Am I old fashioned for wanting to date before sex?

[Heidi3333]

Hi I'm 45 and haven't had sex for nearly 10 years!!
I have let plenty of men - both
In real life and online - but most of them want sex before even going on a date.

Most recently a male friend I liked came round to my flat to visit a few times. He never once asked me out on a date but
Instead thought it was ok to start feeling my bum when I got up off the sofa to make him a coffee. I told him to p!ss off.

Then another guy who I'm friends with on FB and is a tradesman who has done work in my house a few times started sending me sexy messages and asking for nude pictures. When I suggested meeting for a coffee instead he said he wouldn't be available for 5 weeks as he was too busy.

This is just 2 examples of what I'm on about. If a man behaves like this then it just turns me off and things never move forward.

Am I old fashioned? Is the only way to get a man these days to put out first?

Sometimes I despair 😩

[Namechangednorth]

In my dating days I never considered having sex within the first few dates, despite maybe feeling the urge because as one poster said it is a great filter.

To be fair I never experienced a bloke that was so shallow and it was always at least weeks before I would have sex and my first BF at 19 it was three months and he was a bit older than me . It was good for the anticipation though waiting

[Roberts25]

Nope not old fashioned, its actually a great way to filter out abusive men. I alway advise victims of domestic violence to wait until after 6th date to have sex because violent men wouldnt wait that long. I ideally advise to wait until 8th date.

Its also best to wait in my opinion if what you're looking for is a serious relationship.

[gingganggooleywotsit]

Don’t blame you

[JustAnotherOldMan]

I used to like to date 1st, but I’m older (50+),
However the last 2 people I dated (no sex), seemed to be after extra things before even the 2nd date (could you pay this bill, deal with this other issue etc), felt like I was being used a meal ticket, so given up on women for now

[gingganggooleywotsit]

Sad I used to love the build up of dating and snogging/touching up before having full sex after a few weeks/months of dating. Soooo sexy! I’m 43 this was the norm when I was last dating at 25. God help me if I ever become single again don’t think I could take OLD

[santabetterwashhishands]

Your not old fashioned but I think a lot of people are more open to first date sex than previously,I actually prefer the dates as a kind of build up of excitement.

[mistletoeandsigh]

Upfront is fine. But grabbing a friend's arse as a seduction technique really falls short. Subtlety is far more sexy.

[MintyCedric]

It's not ideal, but I must admit that in some ways I much prefer it if a bloke is upfront about what he's after.

I recently spent a few days chatting to an apparently lovely bloke. There were a few cheeky comments but mostly about books, food, our families...he came across intelligent, well read, dry sense of humour, told me he fancied me. I couldn't believe my luck.

Then we got onto chatting about our OLD experiences and I mentioned that about 70% of the guys I'd matched with had gone straight from 'hello' to 'bra size...pics?' and how tedious it was.

Next thing I knew I'd been ghosted! I'd have much rather hed told me what he was after from the outset rather than wasting my time and, tbh, getting my hopes up.

[Hollyhocksarenotmessy]

I'm pretty sure they were all married as well.

[Heidi3333]

Hollyhocks yes I do think it is a single mum thing too. I think they must see us as easy prey and sitting at home lonely and desperate for sex. Nothing could be further from the truth. Really gets on my nerves 😡

[Hollyhocksarenotmessy]

I wonder if it is a single mum thing. I swear that I had a 5 year stint of creeps wanting instant no strings sex in a creepy way. Not even 'normal' 1 night stands, as in meet someone out, have a laugh, dance, and go home together. But situations where i'd be expecting an invitation to a date.

It was horrible. I think they do believe you are desperate for a shag. With any random man.

[Anotheruser02]

I'm finding this too. I've spelt it out on a few occasions that I just need to feel a bit chill with someone first, tbh I would happily go there after 3 dates or so usually, but it's highlighted as a disappointment before that like wanting a couple of dates is stringing someone along. I find the pushyness a massive turn off.
I don't even need to be seeing someone or thinking it will head anywhere serious, I don't have sex as an investment into the future, but to enjoy it I do need to feel relaxed with a man so to feel his frustration that he had to go out with me first makes me feel anxious. Generally I'm quite tactile, I love dates and talking to people, I've no problem kissing and joking around but I don't want to be naked and vulnerable with someone the first or second time I meet them. About 10 years ago I did a lot of internet dating and it was really fun, usually would go home with someone third or fourth date and that was never questioned, I don't know if men in their 30's are better mannered than in their 40's or if times have changed that badly but something is different.

[Gwenhwyfar]

"Yes consent is vital, but it’s not a written or verbal agreement in the vast majority of cases. It’s reading subtle signs and signal, and knowing when to stop if you read them incorrectly."

Yes, but someone who goes straight to hand on the bum without any other closeness is not taking the time to read the signals?

[Heidi3333]

The little weasel

Maybe I've just been unlucky but in my experience 99% of men bring up the S word before we even had our first date! Very frustrating and disappointing 😔

[Thelittleweasel]

@Heidi3333

Oh please tell me this is not now the norm. In my day the suggestion was "bonk on the third date"

[TooTrueToBeGood]

I really don’t think the seeking consent thing is complicated.

Of course it's not. Simple rule - if you are not 100% sure you have consent then assume you don't. Enthusiastic consent is extremely bloody obvious. The problem is men who think no means maybe or the absence of an explicit no means an implied yes.

[StarlightLady]

I really don’t think the seeking consent thing is complicated. If you put your hand on someone’s shoulder (possibly a good starting point) or go to hold somebody’s hand, it should be obvious if it welcome or not. If those welcome signals are clearly given, without coercion, that is consent.

If, say, you are going to put your hand in someone’s knickers, it’s right to check they are comfortable with your actions.

Avoid intimate areas for the first touch and, if touch is welcome, continue to know, the difference between a caress and a grab or a grope.

[Heidi3333]

Sirgirwan she was almost a miracle baby! I used a sperm donor and IvF to have her.

[SirGawain]

[quote Heidi3333]@lhg I think there is a difference between putting your arm around someone and touching someone's hand to feeling their bum! The latter is overtly sexual. The fact the guy done it in front of my 4 year old made it seem even more inappropriate.[/quote]
I thought that you said in your opening post that you hadn’t had sex for ten years; was you four year old a miracle birth!

[Ihg27]

I have kissed loads of people with verbal or written consent! Does anyone really say, is it ok if I put on hand on your cheek, the other on your hip, and my lips on your? Could I please have further permission to put my tongue in your mouth and it you haven’t pushed me away after 30-45 seconds I might move my left hand onto your bum.

Yes consent is vital, but it’s not a written or verbal agreement in the vast majority of cases. It’s reading subtle signs and signal, and knowing when to stop if you read them incorrectly.

For the record I have had far more women put hands on me first than I have in return. Especially when dancing in clubs. Loads of woman think Kirk thing of just coming up and grinding against you or grabbing your arse or crotch.

I either reciprocate or tell them to do one.

[AverageGuy]

And then there is explicit consent, and implicit consent.

Imho, explicit is where a question has been asked and answered - "can I kiss you?" "yes" - obvious, and without room for misunderstanding.

Implicit is where you might chance a feel of a buttock, or something, and get no resistance or told to stop.

I'm afraid to admit I've done both, (and I defy any man to say / prove they haven't!) but since my divorce, I'm all about the explicit.

Oh, I'm 58, and have had a marriage, ltr's, ONS's & FWB - if it matters...

[AverageGuy]

@Ihg27
Interesting.
I got royally lambasted on the dating forum because I admitted that I occasionally touch a date on the leg or arm to make a point during conversation.

I was told that I was "part of the problem" re sexual abuse... Needless to say, I'm no longer part of that forum.

I would say it's tricky. At what point should you ask for consent?

I have, in the past, kissed a woman without consent - am I a sex pest?

I have also asked a woman for consent before anything I considered overtly sexual, but my view of "overtly sexual" might not match someone elses...

Where does one draw the line?

Certainly, if I did something, and was told "no", then I wouldn't try it again.

[Happyhusband]

Yes what he said. Quality and respect.

[TooTrueToBeGood]

I'm the same as Paul. I'm in my mid fifties now and have never had a one night stand or sex with any woman I wasn't in a meaningful relationship with. I don't in any way judge anyone who lives their life differently but I don't feel any regret or that I've missed out on anything, quite the opposite really. It's not about being old fashioned, it's about being confident in yourself and not feeling pressured to compromise your expectations and personal preferences.

[Heidi3333]

@lhg I think there is a difference between putting your arm around someone and touching someone's hand to feeling their bum! The latter is overtly sexual. The fact the guy done it in front of my 4 year old made it seem even more inappropriate.