Appeal for grammar, dyslexia, written work issues - help please?

[HetzelNatur]

Hello, I really hope someone with experience of this system might be able to give me advice - I don't know if we have a fighting chance or not.

Ds didn't pass the Kent test in Y6 and he's currently home schooled (he's 12 in May). We did appeal to a local grammar on the grounds of his dyslexia, which is becoming milder in terms of how he manages school work, and we failed the appeal.

Last week he took an entrance test to the same school, which was CAT tests (verbal, non verbal, quantitative) on the computer, plus a maths and Eng paper which were written.

We found out on Sat that he didn't get through, and he was absolutely gutted but I assumed it was pointless to appeal again.

Yesterday I emailed asking for his scores, just for our information, and they really surprised me.

Basically they want top 25% scores to offer a place.

His CAT results were on the 99th and 95th centile for VR and NVR, and 78th for QR. I nearly fell over.

The English and Maths were not adequate (though I don't know what the pass marks were, and it gives a % and a grade - maths 24%, Eng grade 4 - I don't understand what these mean).

Now I can see he found the computer based exams easy (and told me they were) and the written work very hard, partly I think because we hadn't covered a lot of the maths in our work at home (my fault - we were going over the basic stuff again) and partly as his written work is generally pretty untidy and he has poor processing and handwriting.

Could we stand a chance to fight the decision on the grounds of these issues he has (we have a report about them from last year from a specialist) or would we just be getting his hopes up all over again for nothing?

Any thoughts really appreciated.

[LIZS]

Charis you are twisting what I have stated. I made a clear distinction between laptop use and other access arrangements and what is required for each where appropriate. Your negativity is not helpful.

And no an Ed Psych won't just write whatever you request! In fact ours recommended that we didn't pay her £500+ to attempt to get Ds extra time for GCSEs. Even on the basis of a yr 8 report where Ds met the criteria she felt it unlikely he would meet the criteria again and we'd waste time and money.

[Charis1]

I am not twisting anything you say, and I am not being negative. I am stating the situation as it is.

Shed loads of privately done assessments accumulate in piles all over the place, fit for nothing but kindling. Even if the ed psych is competent and has scruples ( certainly not a given), the parent may not. I've even known parents with one SEN child, take that child to repeated assessments under other names to get an exam advantage for their other children too, even the children of friends!

As for laptop use, probably the single most damaging and destructive suggestion that was ever put forward for dyslexic children.

[LIZS]

I think you'll find plenty would disagree about using a laptop (although time needs to be spent learning to touch type if benefit is to be derived) enables freer expression of ideas onto paper.

[YorkieButtonsizeMen]

Well Charis perhaps you would like to tell me why, because I am completely confused now.

Why exactly is a laptop not a good idea? I don't mind which of you is right, about any of this, I could just use some help - and saying 'laptops are damaging' doesn't actually help me at all.

Of course you aren't obliged to offer any further detail but I would find it useful if you could.

[Charis1]

I think you'll find plenty would disagree about using a laptop

I'm sure I will, it is the great magic wand, isn't it. The fact that it totally disrupts development gets brushed under the carpet.

Psychology is not a science. Research and evidence are not required to be of any particular standard before recommendations start being trumpeted loudly all over the place. Damage done is someone elses to sweep up.

[YorkieButtonsizeMen]

Perhaps I should just google it Charis?

[Charis1]

yorkie, basically it speeds up production of work, which is the last thing a dyslexic child needs. Most dyslexics need to take extra time to think things through, and plan carefully , whether that is spelling, a sentence or an essay. Without this, development can be severely disrupted.

Working on a laptop, children never get to consider the overview of their work either, and completely lose this skill, and become used to working with only a tiny part of the whole in their mind. this is true of any child, of course, but dyslexic children in particular need training in the exact opposite.

The lap top disconnects the actual letter formation from the production of writing too, which prevents the link being made and reinforced neurologically.

there are other reasons, I won't go on.I work mostly with SEN teenagers, and have been aware for a very long time of the damage done to development by use of lap tops.

A large part of my work is attempting to break the dependency and redress some of the damage.

thankful, mainstream educational thinking is now starting to catch up, and laptops are starting to be discouraged.

not that it will make any difference. I'm sure the next new fangled idea foisted on us by "educational research" will be equally harmful ,and also be dumped once the harm has become blatantly apparent. Then we will get another one. That is how the system works.

[YorkieButtonsizeMen]

Ok, I see what you're on about. Thank you very much for explaining.

I suppose for an exam where you haven't much time, and need to get stuff down quickly, I can see how it might have a place but I do understand what you are saying and it makes sense.

I wish I had someone who could give him some help, the lady we saw has her schedule filled to bursting with children in severe need, and ds is 'mild' so she said she couldn't fit him in. I know nothing about dyslexia. I'm using course books to try and teach him the usual curriculum stuff, but regarding his handwriting, his processing, his thinking, I am way out of my depth.

I don't know if there's anyone else I could trust. Don't suppose anyone knows of anyone in Kent who might be worth a try - or how to find someone?

[SpecificSpecific]

Membership of PATOSS (SpLD Level 7 or Diploma?).
If so, that's perfect.
Reports do not need to have been commissioned by school to hold validity.
Schools rarely have the time or money to have them carried out.
Standardised scores need to be 84 OR below (not 'below 84).
Did your assessor not write about the need for extra time in her report (see recommendations)? It wasn't so long ago that you couldn't give her a ring to clarify.
Extremely important is the school's normal working practice for him (ie do they allow him, and document that he has, extra time as normal working practice in lessons relating to reading and writing, as appropriate?).

[SpecificSpecific]

That last point is where I think you'll stumble given the school's chocolate teapot.

[YorkieButtonsizeMen]

Thanks both. I have no idea what Patoss is, but glad it sounds appropriate.

Recommendations are correcting pencil grip, to lessen tension in his hand; learning and practising correct letter joins; use of alternative methods for information recording: mind maps, charts, diagrams etc; writing skills programme; keyboard skills and something about Latin. And encouragement to repeat instructions to ensure they have been heard.

That's a summary, I've missed out details. Nothing about extra time.

Camel, thank you - if only someone had told me what to do. I didn't know any of that stuff. No one tells you, you feel like you're totally on your own when they start secondary - there's no one you can get hold of. Well that's how I felt. I had a contact about the bullying but no mention of a senco, I suppose he was doing so well (he was bunged into the grammar stream straight away).

[YorkieButtonsizeMen]

I am afraid of them putting him back into the school he left though, and that would leave us stranded, as they would then be onto me about the HE aspect and I'm worried they will say I'm not doing enough with him.

Yikes. I will ring them about access arrangements, and ring individual schools about places, I think.

[SpecificSpecific]

Oh dear. I beg to differ on some points made:
Laptops can be enormously helpful for those children (not all dyslexic children) who have difficulties with handwriting, have hypermobiity, dyspraxia and are encumbered by the physical process of writing. Of course, a laptop will only be of use if the pupil has been taught how to touch type at a rate faster than that at which they write. Those children who also have difficulties with working memory (many dyslexic pupils do and this would be revealed in a fully diagnostic report) and whose handwriting speed cannot keep pace with their thoughts and ideas. THOSE are the children for whom laptops are revolutionary.

It is an insulting misconception to state that all private assessments/ assessors' reports are fit to be kindled - and to generalise about the dishonest practices of parents using reports, etc.
This is not my experience and is rather a negative and dishonest view. I do hope those holding it aren't in a position such as SENCO, who a parent would entrust with a report in the hope that its contents are read and taken seriously.

SENCOs are often not terribly well qualified to even interpret a report, let alone spot a problem in a well compensated pupil. Many work part time and do not have the funds or inclination to broaden their knowledge of difficulties such as those experienced by well-compensated dyslexic pupils. Schools are generally less (not) interested in a pupil's potential and more in whether the pupil is manageable (behaviourally and academically).

[YorkieButtonsizeMen]

Thanks, Specific - I am sorry if I was rude about our senco but honestly it was a fairly hopeless situation. The school didn't seem remotely interested in helping ds, in that regard, even once they had seen the report. It was all over for them well before the 11 plus.

His behaviour was excellent, he was lovely and appeasing and his only misdemeanours were getting mud on him during football, and occasional giggling with the other boys - he wasn't really able to concentrate though and was described as 'away with the fairies' on more than one occasion.

It feels as though we have never really had any help with his difficulties and he has had to learn an enormous amount of coping strategies all by himself, just to barely keep up.

I just don't know what to do for him.

[LIZS]

If he might be dyspraxic have you seen an occupational therapist. They could help with strengthening hand and wrist to hold pencil correctly, posture, core strength and planning. Speak to gp or look online for a private one if local waiting list is long as the window of cooperation on Ds side could now be limited. I'm going to have to disagree with Charis , especially since the assessor had recommended a keyboard. However there will be no "cure" it is more about finding coping mechanisms which work for that individual.

[YorkieButtonsizeMen]

Thanks so much Lizs. I haven't spoken to an OT or thought of trying that, but I will try and look for someone locally (it's so hard to know where to look though).

I just spoke to the independent organisation that operates through the LA, and they were very helpful, saying it probably isn't worth trying to get a statement as he is supportable in mainstream school - but some schools will provide laptops, and extra time and so on and if we are looking at schools, to talk to the SENCO and see how onboard they are likely to be.

She said it depends an awful lot on the school's attitude. She also recommended special pens and trying to find some exercises to help his grip - like you suggested.

Not sure if we have made progress but I will bear it all in mind as we're going to look at a school on Friday, which is elusive about any places they may have, and said it depends if the HT thinks we are 'right for the school' as to whether he offers us one.

Hmm. Needs improvement on most of its Ofsted criteria as well! Ho hum.

[YorkieButtonsizeMen]

Sorry, posted too soon - Camelhump, I meant to say, how lovely of you to say that. I sometimes wonder if I'm too slow and stupid to be a Mum, he needs support and I haven't got him any so far.

I'm glad you told me he won't be sent back to the other school, too.

I will definitely try KCC and talk to them about finding a place.