My DW just asked me if I was happy that the Oslo terrorist won't face the death penalty.

[BelfastBloke]

Everything suggests that this neo-Nazi who massacred almost 100 people has been captured bang to rights. There's no question that he did it, unlike in some USA states where they have executed innocent people.

When it's as cut-and-dried as this, with so many witnesses, are you all happy that no European country has the death penalty?

[Ponders]

he's wearing one of those aprons in that photo, BS!

[LittleWhiteWolf]

I am both happy and proud that we, in Europe, do not prove that killing is wrong by killing. That teaches nothing. It is our humanity in the face of depravity that we can be proud of when horrible events like this unfold. I know it may not seem like much when revenge would satisfy more urgently, but it is what is right. I believe that we have to remember that when twisted bastards like this forget.

[ThierryHenryismyBoyfriend]

I personally would prefer that he was executed.

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

Hate led to this barbaric crime and no amount of barbaric revenge will turn back the clock.

[BelfastBloke]

From the Guardian:
'Wilson, who has visited Norway many times to study its liberal sentencing policies, asked: "How will Norway react to the appalling events? Will they only sentence this guy to 21 years [the maximum sentence a criminal can receive in the country]?"

Questions, too, will be asked about the country's liberal gun laws. Shooting and hunting are major pastimes in Norway, and guns are easy to obtain.'

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

My guess is that, similar to UK practice, the gunman will be detained far longer than 21 years as he will be shown to have some serious psychosis and need to be incarcerated for his own and society's benefit. I'm sure the gun laws will be looked at in Norway. However, despite the very high % of private gun ownership, murder/suicide rates are not excessive.

[Mellowfruitfulness]

Ponders Sat 23-Jul-11 19:58:37 - Yes, I've been pondering (see what I did there?) the same question.

Imagine dreaming that you killed all those kids and then waking up to find it was true. I think that the realisation of what he has done will dawn on him one day. And he will have to live with it. A bullet through his brain would probably seem like the soft option to having that on his conscience.

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

Btw... anyone else pick up on the connections between the far right party the gunman is said to have supported and the 'English Defence League'?

[crazynanna]

I saw today that under Norwegian law,he will not serve longer that 21 years in jail.

Still,I oppose the death penalty.

[EdithWeston]

I do not support the death penalty.

The news I was watching earlier opined that he did not shoot himself, because he acted to further his 'cause', and may believe that his subsequent trial and sentencing (and possible eventual release) will provide a fuller airing of that 'cause', in his own words, than any commentary on his death would have done.

It also said his first Court appearance is tomorrow, so perhaps more will come out then.

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

There are threads elsewhere linking to the Norweigian rules on sentencing. 21 years is the standard but it can be reviewed & extended on a continuous basis when the crime meets certain criteria.

[bellabelly]

Mellowfruitfulness - I really really hope that you are right and that one day the full horror of what he has done hits him. I just keep thinking about those poor children and their poor parents and wondering how anyone could have commited such a crime. However cold and calculating he has been - he MUST be insane, mustn't he? I can't see how any person of sound mind could think that what he did was ok, whatever his/her political beliefs.

[Mellowfruitfulness]

Bellabelly, I think so too.

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

"he MUST be insane, mustn't he?"

A brief analysis of his lengthy 'manifesto' this morning on the Today programme was summed up as psycopathic. Apparently, it's a twisted combination of conspiracy theories, misinformation, accusations and grievances... all built up to being a rationale for his grand plan. They think he's spent years obsessively accumulating anything he could find that would reinforce his hatred of anything he considered non-Nordic. It was posted too late for anyone to prevent the crime. Insane, certainly.

[Ponders]

\link{http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/norway/8658418/Norway-shooting-Anders-Breiviks-diary-of-terror.html\extracts from Breivik's diary}

very strange man.

[Ponders]

\link{http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/columnists/borisjohnson/8658872/Anders-Breivik-There-is-nothing-to-study-in-the-mind-of-Norways-mass-killer.html\Boris Johnson column}

'Yesterday the television reporters found an acquaintance of his from Norway, a fellow called Ulav Andersson, who said that he had known Breivik pretty well. He was surprised by all the Knights of Templar stuff, because he had never really been religious, and he wasn?t aware that he had been interested in politics.
?He didn?t seem opinionated at all,? he said. He just became chippy and irritable, said Ulav Andersson, when some girl he had a crush on jilted him in favour of a man of Pakistani origin.
It wasn?t about immigration, or Eurabia, or the hadith, or the Eurocrats? plot against the people. It wasn?t really about ideology or religion. It was all about him, and his feeling of inadequacy in relation to the female sex.'

[suburbophobe]

That's an interesting article, thanks for the link.

[Esta3GG]

It was all about him, and his feeling of inadequacy in relation to the female sex.

But isn't it always? I mean even when they say it isn't, it still is.

OP- I'd like to see him in solitary confinement for 50 years or so.
No human contact. No sunlight. No laughter. Nothing. Just prison walls and his own rancid conscience for day after day, year after year.
There are things worse than death.

[JennyPiccolo]

i'd be happier if he hadn't murdered lots of people.

You can't take it back, no matter what the punishment. At least Norway can retain their dignity and humanity.

[BelfastBloke]

Looks like he won't be in solitary confinement; his potential prison seems rather pleasant.

The linked article wonders whether a 'civilised' prison system like Norway's might be better overall than a brutal system like the USA's.

[MsHighwater]

intentional killing is always wrong