Asbestos in 75% of schools. Teacher killed from pinning up art work.

[IamFatherChristmasNOTsanta]

I listened to Jeremy Vine today please listen if you can. It was talk in based around this lady, the only link with info I could see was Daily Mail.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2514958/Caring-teacher-died-exposed-asbestos-hanging-pupils-work-contaminated-classroom-walls-25-years.html?ico=home^headlines


Its in 75% of schools, the issues are where doesnt have it than where has got it.

It can be distrubed in all sorts of ways, this lady sadly passed away from pinning art work into walls.

All it takes is one fibre to settle in the lungs were it lays latent for decades.

What I found most disturbing was one man called in, and said he helped his GF staple art work into the wall until he saw a tiny, postage stamp warning saying, "don't disturb the walls, asbestos". I was aghast at that. As he said how many other un witting teachers in the 75 5 of schools that have this are pinning art work or whatever into the walls and releasing this killer material?

I really want to raise awareness about it. I am in

[rabbitstew]

I don't see anyone dismissing anyone else's concerns casually, mrz. People should be aware of environmental hazards. I also worry about pollution from cars and industry, lead paint, mercury poisoning, global warming. None of these things should be dismissed casually. I would love to see all schools free of asbestos, given that our children, who are the most vulnerable, spend so much time in them, but I also understand that asbestos is found all over the place and I wouldn't be hugely more trusting of its safe mass removal than ensuring it is kept safely in place, or much more trusting of supposedly safe heat and fire resistant alternatives to asbestos, to be perfectly honest.

[IamFatherChristmasNOTsanta]

I also got the impression from the radio interview that the stats are going to be rising considerably as the next wave of people exposed comes through, probably my 70's born generation.

[IamFatherChristmasNOTsanta]

rabbit

I think one of the more worrying things about the cancer caused by A is that its terminal and one of the worst cancers you can get. People have got it from washing clothes of workers exposed.

,My DH building had some removed recently and the whole floor was sealed off people in nuclear suits etc.

I just think a simple plan to keep teachers and children safe though, from such silly things as pinning stuff into the walls would be a good basic start to keep everyone protected from such needless exposure.

[rabbitstew]

IamFatherChristmasNOTSanta - I agree, people should be made aware of the risks, but I find it quite frustrating that so many people still seem to be so ignorant despite the fact I think the risks have been quite widely publicised. People seem capable of forgetting what they are supposed to be aware of very quickly after being told. I'm not sure how so many people working currently in schools have managed to avoid being aware of the risks (if there really are great numbers of these people). And to put it into perspective, whilst it is one of the worst cancers you can get, your background risk of getting it is currently about 1 in 1,000 - not like the 1 in 10 chance of a 1940s born carpenter. People still smoke, drink, take illegal drugs, have unprotected sex with multiple partners, despite warnings, and despite the risks from these things being far more likely to become reality - and if there hasn't been a warning in the last 6 months, some people even seem to think it's because the risk has gone away.

[rabbitstew]

In fact, in general, people seem to behave very strangely around risk, so it is genuinely difficult to get the message right and behave in proportionate ways. I seriously resented being told about listeriosis in pregnancy, because I then felt obliged to alter my diet, avoiding several extremely nutritious foods I normally enjoyed, which was stressful, and panicked a bit if I accidentally ate something I "shouldn't" have, or couldn't guarantee the safety of because I'd not prepared it... all over something I was really, truly, extremely unlikely ever to get, even while pregnant. I thus swapped the pleasure of lots of nutritious foods and an exceptionally small risk of something horrible happening, for guaranteed extra stress and inconvenience and a more limited diet. And then the newspapers have the cheek to report how harmful stress in pregnancy might be. Well, whose bl**dy fault is that?!... I would rather not have had all the dire warnings and advice in the first place - not at a time in my life when hormones and new-parent-to-be emotions made it hard to see things entirely rationally. It's not as if I wasn't, in any event, more at risk of killing both myself and my baby by crossing the road, but I didn't stop doing that while I was pregnant.

Not that this is related to asbestos, it just still annoys me.

[Retropear]

What age of schools is this most common in and do backing boards attached to the walls give some protection?

[2468Motorway]

Rabbitstew

You might enjoy a book called 'Reckoning with Risk' . It's excellent on our inability to correctly assess risk.

[mrz]

The primary school I attended as a child was recently pulled down to make way for a larger building and the demolition took place inside a "plastic bubble" by men wearing full breathing apparatus. it was built 88 years ago. Strange when indoor toilets were added some 50 years ago asbestos was removed while lessons went on around the builders.

[Retropear]

Yes this is why I am worried.

I was teaching in a Victorian school when they literally drilled through my classroom wall whilst teaching to put in new toilets.

We always had backing boards on the walls,surely that would give some protection?

[mrz]

www.asbestosexposureschools.co.uk/how%20to%20check%20asbestos%20management.htm

although as wonkylegs says the site has it's own agenda.

[rabbitstew]

Retropear - school is highly unlikely to be the only place you've been exposed to asbestos. Better not to focus on what has already happened and can't be changed, because it won't change your risk to think about it. I wonder how many private houses you've been in where the owners have had their bathroom redone, or have been sticking pictures on their walls, or have been doing DIY? Or how many building sites you've walked past where they've been knocking down an old building without a single "bubble" in sight? Schools are not the only buildings in the UK to contain asbestos, nor the only buildings that are allowed to get a bit run down when they shouldn't.

[rabbitstew]

(she says, thinking about it....)

[straggle]

Someone mentioned local authority schools on this thread but independent schools and other maintained schools that are required to have their own asbestos management plan don"t necessarily comply with regulations. This 2011 press release suggests a third of independent schools inspected by the HSE didn't comply, so teachers and pupils may be much more at risk outside LA schools than in them. In maintained schools teachers are more likely to be in classrooms and if there was a problem that affected children the teaching unions would be the first to voice their concern.

Interesting that the Daily Mail article acknowledges the valuable role of the unions here!

At the same time the government considered cutting its asbestos policy work to save money. What message does that send out?

[rabbitstew]

That the government doesn't care?

[Retropear]

That is true Rabbit.

We pulled out of a house because it had an asbestos roof that needed replacing(would have cost ££££££ to do it safely).Was clueless until we got the report back.

The amount of shitty places we've rented over the years too.

[clam]

I had a workman round to my classroom recently asking where I wanted my new bookshelves putting. I showed him and he consulted a little map from his pocket and said "sorry love, can't go there, there's asbestos in that wall."
I've stapled things in there before now!! How come he has a little map and knows about it, but I, the class teacher with the staple gun isn't privy to the information?

[rabbitstew]

To be honest, I think you'd have to have a pretty spectacular staple gun to create the same asbestos risk as drilling into a wall to put up shelves, clam. However, it is bad that you are not privy to the information - who knows what you might or might not be doing to the walls?!

[Whathaveiforgottentoday]

I've worked in a school with asbestos and we were not allowed to put things into the ceilings as the tiles contained asbestos.