Pregnancy, hormones and marriage - wwyd?

[BuntyCollox]

I have been with my partner for 10 years, we are in a committed long term relationship, both work full time and rent a house which we have lived in for 8 years.

We have spoken in the past, usually after a bottle or two of vino, about marriage and kids. I have always said that ideally I would like to be married before having children and he said he felt the same but I suspect he doesn't feel this quite as strongly as I do.

I am currently 20 weeks pregnant, it wasn't exactly planned but was a nice surprise and we are both delighted even though it wasn't part of our life plan quite yet. I had flippantly dismissed the importance of marriage before but now that I am pregnant I can't think of anything more important (other than the baby)

The main reasons are -
My partner to have full parental responsibility should anything go wrong before registering the birth
Emotional security
Financial security as I will most likely be giving up work
His financial security as the savings account is in my name
For us all to have the same surname
To call him my Husband

I have tried to broach the subject about parental responsibility and need for a will / solicitor advice before the baby is here as we are not married. I half jokingly (tongue in cheek hinty hinty don't try to sound too desperate Bunty) said it would be easier and cheaper to get married, and how we would only need both parents there as witnesses and how neither of us are interested in the big white church do. He kind of mumbled agreement then changed the subject. We had both decided that the baby would take his surname but after reading some advice on the net, I'm now not sure.

I know I should just have this convo with him but I don't want him to marry me just because I want him to, does that make sense? It would feel reluctant and like I am dragging him along for the ride. I can make hints but he isn't the most observant and I would still feel like I was pressurising him, I'm not normally one for playing games either. WWYD?

I can't believe I am sounding so crazy, I always felt like I would keep my surname when married keep my independence etc etc. Now this squiggly thing in my tummy has changed all of that.
Can I blame the hormones?

Thanks if anyone got to the end of that!

[Jess03]

I had dd in nursery but actually I'd go for a CM for the next one as if you can find a good one that's local they can support with school pick ups later on and probably less illness etc. I really wanted a personal recommendation which I couldn't get as new area etc. tangent :)

[Granville72]

The law has just changed so it's all new. I'm just in the process of getting the relevant info off my local authority so I can offer funded places for 2yrs and up.

[BuntyCollox]

That's interesting, I thought the funded places were only from 3yo for both nursery and childminder. Thank you for that info, I will look into it, this is all such a new experience and so much to learn about!

Now i'm off to figure out why MN doesn't like my pound signs ?!

[Granville72]

Charges do look about the same, though your nursery fees are better. I have my own 18 month old and I Child-mind full time as well to a 17 month old. I only charge £36 for 9hrs though as he's with me full time every week.

The government have just changed the law on Child-minding and you can now get funded places for 2, 3 & 4 yr olds (like you would at nursery for 3yr olds) but this only applies to those of us graded as Good or Outstanding by OFSED. It's a little way off for you yet, but every little helps in the long run when your little one gets to two

[BuntyCollox]

Sorry didn't see your post Granville from the research I have done so far we are looking at 50 - 55 per day for nursery and 40-45 per day for a child minder. I do need to look into this more but from speaking to friends in my area it seems the norm. Thats for 10 hours per day.

No childcare vouchers for either of us I'm afraid. I'm not ruling out any options yet, but I do think a child minder would be preferable.

[BuntyCollox]

Thankyou all for the congrats.

Contrarian No, you didn't contribute to that. You have helped me retain my belief that not every man is a selfish twat who will be quick to shirk his responsibility at the earliest opportunity, despite what seems to be popular opinion.

I can honestly see what everyone was getting at, the finance thing especially. I also appreciate the advice to protect myself, I know plenty of women and men have found themselves in a devastating situation after a separation.

But perhaps, amongst other things, accusing someone of being "quite prepared to knock a woman up and not marry her" is not the best way to put a point across (believe me I was fully involved in the decision and understood the consequences ) I'm probably being over sensitive in finding this offensive, but to me it infers a completely different scenario to the one we are currently in.

Oh yes, pregnancy hormones indeed! Woops!

[brettgirl2]

Haha pregnancy hormones

congratulations!

[Contrarian78]

Congratualtions. I honestly hope it works out for you. I absloutely agree that some people can be overly negative (sorry if I contributed to that) and that there's an awful lot of projection going on. Please take note of some of the horror stroies you read on here, but understand that you're often seeing the worst of the worst and many on here are understandably bitter.

Good luck with the wedding and the baby!

[Jess03]

I'm glad this thread had a happy ending! :)

[LastOneDancing]

Congratulations Bunty, I'm really glad you got the resolution you were hoping for.

I'm like you (quite traditional in my views) but I could see what Join was getting at - it did seem he was dismissing you & leaving you vulnerable.

But ta-dah! It was all a rouse! Enjoy your engagement and all the planning! You're going to be a busy Bunty

[Granville72]

Labour is different for everyone and seldom goes the way you planned, but the little person is so very much worth it at the end of it all when you get to hold them.

Where about are you? You say Nursery is just as much as a child-minder in your area which either means you have cheap nurseries or expensive child-minders

Our local Nursery charges £40 a session of 5 hours whereas child-minders here are between £3.75 - £4.50ph. It's a big difference if your little one is doing long ours with someone.

Look in to whether either or both or your work do Childcare Vouchers. It saves quite a bit every month on taxation on your wages and will help tremendously.

[BuntyCollox]

Thanks Granville, I'm tempted to say no when he does actually propose, just for kicks.... that was a joke btw.

We are hoping for a surprise, I've been a nervous wreck since finding out I was pg so it would be nice to have a surprise. Although I imagine squeezing a baby out will be a pretty big surprise anyway.

[BuntyCollox]

Thanks Jess03 actually I thought your comments were considered and genuine.
I needed to read opinions that I hadn't properly thought about which is why I posted here. I just found the choice of words used by some posters to be rather belittling and rude in places.

Erm Join "If someone wouldn't even want to look after you properly even while you are happily together and in love, you can be sure they'll totally fuck you over if their feelings ever diminish."

Anyway I'm not trying to start an argument, I do appreciate that anyone has bother to respond to my bazaar ranting on here. But really nobody knows how this will all work out. Even if we stayed in a partnership there would be no guarantee that he would fuck me over either, even if his feelings diminished.

[Granville72]

Congratulations Bunty. Hope it all works out well and you enjoy being a mummy.

Are you going to find out the sex as you are at that point of pregnancy where a scan will tell you

[JoinYourPlayfellows]

You seem convinced, even wishful at times, that he will leave me with the baby unless we get married.

Nobody thinks that and nobody said that.

The point was that he MIGHT leave you and marriage will provide some protection from that leaving you completely fucked IF YOU GIVE UP WORKING.

If you weren't planning to make yourself financially dependent on him then it would have mattered so much.

[Jess03]

Congratulations! Brilliant news. I don't see the harm because at least you have been able to discuss something properly with him and now know what to expect and can focus on the baby without worry. Apologies for the negativity, we don't expect it to end it's probably just a lot of us have friends who've ended up in dreary hard situations.

[BuntyCollox]

Anyway, after some consideration I brought up the subject properly last night. Tongue firmly taken out of cheek. He was a little affronted at first. Turns out he was planning on proposing in the next couple of weeks and has supposedly already bought a ring and has plans in place. That was a shock. He had initially planned to propose later this year on a holiday we had planned but have now cancelled as I will be hopefully pushing a baby out at that time so not a great idea to be on a plane
He explained the earlier brush offs were to try and put me off the scent, that's why he didn't want to discuss it. I did feel bad I that I have ruined the surprise but he understands why, I did say "10 fucking years!!!" quite a few times.

Again, thanks for all the replies and advice everyone has given.

[BuntyCollox]

Wow, just reading back through the posts there is a lot of negativity on here. While I appreciate that people have taken the time to respond some have made a hell of a lot of assumptions about my relationship with DP after only reading less than 10 posts of mine on the subject. There is no need to project your expectations of relationships (I can only assume from previous experience) onto everyone else. You seem convinced, even wishful at times, that he will leave me with the baby unless we get married.
I asked for advice and it's great to hear opinions I hadn't considered. I know that I need to protect myself and the baby, I'm trying to be realistic by considering that the relationship may not work out. Unfortunately some relationships don't go the distance for many different reasons, however some here can't even entertain the idea that some partnerships do work and maybe, just maybe, ours will too. Whether we are married or not.

[JoinYourPlayfellows]

So this is clearly the superior option from his POV

Only if he's a twat.

And that's a useful thing to know now.

If someone wouldn't even want to look after you properly even while you are happily together and in love, you can be sure they'll totally fuck you over if their feelings ever diminish.

[Contrarian78]

It is and it isn't. He'll get certain rights as a result of being married (rights that he could have without) but, more than that, assuming he isn't a total w@nker (and I'm sure he isn't) the fact that the mother of his child will legally be afforded some security will be a bonus for him.

If the op is going to have many more children and be a SAHM and a primary carer in any subsequent divorce they're not even married yet!!! then she might be awarded a more generous settlement. Spousal maintenance though (thankfully) is becoming increasingly rare.

[Apocalypto]

without a marriage he can walk away from her without a backwards glance

So this is clearly the superior option from his POV, especially since all he's hearing about from the OP is what's best for her.

[JoinYourPlayfellows]

Married or not, the partner would have an ongoing responsibility to the child.

Exactly, and if married he would have an ongoing responsibility to his wife.

Her sacrifice in terms of earning potential and career would be recognised in a divorce settlement.

Whereas without a marriage he can walk away from her without a backwards glance and all he would have to legally provide for the child is far less than it takes to raise a child.

So she'd have less ability to earn money and he'd have fewer obligations to look after the family he left behind.

You can share finances as much as you want, but the reality is that there is no such thing as "family money" unless you legally formalise your partnership through getting married.

His money right now, is legally HIS money. He is under no obligation to give a penny of it to the mother of his child.

Whereas he would have a legal obligation to financially support his wife.

[Contrarian78]

Their being married doesn't make a huge difference in that scenario.

I sort of agree with your last statment, but you ignore the upside of staying home with the baby. Married or not, the partner would have an ongoing responsibility to the child.

[JoinYourPlayfellows]

No, £300 is not a relative amount.

It's just an amount.

An amount that buys quite a lot of things that families, including babies, can benefit from.

It might not seem like a lot if they were married and their combined family income dwarfed it.

But right now, the situation is that that £300 (plus all the advantages of having a job and being employable) is A LOT to the woman who is considering dropping out of the job market because she has a boyfriend at the moment.

[Contrarian78]

Whether it's alot or not is relative. It actually works out at 12 per day. THe op said that the figure was not net (certainly not net of expenses - even if it were net of tax/NI).

I'm not sayiing that she should stay at home (and childcare should be a shared expense) but personally, I'd not have my wife go out to work if the next contribution to household finances was that low. T oeach their own though.

With regards to your last point join I actually beleive that many of them would have known - or might have been able to reasonably foresee that they were making a mistake. Not all of them by any means.