD and has taken much longer than she anticipated to finish it . She said she didn't want a member order because she would be working etc she could work now I was a single mum with three kids and worked while I trained. My dp said he would consider a variation on terms to give her more time to finish the training and get a job to get a mortgage but she won't put in for a variation because she doesn't see why she should have to pay for it.
He does need the money and has been working to a five year plan. She hasn't I assume because she thought she'd be working or cohabiting. Totally appreciate the thoughts about the kids and their home but this was what was agreed and it would be manageable if she did t present it this way. They agreed on a 50 50 split in Imediation with the childcare since this she has pulled access back every time she is unhappy . He now sees them for a few hours a week If he tells them his plans before hand and they all agree it's 'fun' enough . If they don't she doesn't let them come.

[BoneyBackJefferson]

Learningtoletgo

I don't understand why if he lived with his parents while he saved up got his own home so they could have less upheaval for the kids there shouldn't be a mesher order in place for the kids to stay put until they were 18?

Because the ex agreed to something different, why she agreed we will never know unless the ex posts

[Learningtoletgo]

No got that bit thanks. I'm just trying to look at it from the kid's perspective.

I don't understand why if he lived with his parents while he saved up got his own home so they could have less upheaval for the kids there shouldn't be a mesher order in place for the kids to stay put until they were 18? He's got his home, she's got hers whilst the kids are growing up and then when the youngest is 18 sell the house and split the money?

You said he would support a variation order, what change would he support? Why would she be against a variation?

Believe me my husband went through 2 years of legal hell with his ex through the courts, so I know how awful this is.

I'm not unsympathetic OP I'm just thinking there might be an easier way all round.

[Hatethis22]

Did you miss the bit where he gave her 5 years to continue living in the house?

[Learningtoletgo]

I completely understand how draining this is but I do think kids need stability regardless if whether they've lived in that house 1 year or 10. As a kid I had to move from the family home after the divorce and it was devastating. Please don't minimise the impact on the kids by blaming it all on the ex. Maybe the kids really do feel the way they do, they are just not really being listened to because both parents have their own agendas.

BTW any counsellor who undermines a child's view like that is not really very good. It's about their feelings and emotions not correcting legal points.

I'm also a step mum and my husband gave 100% of the family home to his ex because he wanted the kids to have a stable home. They are both grown now and the benefits of that stability have been immense. Much better than my own experience

If he needs the money then that's a different issue. But please don't minimise the impact by blaming it all on the ex.

[wowis]

quite
thanks for that because honestly I don't think people realise how sapping this is emotionally unless theyve had the experience, we got engaged last month and I think she's upping the anti since then. My dp even looked into buying the house and renting it to her to avoid the shit storm we knew would come but to be honest he's so scared of having her as a tenant that even if we could afford it everyone has said don't go there.
I have a good relationship with the kids and have worked very hard for that but she calls me that woman or his girlfriend to the kids and the therapist and always has. It's like im the ow but we met years after they split.
she's ruining those kids and I feel so sorry for dp. He says they aren't growing into the people I know they could be etc.
thanks for the support.

[QuiteLikely5]

Try not to let the woman burn your emotional energy. She really isn't worth it.

Try not to worry too much about the children. I know it's hard but it is her who is damaging them, not you.

Be polite and civil to them always and leave everything else to the parents as your role with SC can be a thankless one.

And because this woman has been so vile if I was your dp I would refuse her request.

[wowis]

thanks everyone, we have already sat them down and explained all this (only because they already knew about it not because we felt they should know about it) we never criticise their mum and never would always just say it isn't how mum sees it because a judge has to decide etc.
My dp is due 40 percent of the money from the house and has planned for it plus this isn't the only house theyve ever known I don't know where that came from..she just doesn't want to move.
The therapist asked the girls in their session how do you feel about dad they said they don't like him because he is making them sell the house. The therapist said thats not astrictly true a judge makes that decision etc. she only used brain washed with us in our session (although a blind man on a galloping horse can see it is absolutely that) it's parental alienation . Just awful.
with regards to it being legal suicide if my dp ignored the court order then in 2 years after finsishing the phd he says ok buy me out now and she says she can't still, or she has changed her mind, my dp would have no legal footing to enforce the sale because he had ignored an order in the first place.Our solicitor said a judge would most likely force sale of the hopuse rather than grant it because quite frankly she's taking the piss. Bur either way ofcourse she can now ask for the terms to change.
He was asked to leave by her originally, lived with his parents while he saved up got his own home so they could have less upheaval for the kids. To manage all this he has been working to a 5 year plan as agreed by them both and in an ideal world would absolutely like his money now and his name off the mortgage. However if she puts in for a variation of terms he would consider this but she won't.
we think she's hoping that by making the kids hate him more he'll 'cave' not that he can 'cave' as it's not his decision.

[NoSmileToday]

I don't think your family therapist was any good at all!

I am shocked they used such words as brainwashing and discussing with such young children the sale of the home

The ex may well be toxic but you cannot control her behaviour. All their dad and you can do is reassure them that the sale of their home ( try to remember that this has been their home all their life and the worries and upset regarding it's sale may not come entirely from mum) is a legal decision and you are unable to change it.

Counter act what their mum is saying with simple truths and leave out any "your mum is wrong/lying" as the DC will be very loyal towards her.

Courts are very good at spotting when children have been coached so try not to worry.

All you can do is support your DP it is very stressful but remember you will have very little input in court and you kid of need to remove yourself from it.

[Learningtoletgo]

Why would it be legal suicide?

How about going back to court to extend it to a mesher order so they can stay until they are 18?

Does your DP need the money?

[Bananasinpyjamas1]

I think if she is telling your DSDs that you are forcing the sale then it is OK to counter this. As the kids will be worried. I'd sit down with them next time that they come and explain that it is a judge that can only change that now, that it is not DF and not to worry they will never be homeless, they have a home with you whenever they like and that there are lots of options for their mum. Say that these are really adult concerns and then answer any questions they might have.

[wowis]

meridian thanks so much for your response she agreed 5 years for the house to retrain (she is a qualified radiographer anyway but wanted to retrain which is fine) she decvided to do a phd during this time and it's taking longer than she first thought so she wants longer in the house. This is fine but she has to ask for it as she wants it. She sees it as 'you won't give me longer'
we cannot give it a judge would have to but instead of doing it properly she's become incredibly angry and critical and told her dd that my dp is forcing the sale.
Obviously children shoulen't be involved in these matters anyway but she shares everything saying they need to know what he's really like etc. (she shares her own love life too as the girls tell us...' mum is dating so and so but she doesn't love him yet and she has others lined up on match...')

I was worried I was going to start getting flamed on here to be honest but it is the most awful draining thing to get consdtant texts and then the eldest dsd texts 'mum says youre lying to us why would you do that?' etc etc
we try to reassure them and the family therapist said to the girls this is not your dads choice its what both your parents agreed etc and any decent parent would make it an adventure eg 'were moving and get to pick a new house! how exciting etc etc but shes so unhappy about moving she's terrifying them .saying he'll kick us out over my dead body etc.
its just awful.

[MeridianB]

Wowis, that sounds hard going.

The house issue is not unusual. You could look on it in a positive way - that they were lucky to be able to keep living there for as long as five years. Many splitting couples have to (or want to) sell immediately.

Does your DH reassure them and try to correct the misinformation or does the therapist say that would be making the same mistake of over-involving?

[wowis]

Hi thanks for your reply were not pushing it forward we can't ignore the court order she can ask for a variation of terms but won't saying why should she spend her money on it. Plus she gets 60 percent of the sale giving herb130,000 plus. We have taken legal advice and been told it would be legal suicide to ignore the order . Which she agreed to!

[SocksRock]

I think unless there is some utterly compelling reason why the house needs to be sold, the fact that you are pushing through with a sale that will remove his children from the only house they've ever known is most certainly going to result in issues.

How are they going to be housed once it's sold?