Who should decide whether DC learns instrument?

[GetStuffezd]

I teach in a Junior School. Recently we had a brass band in and, subsequently, letters were sent out to children (in lower years, who I don't teach) who were interested in learning a brass instrument. Obviously there were limited places so my colleague asked all the children who was interested in learning X,Y or Z and letters were given to those who expressed interest.

Friend has now had complaints from a couple of parents who are unhappy they weren't given the letters. Friend maintains the children weren't interested in learning, so what was the point of giving them the letter? I think I agree.
How would you feel if it were your child?

[ZingWantsCake]

I also think all parents should have been notified.

especially because some of the children may have missed school that day (due to illness) and were unaware of the opportunity and never had a chance to express their interest.

if there's way more interest than available places first comes first served is normally the way to go. or a second "lesson" should be available

[ClayDavis]

Ours start lessons from beginning of year 2 so there is a 'musical aptitude' test towards the end of year 1. They do require commitment to LA and school orchestras from year 3 onwards and can and do remove places from those who aren't committed.

[ZingWantsCake]

and kids not showing an interest due to worrying about the money is a real thing.

mine have music lessons. we can afford them.

but last year DS2 gave up football because he was half- arsed about it and I said I'm not wasting money on something he doesn't really want to do. who can afford that?
so DS3 said this year that he'd like to do football but he won't because it is expensive and he doesn't want to waste our money (bless him)

it took me a while to convince him that I'm more than happy to pay for football and that he should worry about the expense, we have money budgeted each month for stuff like that!

Eventually I asked him that if football was free would he want to do it or not. he thought about it then said no.
he said he likes playing in the garden but not at school.
and he wanted to know if he can change his mind later and maybe do it next year.

he chose to do chess club and guitar instead (both started today, he loved both) - which combined will cost 4 times as much as the football would have! ( but I'm not telling him that )

[seventiesgirl]

Agree with all parents being given a letter. I too would have been one of the shy ones not putting up a hand when asked but if given the chance to go home and talk to mum and dad may have been interested.

Unlike my older sister I never had piano lessons (even though we owned a piano) or ballet lessons "because I never expressed an interest". I still feel regret about this and am going to make sure my son gets an opportunity to try activities at least in case there's something out there that really rocks his boat!

[noramum]

All parents should have received a letter. Our school works in partnership with a children music trust and offers from Y1 onwards piano, cello and violin lesson.

For us it is great as the 20 min lesson is during the day so we don't have to wiggle another activity into the small after-school time we have as we both work.

We actually favoured the piano but DD was determined to learn the violin and still loves it.

I think while some children will be putting their hands up it is not fair to children who may be shy or absent. Also talking through it with the parent will make some aware what it is and what it involves and they may decide to take it up.

[AbbyR1973]

Actually I think that "musical aptitude tests" are not the way forward either. It rather suggests that you should only do music if there is a fair chance that you are going to be good at it. Music is not just about whether you might be good enough play in orchestra's later on or do something amazing with it, although clearly it would be nice to identify children with a particular talent. Music is also a broadening hobby that children can take on through their whole lives. Also the choice of whether to do it or not should be available from the off, not just restricted to older ages. DS started violin last year in reception. Letters came out to the whole school and DS had seen some older girls playing in assembly and said he wanted to do it.

[friday16]

Friend has now had complaints from a couple of parents who are unhappy they weren't given the letters.

Quite right too. Next time the school talks about wanting to involve parents in a partnership to support behaviour and learning, it's to be hoped that the school is reminded that it's not a one-way street.

[flowery]

My son learns violin and piano, he's year 2 and doing really well with both - he loves it. He got interested because his whole class had a go when he was at pre-school, combined with the fact that I obviously have a violin at home, plus DH and I both play the piano.

But without those things, in circumstances described by the OP, he would have been hesitant at putting his hand up in front of everyone and would have missed out. I would have been as a parent.

[flowery]

Well I think parents are more likely to encourage if they play, yes. DH and I both got a lot out of playing, so when DS1 expressed an interest in getting out my violin and having a go, and enjoyed playing at pre-school, I did encourage it. Also, obviously his practice sessions with me are much more effective than they would be if he did them alone or if I had no clue, so he's making good progress which again is encouraging for him. Violin sound pretty horrendous at the beginning.

But my point really is that left to his own devices, knowing DS1's character, he would not have put his hand up and would have missed out.

I think all the class learning in pre-school for a year was good, and it prompted DS1's interest in my violin. Whether any of the other children kept it up (making it arguably "worth it"), I don't know - it wasn't our local pre-school so they all went to a different school.

[ClayDavis]

IIRC there's a sort of 'second intake' in year 5 in my home LA. They do now provide a year of instrument teaching in class in year 4 for all children. I think that's funded by local businesses though rather than the music service itself. I don't know how that feeds into being accepted for lessons in year 5 onwards.

[strongandlong]

I learnt the violin (and subsequently viola) at school. Initially in whole-class lessons starting in Y3 (iirc).

I think abby has a v good point about aptitude testing. I had no talent whatsoever, but I liked music and I liked playing with my friends and through dogged persistence I got good enough to play in a highly regarded young people's orchestra.

I consider my musical education to have been one of the most valuable parts of my education. I got so much out of it, especially in terms of the knowledge of what it's like to work as part of a very close and effective team.

I think it's such a shame that only kids who's parents can afford to pay get that kind of opportunity these days.

To get back on topic ;) My DD1 is shy and would be quite likely not to put her hand up if asked to express and interest in class, so I agree that letters should have gone to everybody.

[strongandlong]

ha ha flowery beginner string players do sound really terrible, don't they? When I learnt they didn't let kids take instruments home for a while (1 or 2 terms, I think) because they'd had cases of parents discouraging kids because they sounded so awful...

[titchy]

Entirely agree with everyone else. Apart from the obvious reasons that have been pointed out - it's generally thought of as good to communicate with parents and let them know what's going on and what opportunities are available. I take it your school doesn't think communicating with parents is particularly important?

[rabbitstew]

My dss' school does two years of whole year-group musical instrument teaching, in years 4 and 5, so some schools do still do that, strongandlong.

[flowery]

"When I learnt they didn't let kids take instruments home for a while (1 or 2 terms, I think) because they'd had cases of parents discouraging kids because they sounded so awful..."

That's a shame. :( Hopefully the no taking home policy reduced that, although presumably without practice it took some people longer to sound reasonable anyway?!

[NynaevesSister]

Oh this makes me sad. I too watched a sister miss out on lots because she was too shy and would never put her hand up.

I am really sad that teachers are still like this. It really isn't fair.

[MrsCharlesBrandon]

DD2 picks up her Cornet today. All children in yr4 are given an instrument (different instrument per class) to learn, and tutors come in weekly. DD1 had a flute last year and is continuing to have lessons. They both also had 2 years of violin tuition and gave up, but they can read music now which is more than i can!

I think parents should have had a letter too, or at the very least an email.

[noramum]

Abbey: I agree, each hobby should be tested regardless if a child is "tested" as good or not.

Alpinemedow: neither DH nor I play an instrument, I actually can't sing, totally tonedeaf. But: it was clear that DD should try it out. DH now learns the violin together with DD as he does the practice sessions with her.

Yes, we were concerned about the sound a violin makes. But DD actually plays beautifully.

[Periwinkle007]

yes I agree - letters should have gone home to everyone. Otherwise I can see why parents might think they were given to the best behaved children, the richest children, the poor children, the underprivileged children, the whatever children and so on. Some kids wouldn't think about it until later, something like that needs to be a considered decision I think.

[difficultpickle]

I wonder if it wasn't offered to all children as teachers find it a real pain when pupils are popping in and out of lessons to go to music lessons? At ds's previous school some of the teachers got really irritated at having to manage their pupils' attendance at music lessons (reminding them to go and then helping them catch up with what they missed in their school lesson).

At ds's current school he has three music lessons a week and it is an expected part of his teachers' jobs to ensure that pupils are helped to catch up on what they missed.

Obviously the fewer pupils who are dipping in and out of school lessons, the easier it is for the teaching staff to deliver their lessons.