Christmas issues

[ConkersDontScareSpiders]

I have recently separated from h, and though at first it was very amicable, that soon altered when it transpired he had been seeing my best friend for the year and a half before the break up and that they had both been acting in ways that were highly manipulative and unpleasant during that time.This has continued in various forms since I found out and there have also been some horrible discussions with h about money,which have been stressful and during which I feel he has attempted to screw me over a bit.
I have had some pretty bad anxiety/depression issues since finding out about this in March.I eventually lost my job, which Id started the day I found out and which was something I had worked so hard for.Im still finding it all quite hard to deal with.
Our two DD's (9 and 10) are unaware of the situation with h and my former best friend (though I think they have worked out that something is going on-small town, lots of gossip, and of course said friend is no longer in my house every few days as she had been-and the kids aren't totally oblivious to that kind of thing).h does not want to tell them and I haven't-against my better judgement really and also because her kids are friends with mine-so it would be something that would affect them too-as they are also apparently none the wiser.
The situation is very strained still and I am nowhere near back to being myself.
The girls are now asking what will happen at christmas. They have expressed a preference to go to my parents-a 3 hour drive away (as my dad is old and ill and they have a very good relationship with him and are concious that after a recent health scare he is not invincible).My parents do not want anything to do with ex h, (whereas in the past it might have been possible-it isn't yet and may never be, for him to come with us to spend Christmas at their house).
H and I have had some brief discussions re Christmas.he thinks it would be 'unreasonable' of me to say that we are not all four going to spend Christmas together 'as that's what we always said we would do' (which we did, even post split-but that was when we were friends, before his behaviour had become apparent and before he consequences for me had occurred).
I don't feel I can spend any prolonged time with him at the moment.we are polite in front of the kids, and other than stuff around the kids I am trying not to engage with him at all. The thought of spending Christmas with him is not Inspiring.However of course I also don't want to spend it without the girls-especially this year after all that's happened.
The added issue is that it's dd1's birthday on Boxing Day-so it's not even really possible to trade one day off for the other in our case without it being awful for her.
I just don't know what to do, so any advice would be welcome. Am I being unreasonable in wanting to go to my parents? This will be our first spilt up Christmas and I'm so sad that we arent even friends enough to spend it all together as we might have done. It was important to me that we were friends still-and all that is now screwed up really.But I'm still a bit shattered by it all and I can't see how I can do it at the minute.
Sorry this was so long.

[ConkersDontScareSpiders]

No he is most always fairly polite. He hair says vile things.but politely. It's hard to articulate it.
The solicitor is happy, but it is yet to be signed and sealed...there is still some back and forth about some bits of it.
Email is probably the best method for Christmas discussion I agree. Otherwise I will get too upset/angry and that plays into his hands I suppose.

[tellyjots]

Go to your parents as your DDs wish.

He's a selfish prick and the only thing he should be getting for Christmas is a roundhouse kick to the face.

[tellyjots]

Go to your parents as your DDs wish.

He's a selfish prick and the only thing he should be getting for Christmas is a roundhouse kick to the face.

[DoinItFine]

They don't see that.they aren't party to our discussions via email or in person.

If he is only going to behave decentky if you submit to his every denand, then he is an abusive bastard and you need to stop all contact with him.

This politeness is all bullshit if it's just a gloss on bullying.

[clam]

You can still be coolly polite to him; even if he's furious. In fact, I'd say that might be quite amusing to do!

[Dozer]

Is your solicitor now satisfied with the financial settlement?

His being polite to you seems to be contingent on you doing what he wants.

[SeaCabbage]

Please don't do the half and half thing over Christmas.

Surely it is best for your girls to be more settled in one place.

Stuff him this year. Go to your parents. You may have to do alternate Christmases and birthdays in future but this year I would suggest you have it with your family and your friends.

He can stick it. Tell him via email.

[ConkersDontScareSpiders]

They don't see that.they aren't party to our discussions via email or in person.

[DoinItFine]

I think that would be it for us even having a polite relationship which I still think is important for the girls.

You don't have a "polite" relationship.

You have a submissive relationship where he pushes younaround and you let him.

It is awful for your daughters to see that.

[ConkersDontScareSpiders]

I don't suppose he can do anything really-except cock about a bit more re the financials...plus I think that would be it for us even having a polite relationship which I still think is important for the girls.

[bluebeck]

I agree with PP. tell the DC the truth. You don't need to warn anyone, just say you blurted it out. What can he do about it?

You are allowing him ALL THE CONTROL still. Don't you want to take some back?

Re Christmas, just say no, that doesn't work for me, I will be doing X, Y Z. Maybe you have them Christmas Day, DD opens her birthday presents with you Boxing Day morning and then he comes and collects them. Collects them at the door though, no coming in for Christmas cheer. Selfish fucker.

And no pretending it's all happy families doing things together. He made his choice - he can fuck off and parent alone when he has them.

[ConkersDontScareSpiders]

He has them three nights because he wants them-he is in fairness a good dad to them-albeit very Disney-and he does love them and they him.he's ok with the maintenance-it was more that he'd decided on a figure-he pays more than the minimum as he earns a lot. My solicitor advised that due to his salary and my loss of job that the figure should be higher.he didn't like that and there has been a lot of arguing about it-that and pensions and savings as he can't get his head around 'giving' me half. I'm hoping its nearly concluded.
I am quite nervous of him-i don't know why. Prior to this I was quite a strong person. He can be very intimidating-not in an aggressive way-just that he strongly believes he is right and it makes me question myself I suppose.i get that I sound drippy but I can't articulate why I can't stand up to him more.

[DownTownAbbey]

Urgh. Just seen he's a school governor. Good for you informing the school - this could blow up one day and they need to know. Sod his sodding reputation. If he was the decent chap he wants everyone to think he is he should have ended your marriage before he decided to poke your friend not 18months afterwards! Luckily they deserve each other and when it's no longer 'them against the world ' (puke) the rot will set in.

[DownTownAbbey]

Oh my gawd this is almost a carbon copy of what happened to me! I totally get the sense of feeling scared of his reaction to things even though he's got absolutely no right to make demands now. You need to get over that. By leaving you in such an appallingly nasty way he's given up the 'right ' to make demands. Keep telling yourself that. It's so hard when all the betrayal and worry about your future/ your DCs is swirling round in your head. Don't let him capitalise further on your devestation by controlling you now!

He broke your family up so he broke Christmas. He doesn't get to have an input this year. Sod him.

Minimise contact with him. He shouldn't be allowed the opportunity to coerce you.

Is him having the DCs 3 nights p/w a way of giving you less maintenance? If you are doing school pick ups he's hardly inconvenienced yet able to claim 'he's such a doting dad' whilst paying you less than he should. If he wants overnights he should do pick ups / taxi to clubs / their tea etc.

Definitely tell your DCs yourself. Yes, he should explain himself but he won't. It'll be a PR exercise designed to down grade his actions and minimise the validity of your feelings. Do NOT give him the power to rewrite history. I'm not saying you trash him to his kids obviously! Just stop letting him have all the control!

[clam]

Yes, why are you colluding in keeping his dirty little secrets?

[ConkersDontScareSpiders]

I haven't all the time. There has been plenty of shouting unfortunately.

[legoqueen]

You've been remarkably calm & dignified but it's time to stop worrying about his reputation - he is responsible for destroying that - & start putting your needs first.

[ConkersDontScareSpiders]

One of her kids was dd1's best friend. They aren't as close as they once were ( inseparable from nursery onwards) as they just sort of grew apart (thank actual God). They didn't fall out, but both just started spending time with other people at school.nej kids was bothered really.She on the other hand was devastated at the time and kept asking me to ask dd1 to make more effort with her dd, to the point where our other friends had to tell her, gently, to stop going on about it. Of course I now see why it upset her so much. The girls are still friends but mercifully not glued to one another anymore.
Her dd and both of mine play on the same football team.
I told the the girls class teachers at school soon after I found out as I wanted them to be able to keep any eye out for the girls when I wasn't there. I felt they needed to know who was involved as it was relevant to the issue. I informed her h (and mine) that I had done so. Her h was ok about it. Mine is a governer at the school and he wasn't pleased.His sister accused me of 'trying to make as much trouble for him as possible'.
I will talk to the girls about it before school starts.

[Inertia]

You're going to give in to your husband's demands to keep him and OW happy, which will cause pain and inconvenience to your children, your parents, and you?

You don't have to do what he says. He left your family, including the children, to have unfettered access to OW. Your children are living through the shitstorm created by your husband. Don't wreck their Christmas and birthday to appease your git of a husband - it won't make you the more dignified person, you'll just be teaching your children that they must miss out so that their father can dictate everything on his own terms.

[legoqueen]

What a nightmare for you, OP, I really feel for you. I agree with other posters that you should tell the DCs about the OW before they go back to school, far better that they hear it from you in an age-appropriate way than via rumours. Stop protecting H's image. As for Christmas, calmly tell him that Christmas Day will be with Grandad - easy to say I know but you need to take back some control & not be bossed around by him any more

[Emeralda]

Sharon is probably right again!

You could start a new thread about telling them and you'd get some good advice. There was one recently about telling DCs in an age appropriate way and someone suggested saying Daddy has a wife and a girlfriend. When you get married, you promise not to have a girlfriend, so if you get a girlfriend, you can't stay married. That was for younger kids but I thought it was a great way of putting it.
You could consider having someone else with you for support, as long as they will be neutral.
You could also have a chat with them about how it might be when they go back to school. People might talk about what's happened because people always talk about other people (it's called gossip). Some things will be true, some won't. Suggest they check things out with you or (insert name of trusted relative here) if there's anything they're worried about. If you think it's appropriate, you could say you're upset about it but they are your main priority so they are not to worry about you. At that point you could say that Dad is allowed to have his private business like everyone else. Try to keep the conversation short, time it so you can bring it to an end and distract them with something else. "Ok, shall we watch this film/take the dog out for a walk now?" Don't do it at night.

If it's likely they'll find out who it is, I guess it's better to say her name.

I've never been in this situation so all this might be irrelevant to you! I found out as a young adult about the OW from someone else who assumed I knew already.

Are her kids in the same class? Are your kids teachers aware?

[Chloecoconut]

There's been some fantastic advice on this thread so I'm not going to repeat any of it - except to say please be the person that tells your kids. I've had to sit mine down and tell them something not so nice about their dad and it was awful but it would have been much worse for them if they'd found out via any other means. Tell them the basics eg 'do you remember that you asked why we don't see X anymore? Well actually it's because ...... and if they ask why you didn't tell them to start with you can say because you were (are still) upset and needed time to process it for yourself, that their dad still loves them etc. It might incur a backlash from your ex but better that your kids know that they can trust you to be honest with them. Send him and her ex H a text afterwards. The other kids aren't your responsibility, you have to put your own first because your ex didn't and won't and it's not your fault that there are other children involved.

Re Xmas - just say it's too soon and that you'll let him know the plans when you are ready. Then politely decline to discuss if it's mentioned again.

[SharonfromEON]

because you're used to always putting others before yourself?
Your next post talks about the other kids..

The only explanation is, he wanted his cake and eat it. One thing I learnt from my separation is as much as you will go round and round wondering why it is actually quite pointless..You will never understand how he and she did it because it is not in your nature....Another thing I have learnt is so common since been on mumsnet is once seperated your see a completely new side and things you never thought someone would do or capable is now seen in everyday behaviour.

As much as you can feel sort for her H, her kids you and your kids are the issue.. He has decided to stay with her, small town their kids will find out too.

You can tell the kids send him a text the kids know.. then they can all do what they like.. I will say though the kids don't need all the sordid details.. Just as factually and simply as they can so they are equipped to cope with whatever they hear at school.

I also think you need to cut as much communication with him as possible.. Don't answer any texts you don't want to..Obviously there are kids involved so going no contact is not an option. Set some rules up that do allow him contact but also give you the space to recover..

[ConkersDontScareSpiders]

I guess because as well as my own there are two other poor kids involved in all of this. I feel sorry for them having a mother like that I suppose. And I see how broken her h is and I feel sorry for him too-rightly or wrongly.
I've had wine which won't help- but really if anyone can explain how it's possible for someone to tell another person that they mean the world to them whilst at the same time fucking them over in the worst possible way-I'd love to hear it. Because I still just don't get it really.

[DontMindMe1]

But I just don't feel right about telling them shout first warning the other kids dad. Dunno why
because you're used to always putting others before yourself?

you're not being 'selfish' by not giving prior warning to the other adults....there's 3 of them and not one of them has had the balls to tackle this in 5 months.

Put you and your dc first. they need to know who they can trust - and it isn't their dad. what the other adults do after your dc know is up to them.