i have tried my best to see this from dp's POV,or to just not care,but i can't change how i feel.

[divastrop]

have posted on this subject a few times.

dp and i keep arguing about the same thing over and over,ie his chatting to women on online games.

i have always hated computer games for various reasons,but after being with dp for a while i realised he is really into them and i accepted it,and when we moved in together and it became clear that his playing computer games doesnt stop him playing with the kids,doing stuff around the house etc,i didnt let it bother me.

however,when he started playing online games i became concerned because of the 'chat' element,as i dont think that its right to chat online to members of the opposite sex when you are in a relationship.

dp explained that alot of the time he doesnt know what gender the person is in rl,which is fair enough.however,for a while at the end of last year,when i was pregnant,he was chatting to a woman nearly every day,and i saw some of the things she said to him like 'i'm your friend,arent i?'which to me is flirting.when i asked dp about this woman though,he would get annoyed with me and say they only ever chatted about the game and he didnt tell anybody anything personal like his name etc.
he just said i was being paranoid,and i tried to put it out of my mind.

now,though,our baby is 4 months old and this issue still gets to me.dp has said that he doesnt flirt and if anybody flirted with him he wouldnt chat to them again.but i,personally,would see him chatting regularly to a particular woman as cheating.it doesnt matter what they are chatting about,it would be the fact that he had formed an online relationship with a woman that bothered me.dp thinks this is unreasonable and that it wouldnt be cheating.

i have tried so hard not to care,but i often find myself looking over his shoulder to 'check' who he is talking to,and then he gets pissed off saying that i dont trust him.but how can i trust him when we see things so differently?

i dont know if this issue will ever be resolved,and i'm scared it will be the end of us

[StormTreader]

Feefigmac why on earth did you post on this?

[Hont1986]

Oh bugger, I thought there was supposed to be a zombie picture in the message box to warn you

[chipsandpeas]

Zombie thread

[PoorYorick]

Oh FARK. Zombie???

[PoorYorick]

I went to an all girls school. I think my parents thought it would prevent me from going too boy crazy, being sexually active and so on. What it actually did was stop me from seeing boys as just normal people, that you could have normal non-sexual friendships with. For years afterwards I couldn't just interact with men normally. They were so utterly sexualised in my mind because I'd never socialised with them as just people. So the tiniest interaction became super sexual.

I'm just saying.

[CatsInKilts]

This thread is 10 years old!

[Hont1986]

Sorry to be blunt but your DP is in an abusive relationship. This is extremely controlling.

[PoorYorick]

it is just one thing i personally wouldnt find acceptable in a relationship.and my dp has the same view as me on that subject,so it isnt an issue for us.

Except he clearly doesn't have the same view as you and it is an issue for you, hence this thread.

I think it's utter madness to prevent someone from having friends of the opposite gender.

[PoorYorick]

i ould not have a relationship with a man who had heterosexual female friends

Bloody hell.

[Feefigmac]

Hmmm I think of this from a slightly different perspective. I do think it is important for you to improve your self esteem and do things for you etc. I personally don't think a man in a relationship should be "chatting" to a stranger regularly/daily...especially about personal day to day issues as this can lead to emotional ties/bonds and relationships forming over a period of time. It is a well known fact that relationships can and do escalate quickly online. Look at all of the stats and figures which support this. Divorces, separation are on the increase due to increased online activity with such things as Social Networking and gaming sites with chat function! Over time you can very easily become emotionally attached and it can sometimes feels safer confiding/talking to a stranger ... this is the danger. I think you need to discuss with your OH your fears/concerns. If he cares/respects your feelings he should stop chatting with other females online. Personally, I don't see the attraction of chatting to strangers online. Your OH must be getting something from doing this e.g. escapism or an ego boost etc
Good luck and take care of you

[cazee]

and I just clicked on your profile Diva, and your children are gorgeous

[cazee]

I think there is a big difference between a close male/female friendship, i.e going out drinking together, chatting late on the phone, and casual friendships.
It sounds as if your DP sees this difference too, and shares your view that the former would not be appropriate.

[divastrop]

he shares my views re close friendships,he just says that he doesnt see the computer game players as male or female,just characters.that is where the problem has been.

there is a difference between controlling somebody and making it clear that you wont accept certain things in a relationship.

i didnt ask anybody to judge me.

[VeniVidiVickiQV]

Agree Wannabe - was going to say the same regarding the sharing of views. If it was the case - the situation wouldnt have arisen in the first place, surely?

[wannaBe]

"i honestly dont see what my attitude to opposite-sex friendships has to do with this,as dp shares my views on that.". But he doesn't fully share your views does he? I mean the fact he is talking to other women and says it's harmless when you clearly don't think it is indicates that your view of interaction with the opposite sex differs from his.

If this op had been different, if a woman had posted saying that their dp didn't trust them when they spoke to other men, even in the context of a computer game, the response would be the same. In fact the response would be that the woman in question clearly had a very controlling dp and should question whether they wanted to stay in a relationship like that. And no, I'm not suggesting that your dp should leave you, but I can see it more from his pov than yours - sorry.

[cazee]

skidoodle, don't acuse me of being holier than thou, that is just rude.

Forgiveness is central to Catholicism, but you are not oblidged to still live with a spouse if they have been unfaithful. Forgiveness is one thing, but continuing to live as husband and wife might be impossible (as it would if one spouse was violent).

I did not refer to the church when talking about male/female friends, but when talking about sex, i.e. that the church teaches that one of the two reasons for sex is for deepening the marriage bond, (the other being to create life). That is the teaching of the Church, not just my view.

Think this is getting a little off the point now...

[divastrop]

colinandcaitlinsmommy-thank you,that was very helpful indeed as you have clearly been in the same situation as me and got to grips with it.it gives me hope

skidoodle-i am not 'obsessed' with infidelity.i have been in abusive relationships,i was with xp for 4 years during which he physically and emotionally abused me.part of that abuse was going on about how attractive other women were.to me,somebody actually going so far as to snog/sleep with somebody else,would be as abusive as hitting/punching.i would see it as the ultimate emotional abuse,and i do think that women who put up with cheating spouses are no different to women who put up with men who beat the shit out of them.

[Blu]

Have you never, ever, engaged in conversation on here with happydaddy, daddycool, etc etc?

[skidoodle]

I was less suggesting you change your "values" than that you change your rigidity, as it might make you happier and more relaxed.

It's not wrong to say you wouldn't have a relationship with a man with female friends, who you date is your choice, it's just needlessly limiting your life out of fear.

Also, your distaste for male-female relationships is not really a value is it? It has no moral underpinning, but comes from suspicion, low self esteem, personal anecdote, and an attempt to control the world you see around you. Dignifying it by calling it a "value" is kind of sad.

btw, I'm also a Catholic and my DH has many female friends, none of whom I'm remotely jealous of, so I wouldn't go blaming the church for this particular peccadillo.

cazee, good Catholics don't believe women should stay in violent marriages, but they do believe in forgiveness and infidelity would not justify divorce. not something I agree with, but if you're going to come on here being all holier-than-thou, you could at least be honest that your opinions are your own and not God's.

BTW it is possible to express just as extreme disrespect for a partner through refusal to pull your weight at home as it is by straying physically. Sometimes that kind of neglect does justify leaving.

TBH you seem kind of obsessed by sex.

and finally, Divastrop, if you can't see the difference between a man who physically brutalises his wife and one who sleeps with someone else, then you really need to get your obsession with infidelity back in perspective. what you were planning to write on that thread is deeply offensive to somebody else's pain and very real danger. I'm kind of disgusted.

[colinandcaitlinsmommy]

I've been watching this thread since the beginning, and finally decided to post. I know exactly where you're coming from, divastrop. DH is a big game player, and has from time to time talked with or joined up with other game players who happen to be women. It was a big problem for me, because I came from a religion that was very paranoid about any interaction between men and women who weren't married or very close relatives, because of what "might" happen. I was very jealous of everything DH did involving other women, I think largely because of those attitudes.

I didn't show how much it bothered me, but DH definitely knew somewhat of how I felt, because it was impossible to hide, and it was hard on the relationship. Looking back, it was very draining for the both of us. He was (and is) a big gamer, and I knew asking him to give that up would be out of the question.

After time, things got a little easier, and then one night he didn't come to bed really late. I woke up and he was on the computer with a female game player, furiously typing away. I could tell he didn't know I was there (when he figured out I was there, he jumped out of his chair, because he didn't realize I was there), so I crept up behind him, and when I got closer, it turns out they had exchanged pictures of their spouses and children and were having a discussion about how cute DS was and how quickly I had lost my pregnancy weight. That was the end of any jealousy I ever had about him being online, and it really helped me to see how unfounded it was.

It might be easier for me, because I'm in the states, and the idea of him ever meeting any of these women is pretty far-fetched, because most of them live thousands of miles away. He never talks to any of them for very long, either, because he is always jumping back and forth between different games, or different parts of the same game, and it also helps, because usually he only knows them by their screen name, not who they really are. The games he plays, there aren't that many women, either.

I'm glad he can talk to others about his games, male or female, because, TBH, I just don't get it, or really care about them. I don't really know how this helps you, but if your DP is anything like DH, it is all about the game, and they're so into what they're doing, he's so wrapped up in the game, that he's not really thinking about the gender of who he is interacting with at all.

[divastrop]

i dont want to play the game,tbh,as i would just end up looking like a prize twat,and it could make things worse,if i saw that there was flirting going on between some of the players.

it would be like when dp posted on MN and got slagged off about his spelling+grammar,and drew the conclusion that it was a site for moany snobs

i dont feel the need to change my 'rules' regarding opposite-sex friendships.i dont see why i should change my values just because they dont fit in with the majority.i dont think its wrong to say i wouldnt have a relationship with a man who had close female friends.

i was brought up a catholic,funnily enough,although i dont practise anymore.maybe that has something to do with my attitudes to relationships now.

cazee- i have sometimes posted on threads about cheating saying 'leave the bastard,he will do it again if you let him get away with it' and been told that my attitude is wrong.in fact,i was very tempted to post on a domestic violence thread the other day saying 'him hitting you has highlighted issues in your relationship,i think you should try to forgive him and go to relate if he will agree to it' just to see what the reaction would be!

[Fimbo]

I don't have male friends and likewise my dh doesn't have female friends. Of course we are friendly with other couples.

My dh doesn't play computer games, so I don't know exactly how I would feel about him chatting to other women in that context.

I view work as a complete different thing.

I can see where you are coming from Divastrop because tbh I don't think I would like it much either.

[cazee]

And just to add, I think that people who disagree with the flow/general opinions on a thread tend not to post at all, which can skew the responses.

I bloody hate posting on MN, because I know that my opinion is usually different from the majority, and I am a delicate flower! However, I feel I sould post sometimes, or other views will never be aired.

[cazee]

Tell me about it Diva! I have read threads where people say "My DH won't do the washing up", and people say "Leave him, what a selfish git"!!!!
I don't know how anyone could ever find cheating forgivable. People say it was just sex, but for me sex is just another way of deepening the bond with my DH, sex is always about "us", not about sex. This is also Catholic teaching, and I am a Catholic. That is not to say that sex isn't adventurous or hot, but that it is also about bonding.

I am particularly shocked by the thread about a lady whoes DH was getting texts from a woman at work saying "I miss you when you are not here". The advice seems to be that she is insecure and shouldn't be bothered by that. Not one person I know in RL would ever put up with that.

It does sound as if your DP is just talking about the game, which would be very different from chat rooms, however I wouldn't be able to accept any woman saying "you are my friend aren't you" to my DH in that context. We are all different, and your DP needs to understand how you are.
Playing the game with him might be a good idea as it will let you see how the chat element works.

[skidoodle]

You're had some really good advice here from madamez, HelenLove, and EscapeFrom.

I'm just trying to think of ways you could stop giving a shit.

I guess the first is to stop refusing to see it from his POV and decide to accept (for say a fortnight) that these are characters from the game and not women. He's not trying to find out about their lives or get to know the real them, or build up any kind of personal relationship. It's just part of the game.

Also, I know you're not that interested in the games, but maybe if you tried playing just once, either along with him or get him to show you and figure it out yourself, you wouldn't feel quite so excluded and open to being duped about what's really going on.

Obviously you also need to deal with the fact that you are so defensive about yourself. Having been hurt before, it's easy to understand why you're like that, but it's not fair to your OH to have to deal with fallout from things that he didn't do.

I know you don't want to go down the route of your issues about opposite gender friends and as neither of you apparetly has any right now I can see why you want to ignore it, but it's so striking, and the reason is because of its absolute rigidity. It's like you're attempting to control the world by drawing a clear line about what you will put up with as a way of protecting yourself from being hurt.

The problem with this is that you are limiting the possible friendships for both you as individuals and as a couple. That means more time spent together with fewer outlets, which just magnifies the sense of outside threat.

Of course some male-female friendships are based on unrequited love, but many are not. Don't you trust yourself to be able to tell the difference?

You're right, there is a lot of guff talked about how people should be allowed to spend time with their "friends" without their partners being worried that they are excluded, that they flirt, text at odd times, and clearly fancy each other. That's not OK if you're in a committed relationship and it is OK to ask someone to stop doing something that makes you uncomfortable, if you're generally not jealous and don't make blanket demands of them based on arbitrary rules.

I think if you thought about getting rid of some of your rules you might find it easier to stop worrying about whether your OH is breaking them.