Is this true about year 7?

[justanotherusername1234]

I was talking with another mum, her dc is in year 7 and she claims her dc has not learned anything new in year 7 and is pretty much doing the same kind of work as in primary school, is this true? Surely this can't be right?

[MarchingFrogs]

ALL of the maths she's done in yr7 she did in yr4 or yr5, and she frequently has the same maths homework as DD2 who is currently in yr4.

So they had covered most or all of the KS2 curriculum (Yes, I know Indies don't have to follow the same scheme of work as maintained schools, but we all need the same maths skills at that age) by the age of 8?

I must admit that I would be tempted to check that she had actually covered all of the curriculum for KS2 that the pupils from state primaries will have done. It's possible to do quite a bit of 'accelerated' stuff in some areas but then find that in others, one has actually missed out on the basics / intermediate stuff (This happened to one of ours who was moved into a year six class for half of year five - top of the class in maths for a year and a half and only realised in year 7 that there was year 5 stuff that he had missed completely).

[BoneShaker]

DD is in Yr7.

Maths has meant repeating some of the same topics as she did at primary school but, as sashh says, it's in more depth this time around. DD has definitely learnt a lot through this approach.

The other subjects have involved looking at lots of new topics that she's never looked at before. It's been very different to primary school.

[ReginaPhalange20]

Not true but it definitely is nothing to worry about because it's not a massive jump

[ChocolateWombat]

Children often find it difficult to judge how much new information they have covered and say they haven't covered anything new, when in fact they have.....and after covering something, can't always remember accurately if it was covered for the first time or not. That's worth remembering.

Most subjects have building blocks. In any year group, you never start with brand new material and don't re-visit some of the prior knowledge or building blocks. In Year 7 quite a lot if this is needed with children coming from many different schools, but they will be going further than previously too. In some subjects they will cover all new ground and in some subjects some old ground and some new ground. It's also worth remembering that because you are looking at something you might have looked at before, this isn't wasted and it's actually necessary to cover things several times to gain a secure grasp of them. This 'inter-leaving' of topics - regularly returning to topics covered previously, recalling them, seeing connections to new topics and re-visiting over and over again over time, rather than just in a big cram for an exam at the end of the year, is current educational thinking. It's about making knowledge and understanding secure.....and having covered something once in primary in Yr4 or in Y6 doesn't make it secure.

I had a DC go to a Prep where they did several years of quite serious French and couple of years of Latin, as well as some Maths and Science beyond KS2 stuff. Once in Yr 7 of their next school (also independent and with probably half and half state and independent intake) they started French and Latin from the beginning....they were advantaged and their prior knowledge gave them confidence, but they did learn new things in each topic and certainly re-I forced their knowledge and skills. It was the same in science and some topics had been covered before, but some were covered in greater depth and some covered in a different way. Learning was definitely going on. It's too simplistic to say 'done that before, therefore waste of time and no new learning happening'. As I said at the start, children often find it hard to pinpoint exactly what they've learned which is totally new and what they have learned which is deepening understanding of topics already covered....actually, it's often the more able who can see which work is harder and can see where learning has happened, and those who are weaker who think they've done everything before, in the same way, it's often weaker students who think every test is easy, because their understanding isn't there to recognise when something actually is difficult.
In every year, absolutely rightly, chunks of time are spent re-visiting and embedding knowledge and skills. It is vital. More of it will happen in Yr 7 if everyone is new. Don't think learning isn't happening.

[Land0r]

MarchingFrogs Yes, they cover a lot of the KS2 curriculum in yr4 and all of it by the end of yr5. (DD2 is the youngest in the year so is still 8 now at the end of yr4, but everyone else is 9.) By the end of yr5, when everyone bar DD2 will be 10, they will have covered the whole curriculum. The 11+ in this county is very early September in yr6 and the maths in the 11+ exam (rather unfairly) covers the whole of the KS2 curriculum. That's why so many children are tutored outside school I think.

Thank you, I will definitely check that DD1 doesn't have any gaps - I hadn't considered that. She's breezed through everything in yr7 maths so far - this weekend's homework was algebra, which she did in yr4 and again in yr6. Different maths teacher now for DD2 so she hasn't done algebra yet.

[AlexanderHamilton]

It was true for dd who moved from private to nonselective where they were not set.

It wasn’t true for Ds.

[PerspicaciaTick]

DD had to get used to studying Physics, Biology, Chemistry, Geography and History as separate subjects. She began learning French, German and Latin for the first time. She learned about studying Art and Drama as academic subjects. She studied Tech and had to learn to write up her projects properly. English Literature as a standalone subject was new especially the essay writing skills. Maths and English were the least of it. The content in Y7 may not be massively challenging but learning to study, write effectively and research topics was all largely new for her. She loved but the schools expectations were clear from day 1.

[Makinglists]

Would only say this was true for the first term of maths. Ds1 is average at maths so it seemed they just wanted to make sure they were really secure with everything. Other Subjects have been a huge jump esp. Science/Technology/computing. Having specialist teachers means they can really push them on.

[Anasnake]

Your friend is talking bollocks and trying to show how clever her dc is. Don't be gullible, it's obviously nonsense

[halcyondays]

Surely any secondary will have them doing a lot of subjects that aren't normally down in primary. Seems unlikely.

[Neolara]

I'm pretty sure my dd learned nothing new in maths in Year 7 and only a little in Year 8. She had come into the school at a pretty high level and the teachers refused (yes, actually refused) to differentiate. Was not great.

[Rudi44]

Someone above mentioned above that yes in state school, my dd is currently in yr 7 at an independent and has learnt so much in the past 10 months, including Maths far more advanced than at primary and a basic grounding in 3 new languages.

[BarbarianMum]

Ds1 left primary having aced all his SATS too. He'd been treading water for 2 years at that point. He's learnt loads of stuff this year (esp in subjects he's been setted for it's true). But even in the non-setted humanities he's got specialist teachers so it's not just what is taught in class - he's supported to stretch himself. No 11 year old has "done" so much on the tudors, or so much French that they've no more to learn surely? And then there are the lunchtime clubs - he does engineering, computing and robotics but there are loads to choose from. Only problem has been music where he's far ahead of most of the class in theory/ability to play and totally uninterested in the learning about the history of music. But he just has to make the best of that and carries on playing outside school.

In short, he's learnt loads.

[BubblesBuddy]

By the way, it’s certsinly not true to say that prep school children who have been taught French for years outshine everyone else! After half a term of French, with no previous French, DD had come near the top in the first French test of Y7! Other children might have attended the lessons but they didn’t learn much.

These days in state schools, children have the opportunity to work in depth at core subjects. Some preps don’t do this and whizz through it. Working in greater depth benefits all children and even the prep school children benefit in Y7 who, surprisingly, don’t always get to Oxbridge above everyone else in y13! Peaking too early maybe?

[BarbarianMum]

In fact if my ds had pulled the trampolining stunt he'd have got a right bollocking and Id tell the complaining parent that.

[BarbarianMum]

Oops wrong thread

[Moneyhelping]

DD came from a prep to highly performing state comprehensive where she was drilled for 11+. She has certainly learnt new things this year. I wouldn’t say she has flown with maths at all, she’s below the middle of top set so plenty to work on. 11+ means that their science is no further ahead than in state primaries so she has found that a challenge. She’s doing Spanish rather than French and I’m not sure her French was that great despite doing it since year 1. She has definitely advanced her English, which was already very good, it’s the first time she has done real critical analysis from texts to the level they are doing now and she has plenty of new subjects such as tech and food tech. Music is taught differently, history and geography with focus on sources is new. She has learnt plenty.

[Titsywoo]

DD found this to be the case for the first month of year 7 but they hadn't been set yet so I assume they were trying to gauge where everyone was at with their learning from primary and get those behind caught up.

[CoffeeIsNotEnough]

My children have all learned new things in Year 7. State primary, state secondary, three boys all with different interests. I've enjoyed hearing about new things too!

[worstmotherintheworld]

I have one DC in a state grammar, who found Year 7 fairly stress-free after all the worry of getting a place! There were new subjects to learn (so I would not say that she hasn't learnt anything) but nothing seemed to be overwhelming. I think there is now such pressure in Year 6 in literacy and numeracy that a lot of the groundwork has already been done by the time kids go to secondary. On the other hand I work with lower ability kids in Primary school and have heard that they find Year 7 pretty tough - maybe because they had received so much support in Primary which may not be there in Secondary?

[montenuit]

nonsense.

[justanotherusername1234]

I think she was just showing off really. Saw her again and she told me her dc is going on a reward trip because her dc is in the top 25 of the best ones. Do high schools really do this? Only the ones who achieve the highest grades go on a trip?? Or is this another lie and it's the top 25 with better attendance or behaviour or something like that?

[MarchingFrogs]

DS2's school did this when he was in years 7 -9 (may still do for these years, but he's in year 10 now). Mainly smaller things, though, like a tea party (food usually being an attraction), but I think there as one trip he went on which was merit-based.

[CoffeeIsNotEnough]

I expect reward trip is for well behaved, helpful, enthusiastic kids who try hard.
I have one of these and he gets to go on his school's reward trip each time!

[Trampire]

My dcs school have a points system where they are awarded pints for good behaviour, good engagement in lessons and exceptional work. At the end of term they have a small treat for the top 30 or do with with the most points but it's a film afternoon or similar treat, not a trip - and NOT for the necessarily 'cleverest' children.