Marital Finances What is Normal?

[Wayhay]

I have been questioning a few things recently but would appreciate some honest (even if I don't want to hear it) opinions.
I have been with hubby for 17 years (we met when I was 19) and have two lovely kids aged 7 and 6. When we first met neither of us had a bean but we both saved hard to buy a home.
My DP has control issues and I have always agreed with him on financial matters. We have separate accounts and he earns 39k pa and I'm a stay at home mum but have a couple of part time jobs term time and my total income is about £5k pa. He pays all the bills and food shopping, one weeks holiday a year and puts a sum in the pot per week for weekly spend. I buy the childrens clothes, school trips etc. my clothes, one week uk holiday (god bless The Sun offers) and any decoration/furnishing that the house requires. He works 9-5 and in turn I keep kids and house so he doesn't need to.
I am wondering whether this is fair? We run one car and our mortgage isn't huge but he says that we are bumping along the bottom so we don't go out for meals, take the kids to the theatre, etc. I appreciate that a lot of fun can be had in the woods for nothing but every now and then? He has recently been going through receipts asking me to justify the shopping bill (even though im within his budget) and he went berserk when I spent £10 on having the car washed. I have access to his credit card but only use that for petrol.
I have rambled but am feeling very cheesed off at the moment! Please advise.

[ivykaty44]

this thread makes me want to sit and weep...he said I couldn't have a breast reduction unless the NHS pay...now I am paying him back and we are both happy with the results

[OutOutLetItAllOut]

but to be fair, the op doesnt seem to know if they had the money to be able to afford the op.
they might not have had the finances available, hence him saying no unless its under the NHS.
i dont get the paying back bit tho.

[Wayhay]

Tribpot my dh exploded when I first mentioned the surgery. Unnecessary, vain, etc. He became more sympathetic when the GP whole heartedly agreed that they must be emotionally and physically distressing because of my frame. He only agreed to loan me the money though when I threatened to have the surgery abroad because it was cheaper. As for paying him back I was so desperate I would have agreed to anything.

[Wayhay]

Outout wind it in. I know that they have to be paid and I was part in jest. However the "services" I outlined have to be paid for. It just shows that everybody is EQUAL regardless of the money they bring in.

[ivykaty44]

It has no relavence whether op knows how much money they have or can borrow.

[nenevomito]

OP, I wasn't suggesting that what you do in the home wasn't worth money, just that you need to understand what the fixed outgoing are before you can understand whether the finances add up.

If the fixed outgoings on Mortgage and Bills are £1400 and our income is £2000, we have £600 a month left regardless of what is done within the home.

[OutOutLetItAllOut]

well then be equal and deal with your financial situation, you have been happy, ( by your own admission) to let him deal with all of that side of your marriage.
sit down, tell him you want input into it.
but before you do, do some ground work, figure out for yourself a base knowledge, if when he showed you the spreadsheet you looked petrified, and told him you had no clue, he might be worried that if he hands things over to you then you will be out your depth. and if money is tight, that will worry him.
you are obviously contributing to your home and family. make him see that aswell.

[Longtalljosie]

If this spreadsheet is so complicated it looks like Greek to you, he's blinding you with science.

You need to look at total income after tax (yours and his), set a target weekly food bill (looks like you already do this), work out how much for utilities bills, mortgage, TV licence, car and home insurance etc, and then work out how much you want to save, and how much you each get for spending money. And that should be equal.

His reaction to your surgery is outrageous. Ask him if he had a condition leaving him in constant pain, how he'd feel. Why are you paying him back in this way, why isn't it just coming out of your savings? Forgive me if you don't have savings, but it sounds as though you do.

[TechnoKitten]

I don't know what's normal but I know my husband and I are happy with our system.

One joint current account. One joint short term savings account. One joint long term savings account.

All income (mine, he's a SAHD) goes into the current account. All bills, mortgage and rent comes out of it. What's left gets divided - some into short term & some into long term savings.

We both buy what we want/need. Anything over $100 we normally run by the other one first.

He handles most financial decisions but we are a team.

[Wayhay]

I have a little because I hate being on the red line. Really good advice longtall I am going to do that to save our marriage. If that means I have less then at least I will no longer feel like a helpless child. Thank you ivy and longtall for br sympathy. For sure if he had had that weight hanging from his scrotum he would have remortgaged the house. I will be challenging the paying back issue when we have the talk! I would like to point out that my earnings have not only gone on myself but in the last 2 years I refurnished and decorated the childrens bedrooms the hallway and stairs and bathroom. This may sound like extravagance or non necessity to some but I want a safe clean home for my family which is what my dh wants also.

[snowmama]

You have not been extravagant at all. You have clothed yourself, your kids and refurbished significant sections of the house on 5K pa. That is a minor miracle.

However, as you have said you need to pick up on what the other posters have said and understand the your complete financial picture, address the current power/financial balance between your husband and yourself and agree a joint household budget with him.

good luck with your talk.

[MizzDizzy]

Normal for us...DH income roughly same as your DH..I'm a SAHM, sometimes self-employed person selling crafty stuff...very low income.

DH wages and Child benefit go into joint account...all bills paid by DD from there.

An allotted amount to an 'everyday' grocery, petrol, kids activity account...savings for xmas etc to other accounts - all accounts are joint as are all credit cards...any loans/mortgage etc also all joint.

I am the money organiser in the household...DH just can't be arsed with it all.

Small personal spends say less than £30 is a help yourself policy - any larger amount discussed to allow for adding to budget.

Basically we have equal access to all monies...even before kids when I was the main wage earner we've never had his/hers money it's always been 'family' money.

[tribpot]

I would agree with MizzDizzy, my dh has no interest in knowing the details of our finances, which is perfectly fine - he just checks any large purchases with me in advance.

Thinking about it further, I can't imagine many people have your surgery done for purely cosmetic reasons, and your husband's reaction seems deeply odd to me. You were in pain. Now you aren't - fortunately. What else needs to be discussed?

You definitely need to address this issue so you can both feel like equitable partners in your relationship.

[WeeScotsLass]

DP and I simply toss everything into a single pot and draw as we need to (eg mortgage, bills etc). All our credit cards are joint. We have no problems with that arrangement, and certainly we never debate as to which one of us earns the more.

I know another couple who do it slightly differently, where again they toss everything into a central pot (joint account) but each has a separate account from which they each place £200 per month for personal expenditure (eg clothes, CDs etc). They tell us that works well too

[PukeyMummy]

We used to have our salaries paid into separate accounts and then would each pay an amount into a joint account a month to cover household bills. What was left in our separate accounts was ours to spend/save as we saw fit. I saved and DH spent. Luckily the main thing he bought was a sports car which he then traded in for a family car when I got pregnant, so fair enough. My savings paid our stamp duty when we moved house. So, given our relative earnings, we have each pulled our weight.

When I became a SAHM I insisted on changing things so that DH's salary is paid into the joint account and then we each get a monthly allowance paid to our separate accounts for spending money (as we wish) and we have to agree larger purchases with each other first. We also have a joint credit card.

This enables us to save (a little bit) from our joint account, rather than one or other of us spending/saving. It also means I don't have to go cap-in-hand to DH every time I want to buy something.

I have friends who still run separate accounts in spite of the wife almost inevitably earning less and it just causes arguments and strife.

FWIW, I find it much easier to have all bills, cards and so on in my name as I am at home and have the time to deal with related admin, whereas DH doesn't. We also put some savings into my name rather than joint names as it's more tax-efficient that way (I don't pay tax as I don't earn). Good thing that DH trusts me.

[loscann]

Before your surgery he used to get "stressed at people gawping"?

Is he ever jealous? Does he control your friends or when you socialise (through the guise of 'having no money'?)

[LemonDifficult]

Wayhay, I feel you've got yourself in into a problem dynamic with your DH (You are married, right? Cos this is all different if you aren't...)

The only way to resolve it is for you to wise up about money. If you can get to grips with budgets, interest rates, pensions and so on then you can demand that he share the responsibility with you. Your joint pay is your joint income and you should have access to it, and participate in decisions about it. Money is power and I'm afraid not taking an interest in money, then complaining someone has power over you is a bit feeble.

Get on MoneySavingExpert.com as it's really simply written and you'll pick stuff up quickly. Ask your DH to see your bills as though you were taking up 'money' as a hobby. This may also diffuse some of his objections.

[Wayhay]

DH is very controlling and it is easier to let him have his way immediately than get brow beaten. He is kind and loving otherwise but he is fearful that if he lets go everything will fall apart. Having said that I have been fathered by him for too long. As a grown woman it is up to me to be as responsible as he (to set the example for my children if nothing else).

He has never prevented me from socialising with friends and family but if they are people he doesn't approve of he makes my life pretty miserable leading up to the event. I have never even mention girls weekends or spa days etc as I appreciate that they are expensive. Re gawping and leering I don't think any one would like that particularly when doing family orientated things (trust me those things entered the room before me). He has never accused me of flirting or cheating tho.

[ivykaty44]

Your dh fathering you/controlling you which ever you wish to call it - as they are the same thing however you wish to label it - is not constructive to an equal partnership and your sex life will take up a notch if he was to stop being the controller.

Your dh is sneeky with his control.

I don't want wayhay to go to the pub with Ivy. I will sulk each time that wayhay goes to the cinema with Ivy and then wayhay will associate me sulking with a night in the pub with Ivy/

Or I don't want my child going to the cinema with her bf as she is bad influence so I will stop her pocket money so she can't go to the cinema with best friend. Then child will stop and not see best friend and get pocket money again.

can you see how you are the child and he is the controller

Plus you know he will sulk/brow beat/offensive behaviour if he doesn't get his own way - so you don't make a fuss

[ivykaty44]

He has never prevented me from socialising with friends and family yes he has and you even go on to explain how he prevents you in the next line - by "he makes my life pretty miserable"

[Wayhay]

I'm embarrassed to say that I have had friendships fizzle out due to it being easier to not see them than listen to the moaning/disapproval because they either like to party and keep me out too late or because they give me ideas (such as taking my car to the nice chaps who clean it for a tenner). I think I should have asked my surgeon to sew on a pair of balls. Why this is coming to a head now I don't know. This sounds stupid but discussIng this with strangers stops me feeling disloyal and confirms the need for change.

[Wayhay]

Also spot on about sex life. How can I fancy someone who is more parent than spouse? I was a very unformed immature 19 when we met and in some respects I clearly haven't grown up.

[GnomeDePlume]

Wayhay you need to be taking an equal partnership in how your day to day expenses are handled. There should be no my money/his money, it should all be our money.

It is fine for your DH to construct long complicated spreadsheets stretching out to the end of time. However, these are pipe dreams and should be kept away from the reality of 'how much do we have coming in and going out plus how much do we have saved?'. Knowing the answers to these is not going to cause the whole thing to get out of control but you should be talking about it as equal partners.

If your DH wont answer these questions then ask him what he is trying to hide.

[Wayhay]

Thank you. The jist I'm getting is that provided that 2 people feel involved and have a little freedom each to not explain themselves or go "cap in hand" then this works well. I personally feel that the I pay for this bill he pays for that outgoing will result in unfairness intentional or not. Is dealing with bills a huge job? When I have suggested that I take responsibility for some in the past dh said it makes sense for one person to do all of it so there is no confusion. Not that I sit twiddling my thumbs all day mind.