how do i DO detachment with dh and his drinking?

[highwaster]

been on the binge for 11 days now.
anyone any advice about doing detachment.
have looked quite a bit up on websites.

am trying not to be an enabler

am not giving him money, am not letting him have my bus pass, etc.,

am not throwing away or lookign for drink

[bejeezus]

do you want to leave?

you can leave but continue to pay off the overdraft?

[highwaster]

no, i live here with dc.
i want him sober
failing that, i want HIM to leave

[Thingumy]

My step grandfather was the same.He'd binge for 4 weeks at a time and then sober up and stay sober for 6 months or more (he was diagnosed Bi polar and refused to take meds for it so basically was self medicating).

He would drink vodka from the time he woke until he collapsed on a binge

He drank away all their money in the pub and in the off license.

My grandmother put up with it for 10 years and divorced him after he tried to dry out 3 times and made her complete skint (drank profits from a house sell away)

He died alone at 52,his room was littered with over 30 vodka bottles.

Call al non and take it from there.

[MIFLAW]

Honest truth here.

An 11 day binge in itself could just be a touch of the "poor me"s.

But the rest of your story makes it clear it isn't.

He is not going to stop drinking until the time is right for him. That may be before his death, or it may coincide with his death.

If you leave, that may be what makes him decide - if he doesn't fancy his life without you (still all about him, you notice) then he made get the help that he will almost certainly need to beat this. Or it may not. He may just carry on.

All you can do is decide whether you want to be in the audience or not.

Sorry it's not better news.

Also, whether you stay or go, his debt is his debt - no reason to assume he will stop paying off your shared debt if he leaves.

I'm a recovering alcoholic (and male if that counts for anything.) When I drank I was unmarried and childless. My family now is more important to me than anything apart from my sobriety.

But I know that, if I was to start drinking again, I would step over my crying children to get to the off-licence before closing time. When I drink, NOTHING is so important that it will stop me drinking.

I'm sure this isn't good news, but hope it helps - PM me if you want to discuss privately.

[MIFLAW]

As for how to make him leave - change the locks while he's out, gear in a holdall on the front step and then go out yourself and wait for the text, written from the vantage point of an EXTREMELY high horse, calling you a fucking heartless bitch.

Nothing else will work, is my guess.

[bejeezus]

i want him sober - i know

but you have no control over that, and you need to stop trying to. It is futile and will drain you of energy and time, and is not good for your mental health

you have to look after you

i said I didnt know HOW I detached and listed what I did to detach--I will expand on that I think; I know I needed to 'emotionally detach' because I had heard it said at Al-Anon and on support chat-sites but I didnt know really what it entailed. i didnt think-'i need to detach and so I need to do a, b, c and d. I seperated finances because I have a good friend who kept reiterating the importance of this (if she hadnt persisted I probably wouldnt have) I made plans without him for my sanity-it was too complicated and embarrassing to have him mess them up repeatedly. I sorted out child care for the safety of the kids-he had turned up off his face to care for them on occassions and not at all on other occassions and also to make sure he didnt put my job in jeopardy (didnt want to be late or have to phone in sck when he was unreliable).

The stuff about not nagging him, which is the emotional part I suppose, I found the hardest. This is the part that I was told to do by members of Al-Anon and other partners of alcoholics. I was very resistant and my reaction was alot like AnyFuckers for a long time- felt like I was letting him off the hook/ 'but I WANT him to look after the kids/ but I WANT him to spend days out with us/ he SHOULD explain where he has been/ he NEEDS to KNOW its not acceptable'

it wasnt a predetermined path for me---it was all little baby steps, that half the time I didnt know was leading me to detachment...and then it was a slow realisation that I was detached. Only in hind sight can I see what I did to get there.

I didnt go to many Al-Anon meetings at all as I couldnt get the child care but I cannot say how important they were in helping me--they didnt even give me much direct advice. Just being with people who were experiencing/ had experienced the same; seeing that they were all different kinds of people. the first meeting I just sat and sobbed for 2 hours whilst the meeting went on around me and they passed me cups of tea.

I also used a really good on-line forum-I will try and remember what it was called.

I am suprised that there arent any other people here with experiences

[highwaster]

thanks for further thoughts.
really appreciated.

[AnyFucker]

I was very resistant and my reaction was alot like AnyFuckers for a long time- felt like I was letting him off the hook/ 'but I WANT him to look after the kids/ but I WANT him to spend days out with us/ he SHOULD explain where he has been/ he NEEDS to KNOW its not acceptable'

I think you misunderstood me, bejeezus. I wouldn't be sticking around wanting these things, hoping for these things, trying to make him see what his responsibilities were. I wouldn't spend time with him, I wouldn't place my children in his care.

MIFLAW's description of how an alcoholic's mind works perfectly illustrates it. You cannot tell him what he should be doing. He has another priority, and it is always going to win, until he accepts he needs help and seeks treatment.

Until then, I would be gone. I wouldn't be witness to it, and my children would not be witness to it.

Strong words, yes. It seems to me that is what is required.

[AnotherMumOnHere]

I totally agree with what bejeezus and MIFLAW say.

Couldnt put it better than it has been put so I wont bother trying.

Hope their words of wisdom help you OP.

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

Stop looking for drink; you will not find it all and its just a waste of your mental and physical energies. His primary relationship is with alcohol; everyone and everything else comes a dim and distant second.

There are no guarantees here; he could lose everything and still drink afterwards. You are ultimately not responsible for him.

There are often elements of codependency within such relationships; I would also suggest you read "Codependent No More" written by Melodie Davies.

Alcoholism is a family disease; it does not just affect the alcoholic here. You also need help and support too and I would second contacting Al-anon if you have not already done so. They also have helpful literature and I would suggest you read this.

You write that you are trying not to enable but just by being there you are enabling him. How many people in your real life circle actually know about his drink problem?. Probably not many, alcoholism as well thrives on secrecy.

The 3cs re alcoholism:-
You did not cause it
You cannot control it
You cannot cure it

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

Growing up in a household with an alcoholic parent will do your children no favours at all in the long run.

He does not want to seek help and may actually choose in the future not to do so (he may well also think he can control his drinking/does not have a problem etc; they do denial very well) but you are also not responsible for him when all is said and done. You are only responsible for your own self and your DC.

He will continue to emotionally harm you all if you remain within this situation.

[bejeezus]

AF- the OP says she wants hr dh to leave so I think she is asking about 'detachment' as a tool to help her to seperate rather than an alternative to seperation.

Partners of alcoholics often find it hard to leave/ need to go through the process of detachment because they are co-dependant

[bejeezus]

[sorry-got distracted]..

telling partner of alcoholic to 'leave' will be the same as telling alcoholic 'stop drinking' if partner (OP) is co-dependant.

And it is very unlikely that she isnt to some degree

[QuintessentialShadow]

You know what?
Think about the long term effects on this, before you decide to "detach" and live alongside him.

My husbands alcoholic dad died from liver failure at 55, leaving mil a widow, caring full time for a disabled daughter. But that is by the by.
After his death, the banks pounced. Turns out that FIL had been getting into debt to fund his vodka. MIL in dire circumstances, cant pay rent, cant put food on the table.

As her daughter in law, I am NOT happy, that we have to send her £200 + per month of our hard earned money so that she can continue repaying her husbands vodka related debts. We have done this for 3 years, and there is no end in sight. That is a lot of money 3x12x£200 = £2400 per year, so far £7200. This is money my kids dont see. This could in fact be a fab holiday where we could in fact go and visit MIL. We have not seen her for 3 years.....

I get that you want to find a way of surviving NOW. But please find a way to ensure you dont railroad your family now and in the future, by standing by him and letting him continue doing this to his family. You are effectively doing it to your family, too.

Sorry. I hope you find a way out. But it will be down to you, not him.

[perfumedlife]

Well, if this was violence, not alcohol, woman's aid wouldn't be advising you to detatch whilst living along side him. They would advise you to get him out, failing that, get yourself and your kids out of there, asap. I also can't see any advantages from the drawn out process of detatchment. I think it just delays the inevitable and probably reassures him that life goes on as per.

If he was beating you up I'd say get him out, or get out. He is beating you up emotionally, and the kids, by being absent and drunk for eleven days! What if you took ill, what if the kids had an accident? Who would help you? Cos it wouldn't be the drunk in the pub. Your job as their mother is to get them far away as possible from this mess, and detatchment is far too drawn out in my opinion.

But it is just my opinion.

My aunts dh is an alcoholic, has been for forty years. He functions, to an extent, by being on the dole, working cash in hand when he needs more beer money. She coped with four kids and made excuses/deals all their married life. She has four jobs and chronic health problems, and her grown kids have no respect left for her whatsoever.

Oh, and the saddest part of all, she is not an alcoholic too. Co dependant worked it's charms on her.

[highwaster]

any idea how to get him out.?

[perfumedlife]

Should have said, she is now an alcoholic.

Have you actuallly just came out and asked him? Where is he now? If he is out, I would do as MIFLAW suggested and pack his bag.

[MIFLAW]

Just to say, I have no opinion on whether you should or shouldn't chuck the poor sod out - until he decides to get help, he's as powerless over this as you are, which is what makes it all so very sad, and the last thing I want is to be seen to encourage you to make him homeless too!

BUT what I can say is that, just as he is powerless, so are you - and there is very little that you or anyone else can do to help him in the mean time.

So start putting yourself first; and if that means chucking him out, then that's what you need to do.

And you will know by now that he is as manipulative as the day is long; so, if you do decide to do that, then your best option is to lock him out and put your fingers in your ears while he swears and pleads through the letter box.

My advice, that is to say, is very much "how to," not "what to do" - imagine me as the author of "Handling Piss Artists For Dummies".

[MIFLAW]

So, on that basis, all that would have worked for me was being told - not asked, told - to leave; and, if you don't think he is going to take that lying down, then you need to do your "telling" by means of changed locks and possessions on the lawn.

You may want to sweeten the pill by telling him that it's his behaviour you hate, not him, and that you will consider taking him back if and when YOU are convinced that he has changed; but again, that's your decision to make, and no one could blame you if you've already had enough.

PUT. YOU. FIRST.

Because he certainly won't.

[highwaster]

thanks.
he is crying
he is in pain

[highwaster]

i didnt even say go, he is just crying over the radio

[highwaster]

fuck

[AnyFucker]

is he drunk right now ?

[highwaster]

oh probably

[MIFLAW]

"He is crying, he is in pain"

I'm guessing you're a mum. If your child said, thorugh tears, "mum, I jumped off this wall and landed on my knees, and it hurt" you would, of course, be sympathetic. And then you would say, "don't do it again." If your child then did it again, how sympathetic would you be?

Your husband is now feeling the pain associated with his decision to drink. Chances are he has felt this pain before.

You might want to give him a last chance or you might not. But he is in pain because he drank again, knowing that drink causes pain. Either he is incredibly stupid or selfish; or (my view) he is an alcoholic who has not yet come to appreciate the cause and effect nature of this relationship.

This is his chance to figure it out.