3+ 4+ 5+ 7+ support thread 2013

[mumteacher]

I have had a number of messages asking if I have any spaces in my classes. I'm really sorry but I have been at full capacity for some time now.

However, I do appreciate that this is a very stressful time of year for parents who have children sitting these private school assessments in January 2013. So, I'm hoping that by setting up this support group thread I can help by answering some questions you have about these assessments.

Hopefully this thread will also contain some useful insight from the experiences of parents who have already been through the process.

[SuiGeneris]

Mumteacher: many thanks for all of this. I realiste now one of my posts might have misled you: DS is nearly 3 and will be sitting the Thomas assessment in Oct for entry into their 2014 reception class. Does it mean he's sitting a 4+ rather than a 3+ and if so, what does he need to be able to do, please?

[horsemadmom]

Hmmmmm,mumteacher. Did't know anyone in DD's year at NLCS who was tutored while they were at school to 'keep up'. Ditto at 4+ entry. Stop scaring these poor parents.

[horsemadmom]

my keyboard is not working well. Apologies for typos.

[EastHollyDaleStreet]

I did think that sounded a little strange! Surely if the child gets into the school, the level will be achievable for all of them? I don't want to have to be getting coaching for dd throughout her school life, rather, to have her at a school where she is working to her ability.

[impatientmum]

Thanks mum teacher. Will they be assessing on reading at 4+? Dd has just begun to do simple reading.

[mumteacher]

Horsemadmom I don't know about the secondary school which is where I'm
assuming your DD is because there are 8 girls in my dd class and 7 other girls in the other class (same year) that are pulled into the library at break to do 'further work'. The week before Christmas break one of these girl's parents were called into school to meet with the class teacher who asked them to do some extra work with their DD over the holidays. The reason I know this is because the mother rang me to see if I Could help.

Not all children are going to be good at everything and will need help in certain subjects. The thing about these schools is that they don't want any child to fall behind even in a year where it may not matter so much (non examination year so yr 3/4/5).

I have always maintained that tutoring/coaching is an adult in the child's life helping by doing extra work this can be a parent. The child is doing extra work with someone even eastholly..stated in her first post her DD wouldn't sit to work with her and changed her mind in her second post to say her DD was curious and did work with her after school.

I have nothing to gain by scaring anyone, these assessments are tough simply because there are so many girls applying for so few places you have to do whatever you feel is right to try and secure a place for your child.

[EastHollyDaleStreet]

What I meant was she wouldn't do the Bond Assessment books, or the practice papers which I'd bought - you are right though, I'd not thought of it that way - of course spendning time with us learning new things could be thought of as coaching or tutoring - I just associate those words with structured lessons

[mumteacher]

Grim sleeper thank you for your post- I'm trying to raise above the 'non-believers' and their posts but it isn't easy!

Girls and boys Habs assessments are different. There will be more physical activities for the boys than the girls,

[mumteacher]

Really don't know why my posts show up incomplete!

So physical plus more mathematical activities, odd one out they like at hab boys, building and making things.

[horsemadmom]

Mumteacher,
Maths Club and English Club (for non-NLCS folk, this is what the booster sessions are called) are one thing. Doing some brush up work over the hols is not unusual. Engaging a tutor to perpetually help your DD to 'keep up' is just not necessary. The girls do just fine if their parents back off and don't get wound up. Have been a parent there for 11 years and I know whereof I speak.

[mumteacher]

Horsemadmum laid bk parents at Nlcs ?! Seriously?! It's One of the most fast pace school there is and when a teacher says do some extra work with your child you do it.

If that means you employ someone because you and your husband work 12 hrs a day then that's what you do.

You claim that there's no one in your DD yr and I question in the tight lipped culture of Nlcs I'm not sure it would be made 'public' knowledge for you too know.

This thread has once again taken a turn which I really didn't want ( more my fault I think for being dragged into the debate) and so let's just say we both know our DDs are happy and that everyone has to what they have to do to gain a place and then keep it x

[horsemadmom]

Wow! I'm glad that my DD and all of her friends are clever enough to not need your 'help'.

Mumsnetters, don't believe the hype. If the school is right for the DC, they get in. If you lump tutoring on them once they're in, in a mistaken belief that they won't keep up, the school will tell you to park your neuroses at the gate. Mumteacher is playing on your insecurity. Tell her to take her toys and clear off.

[maya1234]

Horsemad

It's great that your kids are so clever that they got in and aren't tutored.

I have friends that teach at Nlcs so I know for a fact that what mum teacher says is true.

She isn't advertising her services here and is just trying to share her experiences of the assesment with other parents here.

The assesment is lottery - most kids who get in have been prepped either by a tutor or their parents - believe what you want.

Why don't you clear off this thread instead?

[maya1234]

And take your horse opinion with you

[musicalfamily]

This is a public forum and if people are following the rules and giving opinions they are allowed on any threads they like.

I have no opinions either way but just wanted to say that it is not on to come on and tell people to clear off a thread just because you do not like what they say.

[Hawise]

Mumteacher - I agree with everything you have said. There will always be children in these types of high achieving schools that are being tutored.
Most people will not admit to it. Whether it is a parent sitting down and working with or child or paying for someone to do it because they haven't got the time, it's the same thing in my book.
Horsemadmum, I'm glad for you that your child is capable enough to keep up with the work at NLCS without tutoring, but this is not the case for everyone.
I know of a child at NLCS(and she is at the top of her class) who has been tutored since a really young age. Some people do it because they want their child to keep up with the work and others to keep the child at the top of the class.

[mumteacher]

I just want to make it clear that I don't tutor children once they are in the school. I only help prepare children to get in ie the 3+ 4+ 5+ and 7+ assessments.

So I have nothing to be gained by'playing on people's insecurities'.

Yes this is a public forum but please let's at least try and keep it on track. Horsemadmum you can at least accept that it's a stressful time going through these assessments.

Lets try and help these parents get their children into the schools first and worry about the rest later.

If it helps I can start another thread to discuss the merits (or not) of tutoring once your in a school?!

[maya1234]

Fair enough - however horsemad is telling mumteacher to clear off - when all mumteacher is trying to do is help others.

[emanuela]

I would just like to say that I know 5 girls at nlcs and 4 are tutored 1 is not (incredibly, incredibly smart girl even by nlcs standards).

Having said that, my son will sit 7+ in two years and I am reading mum teacher posts with much interest.

If you want to have a debate, can we please do a Aibu and leave this threat "clear" and focused on assessment advice?

Thanks a lot!

[mumteacher]

Let's see if we can't get this thread 'back on track' ;)

Turniphead1 highgate round2 that's great! Well done x

Shapes, sequencing, drawing and puzzles,social interaction with other children will also be noted.

Your post was on the next page so I didn't see it and then caught in this silly debate!

Sorry hope you haven't sat round 2 yet :)

[mumteacher]

Emanuela where will you sit the 7+? Are you considering Habs 5+ since you're 2 yrs from doing the 7+?

[Turniphead1]

Thanks Mumteacher.
Hard to know how much they can observe with 4 kids in a 30 minute group session.

Agree this is not the place for debates about whether kids are tutored to keep up with schools such as NLCS once they get in.

That said, Horsemadmom is a good and helpful contributor on the education boards and knows a lot about North London independents.

[emanuela]

Hi mumteacher, my son will sit Westminster Under, Highgate, Ucs and Habs (boys) at 7+. He is still in reception, but I want to be prepared for when the time comes...

I will be copying the more relevant answers from you in a word document (together with all the relevant info from other threads) so that I can then easily find all the answers.

Thanks for all your help

[horsemadmom]

Thanks, Turniphead1. Hope it's all going well. If it's a 30 min. session, they're looking to see if DS participates and is a team player. All the schools on your list just want boys who are excited about learning. Once you've closed the gap between levels at state primary and a good pre-prep, it just comes down to readiness to learn and that spark that makes the teachers want to spend 6 hrs every day with your DS.
A little story-
I ran into one of my DS's friends from pre-prep and his mum- which was good as I'd never have recognised the 6 ft tall version of this boy. At 7, he was one of the handfull who went to a prep as opposed to UCS, Highgate and Westminster. Frankly, I thought he was a bit thick. Turns out he's at Westminster having got in at 13. He had time to mature and needed more years of nurture than some of the others. Had he, by some miracle, got in to one of those schools at 7 he might have been weeded out before he found his feet.
Not every child is ready for a fast-paced academic enviornment at 4+ or 7+. Teaching them tricks and drilling them past where they are naturally MIGHT get you a place (notice I say you) but, you risk having a DC who isn't ready to cope on their own. And really, should you be paying fees and tutors? It perpetuates this culture of helicopter parenting and the poor kids have no sense of self esteem as a result. You shouldn't feel you have to jump in with a life belt every time. Let them doggy paddle and occassionally swallow a bit of water. The podium finish might be at 11 or 13. Or they might have less aptitude and less apetite for the race and go do something wonderful that wasn't in your (notice I said your) plan at all.

[lesmisfan]

Could I ask a genuine question? Why are parents so desperate for NLCS at 4+? What I am reading here absolutely supports what I hear from friends with children there, huge amounts of homework, extra support, kumon lessons at the weekend and I know several girls who have been advised they might be happier elsewhere. To add to that, the 4+ tutoring horrifies me, why are we forcing such small children into situations they may not be ready for when there is 7+, which I absolutely accept there may be a need to tutor for and 11+. We are local to NLCS and made a deliberate decision not to go sit DD at 4+ as we felt we simply didn't know if she was bright enough or indeed tough enough for that environment. She is at a prep school and we will absolutely consider it for her at 11 if she continues as she is now but it really concerns me about the panic to prepare tiny children for these highly academic schools without really knowing what kind of child they are.