Workaholic DP says I'M neglecting HIM!

[happyclapper]

Have been with DP for 13 yrs. Have 2 DS 10 and 5. After 2 redundancies and a lot of debt which we are half way through clearing, DP now has a good, well paid job which means him working long hours, sometimes away for a night or 2. On top of that he has a hobby which brings in extra cash but which takes up alot of time in the evenings and at weekends.
He does nothing to do with the home apart from help with the kids when he can. Doesn't even change the proverbial light bulb. But thats fine with me as I have enough time to take care of those things and he definitely doesn't.
I work part-time in a job I enjoy but does not have the oppurtunity to increase hours.
DP is very stressed and unhappy in his job and has said almost on a weekly basis he is going to look for something else. This is fine by me, infact I want him to work less or drop his sideline to allow for more family time but in reality this isn't going to happen because he wont give anyhing up.
Our family time amounts to and hour before bedtime with the kids sometimes and a couple of hours on a Sunday afternoon.
If he has a free hour in the evening he goes for a run and on Saturdays he plays football and is gone from 12.30 till 6.
I am not a very demonstrative person , except with my DS, but he has recently accused me of negleting him emotionaly and not giving him enough love.
I would like to know when ffs I am supposed to do this as he is never in the same f**ing room as me!
And excuse me, but what love do I get apart from when he wants sex which he is quite happy to have even when he knows I get nothing from it.
We have had sex counselling with regard to this which basically boiled down to the councilor telling him to make some time for me.
The thought of splitting up just makes me feel sick. I would do anything to keep us together for DS's sake but I can't fake feelings I don't have because I'm living with someone who is so wrapped up in his own life.

[Ginebra]

Wives who fear being single like it will make them a disease-ridden pyriah have no power to change anything.

People mock the 'leave the bastard' advice, but it's not so much that the advice is 'leave him leave him'. The truth is that if you would do anything other than leave him, then nothing will change. If you consider leaving him ridiculous advice then you are just hoping things will change. You've no power, just hope.

Women whose husbands know that they will march to the beat of their own drum and not bury all their own needs, they are the wives who will be listened to.

[Fairenuff]

All the advice about how to improve the relationship is great. Camping, sure. Hiking, lovely. And lots of cuddles and affection. Date night once a week. All these are classic suggestions for improving intimacy and having fun together.

One problem. The husband has no time for the wife.

OP have a chat with him and if he does actually give up his football time, or his hobby time, or his long work hours, or his 'me' time and find some 'us' time let us know.

Either way, I guess you have decided that you are happy with your lot, so, good luck with that.

[happyclapper]

Attila, no I have never posted sbout him before.
I have just reread my original post and everything I said I still stand by but I alsi stand by my later posts in that I feel he does a huge amount foir us and doesn't adk much of me apart from affection.
His singlemindedness is difficult and I do see that his unwillingness to take my feelings into account shiws a certain kack of respect.
I am by no means a martyr however ir a passive person. Quite the opposite.
Infact it is because I am so content with my day to day life which is far easier than his that I really wanted to know if his behaviour is so unreasonable.
When I analyse his actions I am 50/50.
I think we could both make small changes which will help us reconnect and if we don't then I don't think either if us would want to carry on.

[happyclapper]

Sorry for typos. Small keyboard, big finger!

[Herrena]

So basically you are willing to pretend affection because you feel you owe it to him, in return for the nice life he helps you to have. You're going to show him affection in exchange for stuff.

There's a name for that.....

[Lueji]

His single mindedness is difficult and I do see that his unwillingness to take my feelings into account shows a certain lack of respect.

It's not only a "certain" it's a complete lack of respect and love.
It will be a dealbreaker sooner or later, I'm afraid.

[CressidaFitass]

He sounds exhausting - Every spare moment he has with the boys, though few, is spent giving them his undivided attention to the point where sometimes I have to tell him to leave them to get on with a game. He has never lain on a sunbed or read a book on holiday. He will be with them in the pool ALL day or making up games, quizs, stories etc

My DH really believed that working hard at a demanding job was for us, didn't see it as an ego boosting or self interested past time (which I did sometimes as a SAHM). So if you look at it from that angle he is doing his best and probably would like your appreciation of that. (not saying you don't deserve appreciation too but it's a stalemate if you both grudge the other's life and trying to break the stalemate is what needs done)

I'm with Honeyrum on this. You can't change anyone by complaining or ordering them to change. You need to change the things that you can.
Def try taking DSs to watch footie matches. DH should be taking DS1 to his own football training but meanwhile showing an interest might encourage this. Def arrange things to go to and tell DH you would like him to come too.

DH sounds like he has got himself onto a treadmill that he can't get off. He hates his job which possibly makes him feel more entitled to his running and football perks.

Can he afford to leave his job and look elsewhere? Would you consider going back to work yourself so he can take something lower paid.

But you can't browbeat someone into changing so what changes can you make that might break this deadlock.

[happyclapper]

It must be very reassuring to be so certain about things. Even for people you never met.
I think MN is a great place to get people's points of view it is just a shame some people have to be so judgemental and preachy.
Nothing is black and white and noone can say what WILL happen.
Maybe I will be posting on here in a years time saying the LTB's posters were right but for now I'm going to see if it fan get better.
Herrena, I know what the word is and Im not in thus relationship for stuff. I had far more when I was single. I am doing it for the love and security of my family.

[CressidaFitass]

YOu say this happyclapper
Infact it is because I am so content with my day to day life

Are you sure you are content with a loveless, sexless life??

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

"Infact it is because I am so content with my day to day life which is far easier than his that I really wanted to know if his behaviour is so unreasonable".

I think you enjoy being at home with your children, there is no doubt of that to my mind at all but I am not convinced at all of your own happiness within the relationship with your man. I still think that his behaviour is well off towards you, your relationship with him is certainly not a happy one from what you have yourself described of it.

I do wonder what you actually learnt about relationships when you were growing up and what lessons in relationships you think you are both passing on to your children now. You do not of course have to answer any of that but I think those questions do deserve serious thought and consideration.

[arsenaltilidie]

OP's husband doesn't sound bad. Afterworking 15 hour days, its perfectly understandable to want so me time. Do people even realise football is only 6 months of the year.
OP's husband doesn't expect anything from her, he doesn't expect dinner to be cooked or the house to be clean or his wife to have sex with him when he wants.
All marriage's have their ups and down, I suspect they have got themselves in a rut.
How were things when he wasn't working many hours??
But importantly DO YOU ACTUALLY LOVE HIM??

[happyclapper]

Cressida. I agree with your assesment. You can't bully someone into doing what you want them to do and yes Arsenal football us only 6 months of the year.
He also did take DS1 to football on a Sat morning but DS1 lost interest.
Atilla, my oarents didn't have a good relationship and hardly showed any affection to each other......uhm. What a surprise!
But we are not in a loveless relationship and do show each other affection just not as much ir as passionately as most couples I would imagine.
Actually I retract that. I suspect a lot of couples have periods of less than optimum love.
Isn't ut just a case of working through the bad times.
I hear older people taking of bad YEARS that they got through.
People are too quick to give up and move on sometimes.

[HoneyandRum]

Ginebra "Wives who fear being single like it will make them a disease-ridden pyriah have no power to change anything."

"Women whose husbands know that they will march to the beat of their own drum and not bury all their own needs, they are the wives who will be listened to."

I'm not sure who you are referring to on this thread but I didn't read anyone suggest she "bury her own needs". Instead I read people telling her to find way to get those needs met by making active changes. Who "fears being single" either? - no indication that anyone on here mentioned that. Using hyperbole can lose the basic fact that we are talking about two imperfect people who do seem to love each other but have kind of driven down a cul-de-sac that can happen in marriage. It doesn't mean it has to end. If you value your relationship, your family and all the love and difficulties that you have shared and dealt with over the years I don't think that makes you inadequate or pathetic which seems to be the suggestion. Two people that have built a life together also have a lot to lose if they part, but that surely is normal if you truly have invested emotionally, practically, physically. I know many friends who have sustained long, happy marriages and that means they will have overcome many challenges and difficulties and made adjustments when the partners become out of sync with each other. Sometimes you have to build bridges back toward each other, but that is what mature love and commitment takes. No long term relationship remains in stasis.

I never suggested she ignore her own needs but she also has to change. Both partners have to forgive each other - bitterness and grudgeholding are toxic in any relationship.

[Fairenuff]

we are talking about two imperfect people who do seem to love each other but have kind of driven down a cul-de-sac that can happen in marriage

I haven't seen any sign of love in the relationship on this thread. OP has stated that she is only staying because of her son.

That's fine, that's her choice. But that's not love.

[HoneyandRum]

Her DH wants affection from her and she wants attention from him, why do you think that might be?

[CharlotteCollinsislost]

The problem is that attention is an action, whereas affection is a feeling.

OP, you seem also to be saying that you're staying because of a sense of obligation to your H for all he does.

[HoneyandRum]

Affectionate behavior

Numerous behaviors are used by people to express affection. Some theories[3] suggest that affectionate behavior evolved from parental nurturing behavior due to its associations with hormonal rewards such as the release of oxytocin, the bonding hormone from positive social interactions.[4] Research also verifies that expressions of affection, although commonly evaluated positively, can be considered negative if they pose implied threats to one's well being. Furthermore, affectionate behavior in positively balanced relationships may be associated with numerous health benefits. Other, more loving type gestures of affectionate behavior include obvious signs of liking a person. Affection can also shape infant's brains.[5]
George Homans (1950) proposed that positive sentiment increases the propensity of people to interact and that familiarity gained through affection increases positive sentiment among them.[6]

[CharlotteCollinsislost]

Did you write that or cut and paste? Either I don't understand the relevance or bits of it are irrelevant to this thread.

You've confirmed my point, anyway: Numerous behaviors are used by people to express affection - ie the actions express a genuine feeling. None of what you have written refers to actions where the feeling, for whatever reason, is not there.

[HoneyandRum]

I did cut and paste not to negate your point but to add to it, affection involves behaviors (actions). I may be exhausted but I still hug my kids because whatever my feeling my will is to love this child and show this child I love him/her. In life the feelings are not always there but love is also a choice. Otherwise why not just say "I don't have any feelings today, I haven't for a few weeks, so I have every right to not show any affection to you and hug my coworker tightly as I'm feeling very affectionate toward him right now."

[Fairenuff]

more loving type gestures of affectionate behavior include obvious signs of liking a person

This would be a good place to start I think. OP how does your dh show that he likes you? As a person. Not in appreciating the things that you do for him, or being sexually attracted to you, but that he actually wants to share his time, thoughts, feelings and experiences with you.

People who love each other strive to be together.

[Lavenderhoney]

Is football really only 6 months of the year?

Then the ops dh should be around on sat at the moment then? I still don't see how when he is at football its 12.30 til 6 and also if he is 20 years older than everyone else why he is still doing it? Surely the coach would have put a younger man in and he would be playing for a team of men more appropriate to his age group? Surely a bunch of young blokes would run an older one into the ground, unless he's Beckham?

Glad he is looking at changing his job op, but is it to spend more time with you and the ds or more time doing his hobbies?

[clam]

The football season seems to start in August and goes on until May. Which I make 9 months.

[Lueji]

Unless there's a world/European cup...
Add another month and a half every other year.

[Fairenuff]

I think the football is a red herring.

It's just an example of how selfish this man is.

If, indeed, he is actually playing football, even though his wife has clearly stated that this has a negative impact on their relationship, and so has their counsellor, it just demonstrates his lack of care for her opinions.

No-one needs to be out from 12.30 to 6 every single Saturday, for leisure.

That is not a commitment you make unless you are single and have no other responsibilities.

That is a personal choice which should be made with the full agreement of the partner. If the partner is at all dissatisfied then it should be compromised.

Unless I am reading something different to many of the posters on this thread, the problem is crystal clear. The husband will not compromise. So it doesn't matter what the OP does, she will not be happy.

Yes, she could watch him play football, she could have a new hairdo and spruce herself up, she could be more affectionate and loving, she could spice up the sex life, she could become a perfect stepford wife.

But she would still not be happy because all that would be done in an effort to get him to appreciate, admire, respect and like her, as an idividual, an equal, with her own thoughts, feelings and opinions which are just as valid as his.

And he won't do that. Ever.

Think about it. He chooses to make a weekly commitment of 5+ hours to football yet makes no weekly commitment at all to his wife. Their relationship suffers. They go to counselling. The counsellor says you need to make time for your wife.

Why hasn't he done this? Either he is seeing someone else or he just doesn't care about the OP. What other excuse could he have?

It's not about long work hours, hobbies, etc. It's his choice. And he is choosing 'football' over her.