Help my cope with my father's unacceptable behaviour...long...sorry.

[LobstersLass]

Back story... between 2008 and 2010 we had 4 miscarriages. All at about the 7 week mark. We've had all the tests and have been told that IVF can help, but we've decided not to pursue that avenue. We're to old to have it for free, and we can afford the money, but trying and failing would put too much strain on our relationship, so selfishly, we've decided to be happy together and that's that.

My father cannot bear this outcome. Almost every time I speak with him (about twice a week on the phone) he will drop something into the conversation about wanting to be a grandfather, what a good mother I'd be, how he will pay for IVF. He cannot cope with the fact that we've taken the decision to stop trying for a child.

I have explained to him many times that I find his behaviour very hurtful, and that he makes me feel like a failure. I have explained this to him in a calm and rational manner, and also sitting in front of him with tears rolling down my cheeks.

He normally then desists for a while, before starting up again.

He's long retired, but a couple of weeks he'd done some contract work and made some money, I commented that it would go towards their next cruise. He replied that it was going into the St. Thomas's fund. I thought I'd misheard but then realised what he meant. If we had IVF we would have genetic screening due to abnormalities and that would be done at St. Thomas's. I laughed off his comment and changed the subject.

Last week, my fabulous cousin had a baby. I called my parents to let them know. My father's response to hearing that his niece had a baby? 4-0. Sorry? 4-0. His brother now has 4 grandchildren whilst he has none.
What kind of man takes the opportunity of such lovely news to shove it down his daughter's throat that she hasn't made him a grandfather.
He made me cry that day and I've been angry with him ever since. I've still not spoken to him. I know that the fact we've fallen out is breaking my mother's heart.

I am at my wits end and don't know what to do. How can I carry on spending time around a man that is so cruel to me without bursting into tears. I can't cut him out of my life because that would kill my mother.

I need a coping strategy. Please help.
Thanks for reading.

[Rezolution]

Lobster Just be strong. Fingers crossed for you.

[LobstersLass]

I have shared this thread with my husband and it has reinforced his resolve to have this out with my father.
He is going to drive there tomorrow, 90 minutes each way.
I love my husband!

I have also already arranged for flowers to be delivered to my mother on Wednesday (the soonest they could be arranged for).

Thank you to all of you for your kind and wise words.

[Gumby]

I'd be tempted to tell him for medical reasons you can't have ivf and then keep repeating it every time it comes up
Good luck tomo!

[LobstersLass]

Hi Gumby, that's not true though and I'm buggered if my dad is going to turn me into a liar.
My husband and I have decided it's not for us. It's very painful for my dad, but continued failing was very painful for us. I just wish he could accept our decision without the continued nasty sniping.

Thanks for the good wishes! x

[TapirBackRider]

Your dh sounds like a real gem of a bloke - good for him

Hoping all goes well for you both (and your mum) tomorrow.

[1950sHousewife]

Lobster, this is one of the hardest situations to be in. I really, really feel for you - both about the decision you've made and the way your father had taken the news and been such a bum about it.

I think your DH is doing the right thing in going to speak to him. I know it sounds strange, but sometimes men don't listen (or even care) if a woman points out bad behaviour, but are mortified if a man does. It will have much more impact from him.

I would also distance myself from him for a while. Your contact with your mum is, of course, important. But if she can't be strong enough to fully support you against his venom, then I'm afraid she will have to miss out as well. Your dad is like a giant naughty toddler who has not been told off properly so keeps repeating the same behaviour. She really should ignore his silent treatment and be more fully supportive of you.

(BTW I know all this because my stepfather is a royal arsehole, but we put up with his behaviour in the past because otherwise 'my mum would suffer'. But it's gone beyond that point now, his behaviour is so toxic, and if my mum chooses to put up with it and not fight for us then I'm afraid she has to accept that.)

I really hope your DH can make his point tomorrow but that you can all move past this.

Keep updates on how you are.
HTH

[LobstersLass]

1950sHousewife, sadly you're right. My mother is all heart and hates conflict and I hate the fact that she will bear the brunt of his silent treatment - but my father needs to take his medicine.

The naughty toddler analogy is more accurate than you could ever know!

[Rezolution]

Lobster Am thinking about your DH. I don't envy him the task but maybe he is a tough nut?
Anyway, how are you in the midst of all this? Hope you are taking a bit of time for yourself.

[Sunnywithachanceofshowers]

Hello Lobster

What a horrible situation, and I'm so sorry about your losses. DH and I have decided not to put ourselves through IVF, and we've been lucky that people around us have respected our decision.

(((Un-MNetty hugs)))

[RabidEasterEgg]

He sounds a nasty little man

[TapirBackRider]

Just popped in before work to leave some for you and your dh Lobster.

[HoudiniHissy]

What a truly vile man your father is. I feel sorry for your mum. She needs actually to leave him.

He's bullying everyone around him. I hope your DH really tears a strip off him.

Tell your mum to come and stop over with you for a few days.

[Seabright]

Just a thought - if you ever change your mind about IVF (not trying to persuade you to) don't let your Dad pay - he'll feel he bought the baby, so his opinion is paramount and the only one that counts.

[MrMiyagi]

I just have to echo the comments that you really shouldn't see your decision as selfish.

[aurynne]

That man does not want grandchildren... what he wants is a trophy to brag about, an extension of himself in the shape of some more of his wonderful genes being passed on. What a twat.

Your decision is the best one for you and your DH, and it is no one else's business. I feel for you, because my own dad has never gotten over my decision not to have children, and he also used to call me "selfish" and make lovely comments in my presence such as "some disgusting people would rather have a dog than a child" (we do have a dog, by the way).

For my dad, "having children is the only worthwhile thing people can do". Funnily enough, my dad never, ever changed one of my nappies, he never took a day off to take me to the doctor, and when my mum had to work far away from home, he preferred to drop me with my aunties, because I would have been too much work. He has no idea what having children and actually CARE for them is. So yep, he basically shagged my mum, he waited 9 months for her to give birth to me, and then sometimes he would read me a story before bedtime. That's his idea of being a dad. And that's exactly what his contribution would be if I had a child.

I told him to pi$$ off long ago.

[bringbacksideburns]

How did it go OP. Hope you OK?

[Rezolution]

Lobster How are you today? Are you feeling any better about things?

[LobstersLass]

Hello to all of you that continued to post. Sorry I've been away for so long!
Due to one thing and another my DH didn't go over the next day, but I'm not fussed about that. He is more than willing to go, it's just that we had other things to be getting on with.

Anyway, since the last time I visited here I have sorted out my relationship with my mother, she loved the flowers and is in text contact with me often.
My brother came to stay for a couple of nights last weekend - we had a lovely time. He said that my father is aware that I'm not talking to him. I explained everything that had happened and my brother gave me the biggest hug ever.

aurynne, thank you so much for posting - you are absolutely spot on.
Seabright - those are very wise words too!

Thank you all for your support.
I feel so much stronger than I did a few weeks ago. My dad is an arse and that's all there is to it. He's is going to do have to do quite a lot of work for me to even speak to him again. I will certainly never trust him with my feelings again.

[TapirBackRider]

Lobster - I'm very happy that you've got things with your mother & brother sorted, that's great news

[WMDinthekitchen]

Lobster, you have my sympathy. Why not either email or print this thread and send it to your father? He needs to deal with his disappointment, not make demands or try and buy what he wants. He sounds like the older equivalent of a spoilt brat. You have made a reasoned, brave decision while he is alienating himself. If your H decides to go and talk to your F, let us kinow how it goes.

[WomanOfMassDestruction]

Just wanted to say that your father is using your mother (and his treatment of her which he must know upsets you) to control you now that the control via money has failed. He isn't relying on his personality at all - he is using the love you have for your mother.

Anyway, it sounds as if you have this under control yourselves now. I hope your father backs off.

[LobstersLass]

A quick update for you. My mum and my brother came to visit on Friday. We had a lovely late lunch and spent about 4 hours together. It was great.
I didn't mention my dad as I didn't want to ruin the atmosphere.

We're taking my in-laws on holiday to the USA on Wednesday - we had originally invited my parents too, but they declined as my dad said that he couldn't bear the thought of spending 2 weeks with me! Anyway, my mum mentioned that she was jealous of our holiday and I reminded her that she had been invited. She said "yes, I know", and that was that. I think the pattern from now on will be not to mention my dad at all.

To be honest that suits me fine.
Thanks to all for your ongoing support.

[LobstersLass]

I know it's over a year since my last post on this website, but I wanted to thank you all for your kind advice.

We have not changed our minds and are very happy with our decision to not have children.

I am maintaining a good relationship with my parents. My father appeats to have accepted the situation, although I have the feeling he is biting his tongue - at least he is not saying anything and we can spend time in their company without being upset.

The most fascinating thing is that I got to spend a long weekend alone with my brother. I shared everything with him. I also showed him the poem "This Be the Verse". He was really moved and said we should both get it tattooed somewhere discreet!

I am not alone!!!

Thank you for all of you support. I have thought of you often over the last year or so and don't think I would have got through this without you. I am now happy and strong.

For those of you that are not familiar with This Be The Verse...

They fuck you up, your mum and dad.
They may not mean to, but they do.
They fill you with the faults they had
And add some extra, just for you.

But they were fucked up in their turn
By fools in old-style hats and coats,
Who half the time were soppy-stern
And half at one another?s throats.

Man hands on misery to man.
It deepens like a coastal shelf.
Get out as early as you can,
And don?t have any kids yourself.

[Bogeyface]

This be the verse is my favourite poem and the only one I can quote from memory!

I am glad that you have found some kind of peace, and I am glad that your father is biting his tongue, its his turn!

[LobstersLass]

Thank you.
I have reported my first post - asking Mumsnet to add a comment identifying that this is an old thread and pointing to the update much later on.

Bogeyface, you have made me smile.