Ban smoking at London's bus stops - petition!

[SmokeFreeStops]

As someone with bad lungs, I find it really difficult to breathe when people are smoking at bus stops. I've tried asking people to stop smoking at bus stops - but often they say it's their legal right to smoke there. And you can't just move away from them because often it's raining or you might lose your place in the queue.

Some adults can drive and not use buses - but our kids are forced to stand there and inhale all this smoke if they need to use buses to get to school/friends. It's not good if they have asthma or cystic fibrosis.

So here's our petition calling for a ban in smoking at all London bus shelters - bit.ly/tflsmoke

Please sign if you find smoking at bus stops a problem or are worried about your kids breathing in second-hand smoke.

The English public smoking ban doesn't extend to bus shelters that aren't more than half enclosed i.e. most bus shelters in London. However, TfL can ban smoking and mandate 'No Smoking' signs in all London bus shelters. Many cities do this in their own areas.

This matters because 3 years after the public smoking ban, a study showed there were ~6,800 fewer hospital admissions for childhood asthma. The public smoking ban now has widespread support – a 2012 poll revealed 78% of adults were in favour. There has been a 2.4% national fall in hospital admissions for heart attacks as a result of the ban - equivalent to 1,200 fewer annual admissions.

Hopefully we can get smoking stopped at bus stops in London - making it better for children with lungs that don't respond well to passive smoking.

Thank you for reading this :). bit.ly/tflsmoke

(PS: I apologise if this is inappropriate here - I had a look at the forum rules and it just rules out commercial posts, rather than grassroots campaigns. Please delete if I've done something wrong!)

[sourdrawers]

Pollution from cars, busses, delivery vans etc is terrible problem yes, but a tad more important to the economy and overall running of people's daily lives in cities, towns villages etc, than people who blow fag smoke about for others to inhale is! It's a separate issue anyway and one that can be dealt with and protested about, and indeed is. BTW Mintyy have you reported the Ched Evans petition on here to teacher as well?

[pinkfrocks]

But 2 wrongs don't make a right, do they?

Changing the pollution levels of a major city needs a lot of legislation re. traffic and fuel, investment in infrastructure etc ( more cycle lanes) whereas stopping smoking at bus stops is a small step based on personal behaviour.

And labelling smokers addicts doesn't in any way excuse their smoke being noxious to non-addicts, does it? Otherwise we may as well turn back the clock and allow smoking in all public places.

I'm assuming the antis on this thread have not spent time at a London bus stop and don't know what it feels like.

[PurpleStripedSock]

There are already 'no smoking' stickers on all the London bus shelters. Smokers ignore them thought. I'm a reformed smoker and hate it too especially when I'm pregnant or with my toddler. I also have asthma but that didn't stop me when I was an actual smoker...

I won't sign the petition as it's fairly useless (sorry but as I said, it's already against the smoking laws to smoke under those shelters and people still do it).

Sorry you're suffering.

[expatinscotland]

I love it when sock puppets turn up.

[sourdrawers]

It probably is pointless - signing a petition, but doing nothing is absolutely guaranteeing nothing will change.

[RiverTam]

pink I stand at London bus stops twice a day, 4 days a week, at least. So I know exactly what it feels like. And people smoking at bus stops is simply not an issue, in my experience of standing at bus stops twice a day, 4 days a week, at least.

[MuddhaOfSuburbia]

pinkfrocks fyi

I've lived in London for 30 years, don't drive and so spend fucking hours at bus stops. And no, I don't smoke

and your earlier comment about FORRINERS queue barging? JEEEEEzus

[Quangle]

Hate smoking and have never smoked but I really don't see the need to ban smoking at bus stops. London bus stops are basically all outside anyway - even with a roof they are not exactly enclosed.

Agree with RiverTam that I have never noticed this to be a big problem in all my years of standing at bus stops. Perhaps that's because my bus stop is on the Edgware Road which is one of the two most polluted streets in London and consequently in the UK (I believe). But also because it just really isn't an issue.

[GlitzAndGigglesx]

I thought it was already banned. There's signs saying not to smoke. However near me it's the bus drivers who stand there smoking most. I used to smoke and would never stand under the shelter to do so whether people were there or not

[sourdrawers]

It's true foreigners do queue barge a bit at Bus stops etc, but I think it's more down to them not knowing what the queueing protocols are and worrying the bus is going to pull off and they're going to miss it. More than them just being foreigners.

[RiverTam]

but it's absolutely impossible to queue at lots of stops. My stop serves 7 routes, some of which are the same for part of the route. It's impossible to have 7 different queues, especially as it might not matter which bus you get. For work there's just one bus I can get, but going into town I could get on 3 or 4, depending on where in town I'm headed. I'm not about to queue for the 12 when I could just as well get on the 171 or the 343.

Yes, there are lots if foreigners where I live but that's got absolutely nothing to do with it.

[PurpleStripedSock]

Eye rolling till they nearly fall out of my head a the 'foreigners queue barging' comments. In London EVERYONE is queue barging. I don't stop to check passports while flailing my steel capped elbows to maintain my space.

Trust me, if you think it's just 'foreigners' at it, you have more issues than polution to deal with.

[ArsenicFaceCream]

Speaking as a former smoker, I think it is a rude smoker who wouldn't step away from the shelter as a matter of course when they light up and an extremely rude smoker with marked anti-social tendencies who would refuse to do so when asked.

So I wonder how you'd enforce it?

'Low-level' laws such as the ban on using mobile phones whilst driving are so widely flouted. Why would this be any different?

[MythicalKings]

Is there a petition to ban pompous farts from bus shelters?

[MzTake]

OP what a shame there are some ignorant posters here giving you a hard time. I'm fully behind this and will certainly sign.

As to how you enforce it. There will always be idiots who break the law…drivers driving too fast, litter louts etc etc etc but once something does become law it's amazing how many people do take notice.

[RiverTam]

How exactly am I ignorant given the amount I use London buses and stand at London bus stops? What am I ignorant of? Because it certainly isn't what it's like to stand at a bus top in London.

[pinkfrocks]

My comment about 'foreigners' was not remotely xenophobic; many visitors to the Uk do not understand the very British convention of queueing at bus stops or anywhere. I've travelled across London by bus for almost 40 years and can say quite categorically that tourists do not 'get' the queueing etiquette- and of course neither do some born and bred Brits, compared with 40 years ago when I lived in London.

It's often like a rugby scrum- those who arrive last jump on first!

I have also never seen a smoker show any social awareness of how their smoke is a nuisance to others at the bus stop.

The people who do not 'get' this form of health hazard sound like dinosaurs- all the same old crap which was spouted about 'smokers' rights' before smoking was banned in all public places.

Interestingly, many offices and shops ban smoking at doorways because they know that people have to walk through a fog of smoke fumes to enter the building- that's why they have build 'smoking shelters' - and doorways are open to the air, like bus stops.

[ArsenicFaceCream]

Mz Is any dissent 'ignorance'?

[curiousgeorgie]

What we should do, is have all smokers rounded up and bussed out of the cities. Then they'll be free to roam the countryside, smoking with no one anywhere near them. Any that stray back in can be shot on sight.


Or, you could just turn your back or take a step away

[ArsenicFaceCream]

Then they'll be free to roam the countryside,

[ghostspirit]

purple is right there is no such thing as bus ques in london. well there might be if only couple people at the stop but if theres alot then no. and even more unlikely to que if there are several buses for that stop

[ghostspirit]

im in london i use buses 4 times a day. often people light up without a thought for others... the bus stops are practically open air. but that does not stop the smell of smoke or non smokers/children breathing it in. sometimes i move away. but then someone else will light up as well. and cant go that far from the stop as could miss the bus.

[lovelydoggies]

and your earlier comment about FORRINERS queue barging? JEEEEEzus.......What are you saying , it doesn't happen??? Btw the word is foreigners

[ghostspirit]

no it does not happen... everyone 'most' people do not que up. nothing to do with being forern

[PlentyOfPubeGardens]

pinkfrocks - Are the people here who don't agree with the petition either smokers themselves or the same people who didn't want smoking banned in shops, planes, all public transport, cafes, pubs etc etc?

I'm an ex-smoker. I started smoking when I was 12 and then struggled for over 3 decades to quit before finally succeeding thanks to vaping. Like almost all other smokers I took the 2007 ban very calmly and quietly. It's amazing really, over 20% of the population were banned from doing something they enjoyed in any indoor space anywhere except for their own homes and vehicles yet there was very little grumbling and almost no non-compliance.

Because I can't see much difference between inhaling smoke in a semi-covered bus stop ( which often has seats so if you are queueing you would lose your place if you moved) and inhaling smoke in a pub or a train ( where you could have argued that you could always move to another seat or table.)

Can you not? Can you really not tell the difference between an enclosed space where pollution builds up and an open space which is part of the actual outdoors with all its air and sky and stuff? Good job you use buses. If you sometimes run a car, here's a handy hint: don't run the engine in the garage.

Oh the irony! yes- ideally one not shortened by fag smoke.

Well, quite. It's a well established fact that smoking will shorten the lives of approx. 50% of smokers (roughly 10% of the population of the UK) by an average of 10 years. In contrast, the evidence of harm from indoor second-hand smoke is actually quite thin and the evidence of harm from outdoor second-hand smoke is non-existent (excluding vulnerable people like those with asthma who may also be susceptible to traffic fumes, cosmetics, pollen, household chemicals, bird droppings ...)

Clearly the priority is to do everything we can to HELP smokers to stop smoking. That will save the most lives and will also solve the problems for everyone else. Shaming smokers does not help them quit. NHS stop smoking services make a major point about being non-judgmental because otherwise they would get nobody through the door.