GCSE Options - impact on Oxbridge application

[NL3]

DS1 is in Yr9 of a state comp. Quite bright - but also quite lazy.

We have to choose his GCSE options soon and I have a couple of questions that I hope someboby can answer.

Do your options at GCSE have any impact on your chances of gaining admission to Oxford or Cambridge?

Are any courses perceived as "soft" options similar to the list at A-level that top universities won't count?

Is it ok to choose solely academic subjects?

Any advice on this specific list -

English Language and Literature
Maths
Triple Science
French
Mandarin
History
Geography
RE
Citizenship
Economics

Thanks in advance for any help
m

[gramercy]

What about subjects such as Greek and Latin that are only offered at some institutions? Do they get you more Brownie points?

I think it is very unfair (as has been discussed on other threads) that lack of opportunity to study certain subjects, let alone French - which seems a basic part of a normal person's education - can act against you.

It's one thing choosing to study Mickey Mouse GCSEs and quite another being forced to take them because that's all on offer.

[webwiz]

Its amazing the amount of variety between schools in the way they allow options to be chosen - right from insisting on a specialism subject (PE or technology), choosing subjects in year 8 and offering a vast array of "modern" subjects. I'm quite relieved that my DC's school actually offer very little choice. English x 2, Maths, Science x2 (or 3), RE, a language and ICT short course were all compulsory. That left 3 choices which was enough to follow an area of interest without going too much off track. I'm hoping that when DS chooses next year it will be the same.

My friends DC go to a school that offers a massive amount of choice in options - she was given the weekly timetabled hours and then invited to "fill in" the choices with only English, Maths and Science x 2 compulsory. So rather than using columns they had the hours per subject for both full and short course GCSEs for all the other subjects and as her DD couldn't make up her mind what to do she has taken lots of short courses which can cause problems if you want to take the A level afterwards.

[ShrinkingViolet]

DD1 is slightly concerned that she'll be "marked down" for having done Media Studies - as an extra in Y10 for the top English set. I'm trying to reassure her that it won't make any difference (she has another 10 GCSEs at A/A*), and the fact that she did it a year early will make it obvious it was done as an extra. Am I right do you think?

[webwiz]

I wouldn't worry ShrinkingViolet - DD2 took Dance GSCE in year 10 and got a B but she has another 10 GCSEs at A/A* so I'm presuming she doesn't need to bin the Oxford application on the strength of it

[Builde]

Interesting that Oxbridge doesn't ask for a modern language anymore...surely most schools offer modern languages. All the ones around us do.

Infact, my old comp. offers a choice of 6 languagues at GCSE level: French, Spanish, Latin, German, Russian, Japanese. Some of them aren't timetabled and you have to do them in after school clubs.

If music GCSE if regarded as 'soft' then it must have changed. I spent far longer composing the music for my GSCE than I probably devoted to maths, physics, chemistry and biology put together.

[Builde]

I don't think any of your child's choices will have an impact...Cambridge is more interested in aptitude and enthusiasm than the exact set of GCSEs you've done.

I did 13 GCSEs and I'm not sure it impressed them; they were more interested in my A-level results.

[qumquat]

I think that often it's not that a subject is considered as 'soft' but that it isn't relevant to the Oxford/Cambridge course. Eg. on that Trinity College link it said they preferred English Literature to Language, I Think it's likely this is because Cambridge offers only an English Literature course, in which case the choice to just study Language at A level and then apply to do English at Cambridge would seem a bit odd. Equally the Modern Languages course are incredibly Literature heavy, so if you don't show an interest in literature in your A level choices you probably won't like the course.

I went to Cambridge and my impression was that academic ability was assumed, the way that you could set yourself apart at interview was to show passion and enthusiasm for your chosen subject, learning in general, and whatever extra-curricular activities turn you on. I disagree with the previous poster who siad good candidates get in and bad candidates don't. Sadly plenty of good candidates don't get in as practically everyone who applies is a good candidate (this was also the opinion of my Cambridge tutor, who did not enjoy having to choose between all the good candidates!).

[calvi]

Arionater

DS has chosen Physics for As and continuing iwth Economics,Maths and History at A2. He wants to study either History and Economics or Economics and Management at Oxford. In your or anyone elses opinion are these wise choices - presumably he can only talk knowledgably about the subjects at interview if he has studied them at advanced level?

[Milliways]

They sound good to me Calvi.

Re Economics at GCSE, DS's (very high ranking) Grammar school offers this as well as Business studies, which really surprised me as I thought them both "soft". They were adamant that with all the compulsory subjects these were fine, and no by taking them had had any Uni offer compromised (and they do have a high Oxbridge result).

DD took 11 GCSE's, 7 Compulsory subjects (triple science, Maths, Eng Lang & Lit, Philosophy & Ethics) + 4 options of Geography, History & 2 languages. She is now at Cambridge. She is also aware that a lot of her friends at other Uni's have a lot more free time & "life"-so make sure you really are dedicated to you subject as the workloads are very intense.

[lazymumofteenagesons]

Milliways - your daughter's comments are very interesting. My son decided not to try for Cambridge saying it was too intense and he didn't want to spend the next 3 years working his socks of with little social life. I just thought he was being lazy. But maybe he actually knew this environment would not suit him.

[ruggermum]

My DS might be an outside chance for Oxbridge but I looked at the amount of work expected of them and thought it was too much. I asked if there was any sort of concession for anyone playing for first XV and they said not. I would prefer it if DS went somewhere less intense that allowed time for his rugby (which is his true passion). If he wants to go then I will support him but I am not going to try to persuade him.

[calvi]

Starting to panic - DS was supposed to have his form in on Friday and has now changed his mind and wants to do AS Politics and not Physics as he says it interests him and not interested in pursuing three other subjects that he is predicted to get A*s for at GCSE. Is Politics a 'soft' option?

I am already concerned that he is restricting his options at A Levels given that Oxford don't even require him to have A Level Economics (again he says it interests him). What happens if he decides that he doesn't like Economics in the first year or finds that he is not so good at it - is he doomed?

[gerontius]

Politics is a bit soft. Someone I know who teaches it claimed you couldn't learn anything from it you couldn't from reading a broadsheet.

[loungelizard]

What does he want to study? My DN been offered place at Oxford (for English) and Politics is one of his A2s. Is he looking to apply for PPE?

[calvi]

Yes loungelizard - PPE or one of the other economics combinations. I was told by one person in admissions that another subject might be better but another one said it was fine. I am getting edgy!!

[loungelizard]

Perhaps its the combination of Economics and Politics?? Perhaps he should do one or the other but not both. The Oxford website gives lots of detailed information about admissions.

[abride]

NL3--your list looks good as it is, what with three sciences and two languages, the two Englishes, history.

[bloss]

Message withdrawn

[MrsMattie]

I would echo what Pixie says (may have a little inside knowledge myself ).

[calvi]

Re AS: Economics dept at Oxford have said basically that they encourage students to take the subjects which interest them the most in order to achieve the highest possible grades.

DS's school had 22 oxbridge acceptances last year (is that good for a state grammar?) and they have advised Politics is fine - so DS will take it at AS and we will keep our fingers crossed!

[gerontius]

Trinity Cambridge list of acceptable A-levels

[Phoenix17]

DS is choosing GCSE options is strong on sciences and aspiring to Oxbridge - he has not got a language on his option list. I know Oxbridge and most unis don't officially require a language - can anyone shed light on how an application would be regarded? He is bright and all teachers predicting A/A* except perhaps Eng. lang. as he is dyslexic

[gerontius]

UCL from 2012 onwards will require a language at GCSE, as Edinburgh mostly does at the moment.

[PeterT]

Having a daughter now at Oxford and two sons one 16 and the other 14 and about to start GSCE courses next year we (my wife & I) have similar concerns and perhaps some insight.

Points I would like to make:

Strongly agree with those who suggest looking at University entrance requirements now as they can be subtly different and may affect choices.

I think that exact subjects is not so important at GCSE as long as only one or two are not traditional academic subjects. It matters a lot more at A level.

The universities like to see consistently high grades. Nowadays 7 A is considered a good starting point for a popular subject at a top university. Getting As in maths and English is particularly important. Where competition is particularly high even B grades are a disadvantage - much better not to take the subject at all if it is not a core one.

Better to sit fewer GCSEs and get more A results. Our daughter only took 9 GCSEs but got A in all of them and this got her the maximum mark (100%) for her GCSE results when applying to Oxford to do medicine. Doing ten GCSEs with 9 A* and 1 A would have got her 90%! However doing 10 subjects is probably about right. Subjects taken early would not have been counted so it may be best to avoid this dilution.

Hope this helps.

[calvi]

Thanks PeterT - DS's son did not give an option to drop any subjects but realise now why a friend's DS dropped Chemistry at his independent after getting a poor mock GCSE result. Wish I had known about this before. I guess his school is more interested in their league table position - I am depressed now!!