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Join our Primary Education forum to discuss starting school and helping your child get the most out of it.

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Join our Primary Education forum to discuss starting school and helping your child get the most out of it.

Primary education

Can a 5yo be a bully?

33 replies

rebl · 22/07/2011 18:56

I mean in the true sense of the word? I mean, are they capable of being systematically vindictive against 1 child reguarly and do it because they actually mean to be nasty all the time?

My ds is being picked on by a boy in his class everyday. The boy isn't being nice at all. He's also breaking ds's toys that he takes in. He's telling other children to get him and telling other children to run away from my ds. My dh says its bullying but I'm not sure a 5yo (admittedly he's one of the older ones in the class) can actually be a bully.

DH and I need this clearing up so I thought I would ask MN!

The school are being very supportive over it all btw.

OP posts:

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rebl · 27/07/2011 16:36

teacher that is an interesting idea. I wonder if ds will do it though. They broke up yesterday so I'm hoping that over the summer it will all blow over although sadly I'm suspecting it won't. DS is an easy target. I've been told that the new class teacher has been informed of the situation. I guess we'll see what happens in September but we will be keeping a very close eye on the situation.

OP posts:

sue52 · 27/07/2011 11:44

DD2 was the target of a manipulative and sly 5 year old. It took me a while to realise what was happening as I did not believe such a young girl could be capable of premeditated unpleasantness.

teacherwith2kids · 27/07/2011 11:35

(Also, should point out that this shouting strategy pre-dated the selective mutism - the bullying continued into the next class, and DS gave up shouting as the next teacher never really responded. So he just gave up talking to adults altogether except at home, and even then very rarely)

teacherwith2kids · 27/07/2011 10:53

Rebl,

Just to tell you what we did in this situation when DS was being bullied. DS would not hit back - he's a very rule-bound child. Also he was tall and strong and his bully was much smaller so DS would instantly have been labelled the attacker (it was very hard, because of this physical disparity, to make anyone take the bullying seriously). He didn't want to 'interrupt the teacher because she's always busy'.

So I taught him to shout. VERY loudly (it was a reception class with a large free-flow outdoor classroom so he needed to be heard from a long distance). 'Stop doing that, I don't like it' or just 'Stop it X'. I told the teacher that this was going to happen and she was all a bit 'OK, whatever, I think this is all in your imagination'.

After hearing and dealing with LOTS of shouts from DS for several days, we did finally get the issue taken seriously, a TA was put on covert watch and saw much more of what was going on. As I said, the class teacher never really dealt with it properly, but I would say that teaching loud shouting rather than hitting or having to 'go and tell the teacher' was a very successful strategy for us, without in any way putting DS 'in the wrong'.

kipperandtiger · 27/07/2011 06:20

Would normally not condone hitting either, but in this case I think your DS absolutely did the right thing to hit this bully. He's telling him that if he continues to behave in this way there will be consequences. Why is the bully not being given time outs or excluded - and supervised, to check his behaviour doesn't continue? (I am guessing the 5 yr old bully has done it more than 4 times, and not just once or twice). Your DH is right about this. Maybe time for an appointment with the headteacher, if the form teachers can't control the situation.

kipperandtiger · 27/07/2011 06:15

yes

legalalien · 26/07/2011 19:09

absolutely yes.

[this thread has made me feel much better as when I tentatively approached DS's school a year and a half ago on this subject I thought maybe I was doing the wrong thing. am pleased to say they sorted it, but only after a change of class teacher. ]

munstersmum · 26/07/2011 10:52

Difficult one rebl because we strictly followed the don't retaliate line & in hindsight think it was biggest mistake. Teachers didn't address at all effectively so in effect their inaction condoned the bully's behaviour & it just continued downwards.
We were adamant DS should not become one of life's victims. We now take the line your must never start anything & do no worse back. DS knows this would get him into trouble at school but we will not tell him off.

rebl · 25/07/2011 22:24

My ds hit him today. Mixed emotions about that I must say. Whilst I don't condon hitting maybe it will get this boy off ds's back. Have of course given ds the whole you mustn't hit under any circumstances lecture and answered all his protests about what the other boy was doing with you must go tell the teacher and you must not hit.

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thecaptaincrocfamily · 25/07/2011 21:31

Have to add that I understand how hard it is because dd1 is going through similar but the bully in her class is my best friends dd! How to tackle it? They have grown up together since being babies and this girl now constantly runs off with their mutual friend and excludes her from games, gives small things to the other friend in front of her and doesn't give to her etc. It hurts me because I was bullied from reception until senior school.

thecaptaincrocfamily · 25/07/2011 21:24

Yes that is definately bullying because it seems the boy understands that he is hurting your ds

blewit · 25/07/2011 20:08

i've come across one or two in the class like this. I'm not sure they know what they're doing and what effect it has but they do persistently hurt people. My dd came home this week with a bruise on her face and a cut in her mouth where one (notorious one) had hit her in the face at playtime with a piece of wood. I know his mum and she's lovely. Don't know how it comes about really. The first time he hurt her she needed medical treatment.

skybluepearl · 23/07/2011 20:09

yes of course a 5 year old can be a bully. a 5 year old will know what he/she is doing.

TidyDancer · 23/07/2011 16:43

Five-year-olds can definitely be bullies. Sorry, I really wish that wasn't true.

Goblinchild · 23/07/2011 16:39

Usually a 5 year old who displays bullying behaviour is still at the very egocentric stage. Where other people's needs, feelings, possessions and rights just don't register.
So yes, they can display very bullying behaviour and it needs addressing consistently and quickly by everyone.

BobbyWaring · 23/07/2011 16:23

Bullying is the persistent (and normally deliberate) misuse of power or position to intimidate, humiliate or undermine.

It can take many forms, and can be:

physical (at worst, an assault)

verbal (shouting, swearing, public reprimands)

non-verbal (ostracising, setting impossible objectives, persistent intrusion into classes, unreasonable allocation of duties, or even inappropriate eye-contact). Age has nothing to do with it. There are many resources to help such as; www.bullying.co.uk/
The school must have an antibullying policy which should be available to you.

VeganMummy · 23/07/2011 13:56

I'd definitely agree that 5 yr olds can be bullies. DD has had problems at one of the activities she goes to and we had to complain. A 5 yr old girl was waiting until the teacher's back was turned and then pinching and pushing DD and pulling her hair, to the point where DD was saying she didn't want to go anymore. Thankfully it has stopped now. One of DD's 5 yr old friends is being bullied too. So sad that it starts this young.

teacherwith2kids · 23/07/2011 10:14

Thank you bean - it's been 5 years, through a period of home ed, a move to another part of the country, and a nerw start in a new school he has made sooooo much progress.

However he does still have blips and inconsistencies in the way he behaves and performs in class (which I have to explain most years to his teacher at some point, as they don't always appreciate why my otherwise very bright DS failes to be quite where they expect him to be in some areas. For example in the current year he was regarded as 'not doing as well as expected' in Science - after a conversation with his teacher she disentangled the 'group work' aspects from the 'actual ability in science' aspect and found that he was excelling in the subject, but that anxiety in group work had made it hard for him to demonstrate this) which are absolutely consistent with what the Ed Psych he saw predicted might be the long term effects of what happened.

Glad the op's school is being supportive. We were not quite so lucky - head and SENCo were supportive but class teacher couldn't cope.

thebeansmum · 23/07/2011 09:42

God teachermum, that's bloody awful for your poor DS. And for you to 'go through' with him. I hope his future is brighter - sounds as though it may be getting better.

munstersmum · 23/07/2011 08:54

Yes. I was gobsmacked to find so but sadly definitely yes.
Glad to hear school being good.

rebl · 22/07/2011 22:20

scotchbroth I don't think it was a silly question. Neither of my 2 5yo would do such a thing because I actually don't think either of them think things through that much.

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Eveiebaby · 22/07/2011 21:06

Yes - sadly some 5 year olds are a lot more clued up than you would ever think possible

scotchbroth2 · 22/07/2011 20:42

DD was mercilessly bullied by a few 5yos in p1 and it still affects her. Bit of a silly question tbh.

dikkertjedap · 22/07/2011 20:06

Unfortunately and sadly, yes.

coccyx · 22/07/2011 19:59

OOOOOOOO yes. hope you get it sorted

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