Talk to me about second homes...

[wonderingwondering]

We're considering buying a second home in the UK, to use for holidays, weekends. We've a location in mind - good access from where we live by plane/train, close to DH's extended family. What are the pros and cons?

We live in London (central is necessary for DH's work) but are looking for a weekend place with countryside nearby. I don't work so would envisage spending school holidays there with DH commuting for the weekends.

We can afford to move from our current house, but are thinking we'd rather stay put (our current home is adequate for our needs and good location/schools) so we thought a second home in a greener, more peaceful location might be a better investment (financially and in terms of lifestyle) than upgrading our current house.

Any thoughts?

[FiveGoMadonTheDanceFloor]

Whatever you decide then try and integrate yourself.

[CarGirl]

Don't suppose you can afford to build an annexe on any of dh family's home instead?

[GrendelsMum]

I was thinking about this a bit more on the way home, and it did strike me that it might not really be fair on your DH's relatives to have them feel responsible for your house for 27 days out of the 30 - they'd end up putting your bin out and putting it away once a month, picking up post, waiting in when repairs need doing (and they do need doing, new house or not), all the rest of it. I can imagine that they might be very enthusiastic about you being near them, not really think about what it would entail, and that you might end up feeling rather guilty about it, or that it doesn't get done properly.

I was also thinking about the investment potential - I wonder if you'd end up selling when your DS reaches secondary school because it becomes too difficult to head over there regularly, in which case I'm not sure that it would actually be much of an investment.

What do you really want to get out of this? Is it an investment, or because you want to spend time in the country? Do you want to have friends around you that you can chat to / have lunch with? What's your DS going to do during the day / evening? I do think it might be a bit difficult for you to make friends if you're only there one weekend a month.

What we had when growing up, which worked very well, was access to a cottage in Wales through my Dad's job - it was approx 2 hours door to door (though, as I said, there is a lot of packing, laundry etc to be sorted on a Friday night after school), we didn't have to look after it, but it felt like 'home' as we were there about once a month or so. It was lovely when we were younger, but to be honest, as we got older, we had weekend commitments and a lot of homework to get through, and then Saturday jobs start to come along... I don't suppose your DH or you have anything like that you could access?

[Scottie22]

I'm joining the bandwagon here by saying that second homes have been the scourge of rural communities. Thanks to second home owners, thousands of families are priced out of their local areas. Why there is no law against peoples greed with housing - I really do not know....

On another point - a colleague bought a second home in France. Easyjet stopped flying to the local airport so she has to do a 4 hour trip from Paris now - not such a short break for her these days. She hardly uses it!

[HarrietTheSpook]

I don't think many people are aware in this country how common it is in many many parts of Europe to have a country place to go to. I can't think of a family in E Europe where I've spent a lot of time who DIDN'T have a place outside of town. In lots of cases these are very rustic indeed - plumbing, some elecrics and that's about it! It is quite common in the US to have a cabin or small cottage of some sort to go to. Seems to be a pretty normal instinct to want a place to get away to - especially if you've got family in the area in a particular place and you have to live in a big town for work. I am desperate for a place like this myself and would do it in a heartbeat if there were something comparable in the UK in our price range. Our alternative is moving to the country permanently - we'd be "contributing to the local economy" that way I guess as long as spending days on the train back to London for work doesn't count against us.

Reading Squiffy and Grendel's advice sounds like pretty much all the conversations we've had with people who have done the second home thing. I think having to rely on a plane is a big risk. Whether it's any sort of investment depends on exactly where it is - I can't quite tell from your posts if it's in the UK.

[HarrietTheSpook]

Sorry - just seen your original post says 'in the UK'

[wonderingwondering]

EldonAve, we're north, but can easily cross to go south. Any suggestions for a more rural spot within an hour or two of London would be gratefully received!

Part of the UK attraction is that the place we're looking at has pretty regular flights from London. We love France but had discounted that because of the risk that flight routes could cease to operate.

Thanks again for all your posts: they are thought-provoking and it allows me to discuss things that are difficult to talk about in RL.

[wonderingwondering]

Grendel - we had seriously considered a caravan about 2 hours from London, but we'd be looking for a bit of investment too, in that instead of upgrading from our current home we'd use our extra money to fund an extra property.

I take your point about DH's family feeling responsible for our house when we weren't around.

[Stillsquaffingthesteamingblood]

West of London will be out of your price range and is also the most congested way out of town. I think you should concentrate on two areas - out past Cambridge towards East Anglia, or down around Ashford in Kent. Both will be in your price range. Ashford itself is not a fab destination in itself, but there are numerous small villages in the area. Once there you have the North Downs for walking, horseriding, and you are close to the beach. There are still cinemas and bowling and swimming in Ashford if weather is bad. The high speed train from Stratford takes 37 minutes and the drive from (say) Islington is very straightforward and around 90 minutes (so long as you avoid the 4pm-7pm rush). There are really fab villages within 10 miles of Ashford. I have friends who say the same about East Anglia.

I tend to agree partly with other people in that you have a responsibility to the community you move to. You should try to get down there much more than once a month and spend your money there when you do. That extends to making friends in the community, attending coffee mornings and fetes and popping into the pub for Sunday lunch. Local pubs and village shops run on an absolute shoestring and your £60 lunch every Sunday can help those businesses remain viable. If you do that then you are doing more social good than if you spend the money in London.

[HerHonesty]

staggeringly selfish but being wealthy tends to dull one's sense of responsibility.

investment wise, remember when you sell you'll get walloped with a nice tax bill, so it doestn really make sense sense as an investment vehicle unless you are renting it out and can reclaim some of the costs (including the mortgage interest)through rent etc.

also think about your kids - their friends will be where their home is and as they get older they may resent enforced seperation. also sorry to say this but of the people that i do know who do it.

whilst i agree with harriet the spook regarding 2nd homes etc (good point) these countries are much less crowded, have a different type of housing stock and there is considerably less pressure on housing prices. the UK is a very different market.

[wonderingwondering]

Stillsquaffing, thank you - I'll look into the areas you suggest. I'm esp interested in Cambridge/East Anglia. If we could drive, we would spend more time there than if we had to fly, as it would be easier/cheaper.

And being wealthy doesn't remove any sense of responsibility - I don't think my character has fundamentally changed with each payrise I or DH received over the years! I just want some open space for my children and a home I can share with our friends and family, which is in a more leisurely location than our current 'work' home.

I take on board the points about using any second home properly, and contributing to any community we moved to. That is important to me. That's why I'm looking closer to home too, but also why I'd thought of where DH has family, as we already have links in to that community.

[FrightsMonth]

I have acquaintances who neatly splits life between the work/school home in the city and the country home. The family go there every weekend, base their social life there (they ride) and, interestly, the children belong to the sports clubs there rather than in the city.

[Squishabelle]

Second home owners should be taxed into oblivion. Its greedy beyond belief. I hate to see villages where most of the homes are second homes. Its heartbreaking. No-one needs a second home.

[bodycolder]

these are great

[EldonAve]

Suffolk is probably worth a look
Norfolk may be too far and Essex might not feel like you are out of London

[wonderingwondering]

Bodycolder, how bizarre, I had been looking a campsite right next to the A14/Orwell bridge - thinking of a static caravan as a trial of a weekend place to go. But those lodges look great, I will make enquiries, thank you. Think they may meet DH's requirements better than a caravan!

The only concern I have with them is that you are somewhat beholden to the owner of the park that the lodge is situated on. But I'll look into costs and think about the pros and cons.

[Northernlurker]

I just love the way to op asked about second homes, has it firmly pointed out to her that this is a morally bankrupt, finacially dubious and environmentally ruinous choice but just keeps plugging away thinking how nice it will be.

'And being wealthy doesn't remove any sense of responsibility - I don't think my character has fundamentally changed with each payrise I or DH received over the years!' That I suspect is acutually the problem!

[hellsbelles]

wondering - why don't you try renting for a year to see if you will actually use it as much as you think you will. I know it may seem like 'money down the drain' to rent but believe me - if you spend money buying a house you never use (that may be difficult to resell - it's not the same as the london market) - that will be real money down the drain.

[wonderingwondering]

EldonAve - we were thinking of Suffolk, and you are right that Norfolk is too far really. Coastal Suffolk is still relatively pricey.

I'll also look at Cambridge as you suggested.

I am drawn to the idea of a cabin/caravan for a year or so to see how we get on with the packing up and going off for a weekend before we commit to buying somewhere. But I'd want somewhere that is our own, so we can leave things there, rather than hiring a cottage for a weekend or two each month.

[wonderingwondering]

Cross-posted hellebelles.

Northern lurker, I knew this thread would attract comments from people who don't agree with second homes. But I make my decisions for my family. I've had a lot of good advice on this thread, for which I am very grateful, and I'm thinking very hard about what is the 'right' thing to do. But I do need to think about the welfare of my family, as well as the wider/social implications.

I'm not a selfish person, although I know some of my comments on here may make me seem like that: I can't defend myself on here without going into a long monologue about our circumstances and how I spend my time! But I am trying to do the right thing, for my and my family's sanity, and to use the money DH is working very hard for to make our lives more pleasant and to hopefully get a property that we can share with family and friends.

So you may not agree with what I plan to do, but I am finding this discussion useful (all of the comments, not just the more positive ones!).

[miumiu]

We are in the process of buying a second home. We live in a town centre - which is brilliant for work:schools, but we are desperate for a garden;

our new house is under an hour by car from where we live, it is in the middle of nowhere - not a single neighbour, and is going to rack and ruin as it has been empty for coming up to two years;

we will spend all holidays there, most weekends and the odd afternoon (there is a pool, currently moulding and v froggy). The current owners have a bridging loan and if we did not buy it, they would be in deep doo doo. no one in the local communtiy has stepped forward to buy the house,despite the reasonable asking price;

I would never, ever consider a house more than an hours travel from the main domicile - planes get cancelled, you need to be there x hrs before hand, blah blah blah, and you cannot just decide on the spur of the moment that you want to go to the house - or come home;

A second home, by all means, but one that adds to your lives, rather than ends up as hassle.

[miumiu]

My full stop key is blocked by the way - keep ending up with ; instead of .

[bodycolder]

You can leave things in those.They have two set ups leisure and residential so if you go for residential it is 'yours' and year round.The sanctuary one looks amazing really well designed

[miumiu]

FrightsMonth - that is how we are hoping to work it (sailing rather than riding )

[LaurieScaryCake]

First of all learn to drive - that opens up lots of cheaper places to go for holidays - the south-east coast, all along Hastings, there are loads of caravan/lodge parks. Camber Sands etc

there is a really posh one in the Cotswolds too -beautiful log cabins to buy for second homes

If you buy a place that is supposed to be second homes or holiday homes you will encounter much less resentment than if you just bought a cottage in Suffolk.

None of this is a cheap option as once you factor in everything it may be just as cheap (though not an investment) to stay in a cottage or hotel. India Knight has a second home in the Cotswold, but she has a rented cottage which is hers - so you would pay only 8000 a year to have it all the time - over 20 years that is a lot cheaper than the hassle of buying somewhere

But you need to learn to drive - and then factor in the cost of keeping a car somewhere