City of London Boys

[chalkyc2]

Does anyone have recent experience? We are south London based and have been looking more locally, but have widened our net and I'm interested in CLB. Of course 11+ application deadline is next Friday and we've long missed the only open days they do in September!

If anyone has a general low down on the school (and maybe how it compares to the South London independents!) would be really useful!

[rabley01]

Does anyone know how many offers City send out this year for 11+?

[londonista1]

City has always taken a lot more kids from state schools (and on full bursaries) than the other London indies. That's one of the benefits of City - I won't pretend it has the social diversity of a regular London state secondary but it's much more representative of the city than the other top schools, it's closer to a supercharged grammar school than an old public school.

Yes, you'll need tutoring in exam technique and running through a few past papers if you're applying from state, but hothoused candidates can be spotted at interview, as can prep school kids who've rote-learned for a couple of years. And they'll struggle when they actually get to school. Current GCSE/A level results suggest they don't pick too many of those.

[Justrunningaround]

@knitology just backing you up. If you are in a state primary looking to move to a London indie for secondary (I don’t have any knowledge of other areas) then you have no option but to tutor for the reasons you give. Otherwise you are not putting your child on an equal footing with the prep children who are heavily prepared by the schools for 11+.
Having said that, I don’t think it has to be crazy. My DC have done 1 hour tutor + approx 1 hour extra homework every week for the year up to the exams. It has really helped them prepare but I don’t feel that it has stressed them out, and means they have quite enjoyed the exam process as they were well prepared.

[Knitology]

I am most likely going to get vilified for saying this, but I will say it anyway. If a child sitting an independent, selective or grammar school entrance exam is not currently in a prep school, tutoring is mandatory. Either by a professional or with a parent. I will list the reasons why:

1. Children from the majority of state schools are not exposed to the level of detail covered in these exams. Most of them only teach children within the confines of the national curriculum. In addition, they have to ensure every child in a large class is catered for.

1. Keep in mind, these kids are barely ten years old, have never sat an exam in their short lives, so the whole experience is extremely daunting.

3.Most importantly performing well in these tests is a combination of following:

a. Knowledge
b. Technique
c. Accuracy

You cannot hone the above without repeated, targeted practice. Unfair, yes, but this is how it is.

My son (currently in state school in SE London) sat the entrance exams for both City and Trinity. From October 2019, he had group lessons twice a week and we practiced past question papers every week.
Over Christmas, he did a timed question paper everyday.Yes, it was intense, but the whole experience demonstrated the gaps in state education.
Ultimately, if he doesn't receive offers from either school. I will continue to augment and support his education in every possible.

As I said, the whole experience has been an eye-opener. Most, not all state education (primary and secondary) is lacking. The sad reality is as parents we have no choice but to fill those gaps in anyway we can, if we are able to.

[Lightsabre]

It's also not generally true imo that those that were tutored struggle when they get places at these academic schools. Some continue to be tutored all the way through in various subjects but for others, tutoring and the extra work it entailed, set the children up for working hard and seeing the resulting achievements when they put the effort in.

[confusedmumofboys]

I am so disheartened by the entire system. The boy I know well with interview is heavily tutored as well. I know that doesn't change the fact the boy is bright but I can see how the level of tutoring has polished him without him even knowing. My son is raw and I love that but at the same time I dont feel I can find a place for him in this system. A school where smart boys who love to learn can grow together and learn together.

The schools do not care if a child is tutored they even have tutors who discuss their students with them. They care about the Mark's on the day and the highest scores get called back.

City has definitely had a high calibre of applications this year as in the past it was the school many kids who did not get indie indie or grammar got places.

All the best for those looking for schools for their dear sons and daughters!

[MrsPatmore]

The schools are being disingenuous when the y ask parents not to tutor or say they can weed out tutored children. That's not the case. My son and all of the other children we know who were extensively tutored were the ones that walked away with the scholarships and offers. Most of those with a laid back approach didn't receive the offers they really wanted. London day schools are becoming very competitive now although it looks like City might have raised its game this year. In my sons year, boys received offers when they had, for example, not met the Standard for the super selective Grammars.

[confusedmumofboys]

Hi I know 2 mums with boys who have interviews. I was very disappointed my son didnt get through although practically my husband didnt think it was the right school location wise. My son found VR a bit tricky but was happy with the rest. He is not tutored unlike the boy who did get through. I had always thought City was the school for the naturally inquisitive children but realise it has changed a lot. I also believe if they do not get through it isn't the right school for the child.

[leeloo1]

"I don't want DS at a school that he can only access via extensive tutoring and no sports/activities etc"

That was exactly my feeling - if you need so much tutoring then it isn't the right school... But if a big enough group of parents do extensively tutor then I guess it skews the chances of the 'bright but not tutored' kids?

Poor children with so much pressure on them!

[leeloo1]

@FOVapa - I'm glad your ds agreed. When ds said it was straightforward I did worry he'd missed a trick question somewhere! 😂 I wonder if because Westminster already have the iseb test results they can be a bit kinder?

Good luck to your ds for his other interview tmrw and fingers crossed for happier Westminster emails next week!

[chalkyc2]

Huh I don't know - I don't want DS at a school that he can only access via extensive tutoring and no sports/activities etc - it wouldn't be the right place for him. Let hope we can find the right place though....!!

[leeloo1]

I know one boy who got a 10+ place, Sept 19, he was very self assured and had had a lot of tutoring and paused all extra curricular activities... But it obviously paid off. We didn't go down the tutoring route, just did some past papers, perhaps I'm hindsight we should have found a tutor?

[FOVapa]

@ leeloo1 My DS also found it harder than Westminster too! fingers crossed for next week results, for us Alleyns and Westminster and DC interview tomorrow.

[chalkyc2]

Does anyone know anyone who did get an interview?!?

[Binterested]

No here as well. DD is at CLSG so it would have been a nice simple solution for us as a family. No from Merchant Taylor’s too. I think it’s v tough.

[leeloo1]

@FOVapa - ds said it was harder than Westminster, which seemed ironic!

Commiserations to all the boys who didn't make it. I'm hoping ds won't be too disappointed with the news.

[Tot98]

It’s a no for us too! DS said NVR was really hard.

[chalkyc2]

And a no for us too! Ah well! At least not waiting the whole day.

[FOVapa]

It is a no for us too. DS found it the hardest, English hard and did not managed to finish NVR

[leeloo1]

Darn, just heard its a no from city for us. Oh well, at least I know.

[leeloo1]

When do you hear about the local schools? Fingers crossed for those too. 🙂

[leeloo1]

Bless him, it was such a long day as well! I didn't collect mine, so by the time he got home he didn't want to talk much, but he said he'd finished the vr and nvr, found maths hard "there weren't many questions, but they all had parts a-g" and he said the comprehension was hard and dull!

Tbh when he tried to do their sample paper, on a tale of two cities, I thought it was extremely hard - and I have an MA in English lit! 😂

[chalkyc2]

He said it was the hardest one he sat (harder than St Olaves, mum!). We're in deepest south London so the others are all local to us - Eltham College, Trinity and Colfes. This was always a bit of a long shot in many ways!

[leeloo1]

And how did your son find the exams/exam day?

[leeloo1]

You're probably right @chalkyc2, but it's just so nerve-wracking! I shouldn't have put the dates we'd (probably) hear from schools in my calendar, as obsessively checking my emails isn't helping my stress levels!

We applied to Westminster and St Paul's too although ds didn't do well enough in the iseb to sit the second round of exams for St Paul's, so are waiting to hear from them next week. Do you have any other options?