Teaching assistant in Year 4

[pontypridd]

Is it the case that by Year 4 there is no need for a full - or near to full time teaching assistant any longer?

I have concerns about DS's new teacher next year. She is very young and an NQT. First time to teach this year group as well. DS has a statement of special needs, but not enough hours to pay for any full or even part time support ... level D, I think it is.

I think that means that no extra funding comes to the school for him.

Will post this in the special needs section as well.

All I really wanted to know was whether it is the case that hours for the TA should less now because the children are older and in Year 4.

Thank you.

[pontypridd]

Thankyou so much for all the advice everyone. Its really good for me to consider all these different suggestions and viewpoints as I do get stuck in a sort of panic and worry about DS at times. Particularly at times of change.
We are going on holiday now so I'll come back and read this all again when we get back.
Thank you.

[MidniteScribbler]

OP, the best place to start is to actually talk to your son's new teacher. You have written her off as assuming she is incapable and unable to manage the class without a TA and you haven't even met her. An NQT is still a fully qualified teacher and probably comes with a fresh perspective, young energy, and desperate to do a good job. Whilst your concerns are naturally about your son, you don't know yet anything about this teacher and what plans s/he may have for their classroom and dealing with the students with additional needs. You will need to be a team during the year to get your son the best outcomes, and things will always go better if you approach it from 'how are we going to support DS this year' rather than assuming the worst. I know it's hard when you hit so many barriers throughout their schooling life, but at least try and start off by assuming the teacher is capable and wants the best for your child.

[Jennifersrabbit]

I wouldn't worry about the NQT. My DS has a statement for 20 hours and had an NQT this year who has been great. Agree with the comments re extra energy, up to date training, etc.

Our school has morning TA support only in the junior classes. This is more than many do, I think.

If your sons statement says 15 hours then he should be getting 15 hours. The deal is that support up to 15 hours per week should be provided from the schools delegated budget. Over 15 hours the LA start putting in funding. My son gets 20 hours but the school fund the first 15, the LA only the extra 5.

I think rather than worrying about a class TA, you need to ask for an urgent review of your sons provision. If he needs two hands for certain lessons, ask exactly how they intend to provide that in each lesson it applies to. How do PE lessons work out for him - presumably he either needs alternative provision or extra support?

Think of it the other way around - if he needs a 1:1 for certain lessons, then that 1:1 may benefit the whole class when he is managing independently. Works that way for DS.

If school are being unremitting arseholes you might find IPSEA or your local Parent Partnership helpful. Good luck.

[Lurkedforever1]

ponty do you think the class teacher, headteacher etc would help you and back you up in fighting for an actually applicable statement ( rather than the current one that doesn't seem to be applicable to actual need). Even if your school are uncaring arses it's in their interests to help get the funding rather than trying to provide it unfunded, or struggle with either trying to justify low attainment to authorities, or class disruption. ( not disruption in terms of bad behaviour just the fact the regular staff will have to factor in the time). Plus the fact I don't think the majority of teaching staff would only be willing to help for their own convenience, I'd generally credit them with better motivation to want to help

[pontypridd]

The class is going to have 30 children YOT.

[pontypridd]

This statement is not worth anything, I know. But this is in many ways is my fault. I battled at the beginning to make it state exactly what my son needed. No one has ever, seemingly, paid any attention to the statement. And I've always felt overwhelmed and too uninformed to know how to make it more useful to DS.

So I have given up taking it seriously. The old SENCo was completely useless. The new one seems much better, so I was hoping that this time she would get it updated to be some use to DS. I went to the meeting with as much information as I thought was helpful. But from reading some of your posts I realise that I'm going to have to get proactive again on a different level.

I don't want to get legal. It takes energy out of what I am doing to actually help DS with physio, OT, out of school activities and school work etc

But I will, over the summer, and more probably at the beginning of next term start to ask some questions about the statement and try to get some more funding and help for DS.

Thank you.

[YeOldeTrout]

How big is the class going to be (how many kids), Pontyp?

[AllPizzasGreatAndSmall]

There is a reason LAs don't want to specify how many hours and use wishy-washy words like regular, it means they get away with providing bugger all. Statements should always be specific about what support is needed, for how many hours and who should provide it, otherwise they are not worth anything.

[IsItMeOr]

pontypridd I'm not sure that what your LA is doing re refusing to specify what support is needed sounds right/legal. People on the Special Needs board will know better, or you could try contacting IPSEA.

[mrz]

If it's not written into the statement I'm afraid the school don't have to provide set support

[pontypridd]

The statement doesn't say how many hours - because our LA won't make that clear on statements. But I've been told that it is 15 hours ...

[mrz]

OP it doesn't matter if there's no extra money attached it's the wording of the statement that matters. If it says he requires x number of hours support the school must provide it from the school budget if necessary.

[ItsNotAsPerfectAsItSeems]

I think your worries about support during things like D&T are justified. Just go in and ask how school plan to support your DS at these times. If he has CP then these things should be recorded on his IEP.

[pontypridd]

Thank you for your feedback and thoughts everyone.

Just to be clear: I am not expecting DS to have 1 to 1 support when there is no extra funding coming from his statement. I just would have thought that a full time or near to full time TA in this class would be of help to him and others and also the teacher. There are, of course, other children in the class with extra and higher needs. I don't know whether they have diagnoses. I know they don't have statements.

DS doesn't have learning difficulties as such. He does have attention and some behavioural stuff which is tied up to his CP. I am mostly worried though that at the time when they are doing D&T or other learning that needs two hands to put things together he'll be stuck without any help.

The TA doesn't have to be there specifically for him at these moments. But someone with an eye on the whole class can spot when he needs help and go and help him.

[Lurkedforever1]

In ks2 dds class didn't have ft fixed ta's, except a statemented 1to1. But there were plenty of floating ones because even with any form of sn/Sen the same child/ children who might need ta support in one area didn't need it in another. Although it was usually the same 4, none were actually resident for that entire year or specifically for that classroom, which allowed the ta's areas of expertise to be more tailored to the childs need.

[IsItMeOr]

As others have said, check your DS's statement and check that he will be getting what it says he needs. If you think he needs more than it says, then you will need to look at that at his next review, I guess?

To hopefully reassure you about the NQT thing, DS had a NQT for his reception year. She was confident, capable, caring, motivated and very up-to-date on the latest thinking. We could not have hoped for a better teacher to support DS while we were pursuing a diagnosis for him - ASD - which he didn't actually receive until September of Year 1.

[Minispringroll]

Just because the teacher is an NQT, that doesn't mean she'll have to have a TA in her room. She's a qualified teacher after all. She should get support through extra training and by having a mentor throughout her first year, but that's normal and part of her induction.
I'm an experienced teacher and I'll have a full time LSA in my Year 6 class for the first time next year. She's 1-2-1 support for one specific child with a high level of SEN. The progress of this child will still be my responsibility, though. Previously, I've had support for two mornings a week. In that time, our LSA worked with a range of different groups, not just my lowest attaining one. It depends on the level of support required by the children in the class,...not on the level of support required by the teacher. TAs aren't there to babysit weak teachers. That's for SLT to monitor and fix.

[ItsNotAsPerfectAsItSeems]

Yes, def check his statement and go into school to ask for clarification on how he will be supported.

[ItsNotAsPerfectAsItSeems]

Don't worry about the NQT thing. She may have lots of SN experience. She'll certainly be enthusiastic and motivated and keen for your DS to do his best.

It's true that in general, TA allocated time decreases in Ks2, although some schools raise that up again in Y6. It's simply due to it being easier to manage 30x9 or 10yr olds on your own. Not easy but logistically easier. I'm surprised you think school, without funding, could provide 1:1 TA for your DS. I'm not saying he wouldn't benefit massively but the budget isn't available for that. It's harsh and you could certainly ask if there's room for any extra time but even if a TA was available to the teacher for say, 5hours a week, they wouldn't always be with your DS anyway. I quite often use TA time to stretch my more able group or support the 'big' middle. I'm making a massive assumption that your DS' needs include LDs so apologies if it's a physical need instead. If it is, then you have a better case for proving that help is needed.

[Sallyhasleftthebuilding]

The more statements the greater need, or large class numbers. Go and ask for more clarification if you need from school.

[mrz]

Does your son's statement say he should have one to one support for his needs? If it does the school must provide one to one for the time indicated in the statement.

[fortyfourfeasts]

An NQT is still a teacher. Lack of experience does not mean he or she is not up to doing the job. In our school, the TAs are placed according to need. It may be that as a child matures, their needs change and they may not need as much support, in fact encouraging independence may be something the child needs to work towards. I'm not saying that's the case for you, but I think the first step should be to talk to the existing teacher and/or SENCO and find out what the decision to reduce the support was based on.

[mrz]

A NQT is a qualified teacher

[mrz]

I'm in Y1 and don't have a TA ... some schools have lots of TAs with one in every class, others have fewer who work where there is the greatest need and may work in a different class for different lessons

[pontypridd]

What do you mean the NQT thing is a red herring? If the responsibility lies more with teacher now - sure the fact that the teacher is an NQT is a worry ...

Sorry. I'm very tired. Will go to bed and read this tomorrow again.

Thank you for your input moab.