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Philosophy/religion

Help me believe there is a god

59 replies

littlenamechanges · 15/05/2017 18:25

I really want to believe God exists but at the moment I'm really struggling as there is so much pain and suffering in this world! When I asked someone why this would happen if there is a god their reply was there is also a devil but isn't god all powerful? Why would he let innocent children go through so much pain and suffering?

OP posts:
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Cailleach666 · 07/08/2017 07:18

Personally I feel it's not God who causes the bad things - it's the wrong choices that humans make that cause all sorts of consequences for other humans and the environment.

How do humans create earthquakes? Or fatal viruses? Or drought?

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babba2014 · 07/08/2017 15:08

The Qur'an is the proof. The leading scientists in the world agree that certain things weren't known 100 years before, let alone 1400 years before.
Marrying a young girl was nothing new in those times and if it was not the norm then there would have been thousands or let's say hundreds of people opposing it then and now but no one bats an eyelid at that in those days. Not long ago in this country kids were working and bringing in the income. It wasn't abnormal. She wasn't even going to marry him, she was engaged to someone else beforehand.

If the Qur'an made scientific claims that's could be disproved today, people would have a point. But the embryo, the orbit of the planets and many other facts have no doubt today and there is no contradiction in those facts. Had a human written it, perhaps some scientific facts would be correct in future years, but many others would have to be changed with new evidence. This hasn't happened with the ones stated in the Qur'an. It can only be known the a Higher being who has knowledge of the unseen at a time where there was no microscopes or x-ray or being able to carry out a sonogram to see each stage of a baby.

I as a woman do not feel oppressed. I do everything with my own will. The Qur'an taught people that women can inherit, women can vote, women have rights at a time where having a baby girl would be frowned upon (and even now in some countries it is seen as a negative). The Qur'an honoured Mary and women in general.

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babba2014 · 07/08/2017 15:14

Also the Qur'an teaches us to accept Jesus as well. He was sent as a Messenger, and he told his people of a message still to come. Muhammad (peace be upon him) carried a message like Jesus, Moses and the Prophets before him. Jesus fasted, today we see Muslims fast. David fasted. The Bible talks about Jesus praying in a way that Muslims do (head on floor) and so did Abraham and the Prophets before him.
Mary also wore loose clothing. If we look in the streets and we saw a person covering and wearing loose clothing the way she described, we'd probably think hey they're Muslim.
So the Qur'an doesn't reject any of the previous Prophets. We have to believe in all of them and that they called to worship one God and the Qur'an was the last and final message in which scientific facts which could not have been thought of by man in those days were states and till today cannot be disproved. I hope I haven't offended anyone but feel free to look it up and see what Dr Keith Moore (medical students would know about him, his work on the embryo is studied in universities) said about the scientific facts on the embryo.

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CardinalSin · 07/08/2017 15:30

Circular reasoning.

The Qur'an is the proof because the Qur'an says the Qur'an is the proof because...

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CardinalSin · 07/08/2017 15:31

And no, the "leading scientists in the world" do not say that. There are some Muslim "scientists" who claim that, but your statement is simply a lie.

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bluedemilune · 07/08/2017 15:39

On the existence of the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) theres plenty of proof that he existed, nothing supernatural about it. first evidence just look at the arab wars of conquest which began right after his death and established a whole empire based on the religion he came with. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_Muslim_conquests
the occurences were very fast, very dramatic, very cross checkable and objective facts that something extraordinary happened in arabia in the 7th century. something ideological that gave those desert bedouin the confidence and ability to drive out the great empires of their time from the middle east. and had the Quran itself been from other than God, had it been from Muhammad (pbuh) himself or made by his followers, then it would have been as altered and changed as the Bible with its four Gospels and multiple versions. 1 billion muslims all follow and pray from the same Quran, Shia, Sunni, conservative, liberal, etc and that a Quran from 21st century has exactly the same content and verses, chapters, sentences, as a Quran from the 7th century. Muslims set alot of store by that as evidence in itself that the Quran is divinely inspired.

as for your question i kind of think sugarplumfairy had the gist of it in their third paragraph using that example of the matrix. already we in the capitalist west have this idea of human nature, that it progresses by struggle. human ingenuity, human greatness is achieved by need to survive and necessity. Already, before we talk of sickness etc muslims say God created us with the physical frailties of our bodies, that we feel hunger, and cold, and heat, that we catch colds or stomach bugs etc, and those along with the physical realities of the planet we live on mean we have to work to create optimum conditions for our needs.

In Islam we believe that heaven is not simply there automatically but that it must be worked for by good deeds. helping the sick, the hungry, the orphan, the refugee, etc. the Quran says that God established Adam and his descendents as caretakers on earth, to minister and take care, that we are not just its consumers. that life and death is a test for which of us is best in deeds, that when we sin corruption spreads in the land and in the sea.

in the Quran it says it is not God who is taken to account but that it is us humans that are taken to account. are things like malnutrition, drought, famine, low sea fish stocks caused by man's own actions: deforestation, cfc's, fossil fuel burning, chemical dumping, overfishing? what bout the rise in childhood cancers, www.webmd.com/news/breaking-news/cancer-strikes-a-small-town/20161020/childhood-cancer-rates-rising, to blame that on God when all evidence points that its possibly man made environmental factors? then the way we deal with those crises: indifference, ideology, compassion fatigue.

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CardinalSin · 07/08/2017 16:11

There is proof that things were done in his name, but not a shred of contemporary evidence confirming his existence, similarly with Jesus.

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bluedemilune · 07/08/2017 16:15

does the baby know when we hold her down to get her immunisations that we are anything except the inflicter of her pain? what about when we withhold something from our child that we are fully capable of delivering in order to teach them restraint, patience. perseverence. giving the child everything they want leads to them growing up unable to deal with the world as it is. leaves them without emotional resilience which they need not just because the world is difficult but because people have free will all on their own. a spoilt child can easily grow up into a spoilt adult. let them not learn the skills to deal with other peoples free will and they grow up into tyrants that oppress people who don't like them. as parents we know its not one size fits all for our children, each one is an individual that needs careful attention to grow up into a well rounded adult, taking the shy child out to drama to teach them confidence, taking the bossy child to karate to teach them to follow instructions. God is not a parent but i understood that things arent always happy happy joy joy with God just as I cant be always happy joy joy for my children. that as i seek to teach my children lessons from things they may not see the wisdom of yet, God teaches me lessons by things i dont see the wisdom of at the time. sometimes, decades later, i get it and i hope my children get it too.

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NikiBabe · 03/09/2017 20:04

I'm referring to people/ children who are suffering at the hands of another human being. Surely no one needs that in their lives!
Why another human?

Take a look at the bible?

Religion has been an excuse for the most appalling behaviour since time immemorial.

For me the question is whether or not religion makes people behave better or not. It really doesn't.

Wondering why bad things happen if God exists. God himself is a vengeful malevolent being.

Also we do not factor into the will of god (if there is one). God put us to live in the world he created for us, not to live in his world. Whether God exists or not, we are on our own.

Help me believe there is a god
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