Possible to go to Kent grammar if we live outside Kent?

[Bearcricket]

We are planning to go back to the UK from oversea and now trying to understand the procedure of entering grammar schools. It may be a very basic questions for most of you, but it’s be very helpful if anybody tells me if we need to live in Kent when we accept an offer?(of course, necessary to pass the test first though!) thank you.

[njfuller]

I would recommend finding a tutor that lives locally to whichever area you are considering, as the entrance exams for each area vary. Our daughter was successful in the Sutton SET and we found that combining a tutor with mock papers was the best approach (sometimes they just use text books and KS2 work which isn't always quite right). We would have our daughter sit a mock paper, then have the tutor focus on the questions she got wrong - then repeat repeat repeat. You could do it without a tutor if you're prepared to get stuck in!

We used a mock paper website to get the papers, there was passthepaper.co.uk and another that was something like exampapersnow.co.uk.

What I would say, is to make sure that you personally sit in the first 1 or 2 sessions with a tutor as there are plenty of useless tutors out there and your little one won;t be able to tell.

[Panicmode1]

. And yes, sorry OP for the derail!

[SJaneS48]

:-) my DD too currently. The school uniform is a bit shit though and the behaviour of the teacher muttering ‘wtf?’ to herself frequently under her breath is highly dubious!

[Panicmode1]

Works for me, but my boys can get out of bed and be at their desks in under a minute

[SJaneS48]

:-) I’m sure we can both live with that eh @Panicmode1! And apologies to the OP for the off subject Skinners catchment area debate!

[TW2013]

You are both right, it straddles the county border.

[SJaneS48]

Yes it does make sense - I do understand why my E Sussex friends were upset though. And I always thought Groombridge was Kent not E Sussex so learnt something new!

[Panicmode1]

@SJaneS48 - if you look at the catchment map, the line does go just over the border (to places like Groombridge for example). I believe it was a change that KCC asked the West Kent grammars to make in exchange for additional capital funds for building projects - there is a HUGE shortfall in secondary places coming and this is one of the ways they are trying to plug the gaps.....

[acocadochocolate]

Bear in mind that Bromley comprehensives are very good. My DD has just finished y13 at one is (most probably) going to one of top unis to study science. She got mainly 9s at GCSE. I'm sure one of her keys to her success was having a short journey to school, and another was standing out intellectually.

[SJaneS48]

@Panicmode1, the change in 2019 seemed to specifically target the East Sussex boys from what I know (we moved from E Sussex to Kent and friends I have there who had been coaching their boys since Year 4 for 2019 entry were gutted!). This is their Admissions doc which implies 3 mile radius in West Kent (it doesn’t include East Sussex) and named other villages/towns. Certainly where I am in a village outside Sevenoaks, we are further away from Tunbridge Wells then where I lived in E Sussex but the boys applying from here for 2019 entry got in whereas the East Sussex boys didn’t, even the one with a high score. Anyway, everyone is happy with what they got in the end!

[Panicmode1]

@SJaneS48 - I think that Skinners' new catchment was designed to admit as many East Sussex boys as they could, given how close the border is to the school. But my eldest has boys in his year coming from Eastbourne, Hastings, as well as SE London every day, which to me is madness. I know it's a fabulous school, but that is a LOT of travelling over a secondary schooling 'career' and puts a huge amount of pressure on children who are also studying for GCSEs and A Levels. Good to hear about TWGSB because if the test happens as usual in Sept, I'm not sure my Y5 son is going to do as well as he would have done without the structure of school and it may be a bit touch and go as to whether he'll be able to follow his brothers. (I really didn't like the boys grammar when we looked at it for my boys, but to be fair, for one of them, that was just as the headship was changing)

[SJaneS48]

I do get what you are saying re long days and do agree but actually logistically, the East Sussex boys who previously had got in on catchment didn’t have a longer journey in many instances than from where I am now in outer Sevenoaks which is in catchment. Having said that, the East Sussex friends with Year 7s I know who missed out on Skinners this year are liking Tunbridge Wells Boys Grammar and Kent schools should really prioritise Kent children.

[Panicmode1]

Luckily we are v close, but at the time our eldest was going through the sausage machine, there were no inner and outer catchments so we had a true choice. I personally think it is better that they don't have very long journeys. It's fine in the lower end of the school but once the expectations and work rack up for public exams, more than an hour travelling at both ends of the day, possibly after matches/concerts/play rehearsals etc is too much.

[chalkyc2]

But skinners now only accessible if you live pretty close due to changing admissions requirements....

[Panicmode1]

That's why we went for Skinners over Judd too. And we haven't regretted the choice (which we've made twice so far) for a second!

[SJaneS48]

As a (v quick add on!), Judd locally is not everyone’s cup of tea. A friend of mine who viewed it plumped for Skinners instead as they found Judd very robotic. That’s just her opinion obviously but before going for it all guns, it’s really important that you genuinely feel it’s a good fit. And with schools closed and you living on the opposite side of the world currently, not immediately achievable!

[TW2013]

I think that I would start with a realistic assessment of your son's chances. A super selective like Judd is aiming to take the top 5% of the school population- so in an average class of 30 probably one or two children (and that would be if they were all boys!). Obviously this will vary a little by area so in a more affluent area with high parental investment or a private school there will be more in one class who would qualify. You could get him to take a standardised test looking at English, Maths, Verbal and Non Verbal reasoning. He would need scores averaging over about 130. He also would need to pass all of them so no really low scores. A less selective grammar you are probably looking for scores in the region of 115-120.

This could be your lucky year as many companies who would usually do physical mock exams have had to go online using zoom, likewise many tutors are also doing online lessons. It is worth seeking out a mock test from a local company for a realistic assessment of his chances.

You also need to look at the date requirements for applications. For Kent you need to apply in June to take the test. The test itself is early Sept. Results out mid October. Applications in by end October. You need to check for residency and also if flying in for the test consider and quarantine regulations in force at the time.

It will be tough as some children will have been at private schools AND been specifically preparing for this test since yr5 or earlier. It can be done but may be difficult even before you consider the difference in syllabus, for example maths includes algebra and ratio which even in UK isn't covered until yr6.

Another option might be, considering that he has come from a different system and depending on when his birthday is, asking for him to be kept back a year so go into yr4 and then sit the test next September. It is age adjusted so he would need to get an even higher score, but it would buy you time to settle.

Eleveplusexams.co.uk has a forum with very knowledgeable parents who will be able to give you specific guidance for the schools you are interested in.

[Bearcricket]

Thank you so much for your comments! Im sorry that I can’t name each of you.. with your help now we can have a clearer image of our plan. Not concluded yet, but I’m sure we can work out now. Many many thanks to all!

[NewModelArmyMayhem18]

I think that's what Sutton has going for it (in parts) - the spread of detached des res that give it a different vibe to most London suburbs (even the very affluent ones). It doesn't have the character or the Common of Wimbledon Village but housing stock of a more similar genre (except perhaps for Hampstead?) albeit not quite as grand.

I guess some of those areas at the other end of the Northern Line might have the equivalent (isn't that where a lot of the footballers live?) but I don't know that part of London at all.

[SJaneS48]

@NewModelArmyMayhem18, pretty much but mixed in with standard big gaff surburbia! When I lived in SE London many years ago, Bromley seemed decidedly not London. These days it seems pretty indistinguishable to me!

[HappyHammy]

Olave's is easier to get to and you could look at living around that area..what sort of accommodation are you looking for.

[NewModelArmyMayhem18]

When you look at how little you get for your bucks (comparatively) further into London Sutton always seems to be very good value for money in all sorts of ways. I don't really know SE London well enough to give an opinion on Bromley although I do reckon we passed through it going on holiday to Kent some years ago. Am I right in thinking it's full of naice Victorian/Edwardian villas?

[SJaneS48]

:-) And I don’t live in Bromley either but go there frequently so hands up to bias! Clicked your link, I’ve only ever passed through it so not an area I know well. Looks like there are some nice properties towards Cheam if you have a very sizeable wedge to spend but if you reverse the prices, there’s page after page after page of not desperately attractive purpose built flats. But to be fair, Bromley has those too!

[NewModelArmyMayhem18]

And I don't live in Sutton so not really biased. The High Street is a bit variable but it's defo on the up again (or was before COVID-19 struck).

[NewModelArmyMayhem18]

Sutton is a borough in two halves BUT still one of the safest in London (along with Richmond, Kingston and Bexley). And if you don't see the naice side look here.