Use of 'a' instead of 'an' before a vowel sound

[WhenDovesFly]

I'm seeing this more and more, not just here on MN but on social media in general.

For example, someone writing a apple, or a elephant. Unless in their head they're sounding the 'a' as you would when reciting the alphabet, then it doesn't even sound right, as well as being grammatically incorrect.

It makes me want to scream when I notice it.

[EmmaEmerald]

@purpledalmation

An hotel is actually correct, but generally not used. I don't think an hospital is correct but I was taught 'h' is a letter you use an with, in some cases, with the vowels.

I'm sure in speech people writing a apple would actual say an apple? Sounds odd otherwise.

I find this confusing too

I am also hearing "a apple".

[WinterMusings]

@TallulahBetty

My (southern, if that makes any difference) Nan says "an otel" and "an ospital".

Sounds like something out of Allo Allo 😂😂

[Choccyp1g]

MyGrandmaLizzie · Today 17:18
I find newsreaders saying 'an historic....' when it should be 'a historic....' very annoying

I don't mind "an 'istoric" or "an 'otel" but recently on Radio 4 (!) I've heard "an Historic" which made me very cross.

[Florissant]

@TeaAndStrumpets

Well if you go to parts of Nottinghamshire or Derbyshire you will still hear people say "a egg"! There is a tiny throat sound involved between "a" and "egg"...maybe a linguist could identify?

A glottal stop?

[Florissant]

Ninja'd by EVHead!

[MMBaranova]

The egges v eyren passage is quite thing in evidence for the pinning down of printed (and therefore standard spoken) English.

pius.slu.edu/special-collections/?p=4717

[MMBaranova]

Or quite a thing.

I find English fascinating. Mostly growing up in a household where it was the second language of both parents, though not the most used by either - though they communicated with each other in it, I think I have always had a quirky and shifting idea of what's an acceptable standard form.

[MyGrandmaLizzie]

@Oddgirlout

My publishers have it in their style guide to drop ‘an’ before vowel sounds. Apparently it’s antiquated!

In that case I must be prehistoric then

[upinaballoon]

@TeaAndStrumpets

Exactly! My friends from these areas are 60s and over, they speak like that but possibly their grand children won't. Which I really think is a shame, as I love hearing it. It's years since I lived there, I used to be greeted with "Ay up me duck".

Re double vowel in peas, this used to be the same in Lincolnshire. I went to school rurally (1960s) and the locals spoke very much as recorded by Tennyson!

And there are a few owd Lincolnsheerians as can still split a vowul sound, mayut.

It's such a shame that universal TV has dampened accents and dialects.

[ScentOfAMemory]

@upinaballoon

And there are a few owd Lincolnsheerians as can still split a vowul sound, mayut.

It's such a shame that universal TV has dampened accents and dialects.

Isn't it?
And it's also a shame that on another thread, a load of Mumsnetters who think they know a lot more about language than they actually do are currently calling people who use regional dialects "common" and are talking about the failure of the education system.
In other countries dialects have protected status and are revered. Quite rightly.

[TeaAndStrumpets]

@ScentOfAMemory

Isn't it?
And it's also a shame that on another thread, a load of Mumsnetters who think they know a lot more about language than they actually do are currently calling people who use regional dialects "common" and are talking about the failure of the education system.
In other countries dialects have protected status and are revered. Quite rightly.

upinaballoon ScentOfAMemory

I didn't see that other thread. They sound like utter wazzocks.

[ScentOfAMemory]

@TeaAndStrumpets

upinaballoon ScentOfAMemory

I didn't see that other thread. They sound like utter wazzocks.

That's a splendid word. 🤣

[neitherofthem]

@RubyRoss

In a different vein, the construction 'an otel' instead of 'a hotel' drives me crazy when I hear it. Mainly by older newsreaders here in Ireland. I assume they were formally taught to do this.

We learned it like that too (England). I believe it is because the word 'hotel' is derived from the French, and they don't pronounce the 'h' at the beginning of it.

We were taught to say "an 'otel".

People who drop their aitches say it like that as well. " It was an 'orrible day" for instance.

[RubyRoss]

@EVHead

Ask people to say “an otel” to say the sentence ”Are you staying in the same hotel?” I bet they don’t say “otel” then!

This is exactly why it drives me crazy when the newsreaders say it. I can almost hear them pause beforehand to make sure they get it 'right' because they don't normally use "otel". I think someone who was used to doing it in everyday speech would sound more natural.

I just searched phrases like "a hour" on social media and it looks to me like many of those using it are not native speakers.

[eggandonion]

My daughter was taught Irish by a native speaker from Kerry. Just by the way!
I do like regional accents, and dialect words.

[Corgiorsheepdog]

You obviously have a good ear @eggandonion.

[JenniferBarkley]

@Corgiorsheepdog

No, not really, but I haven't been paying attention to it. Would you be able to link an example by any chance?

I say RTE like the reporter in this link.

www.rte.ie/news/regional/2020/0527/1142991-tralee-artist-paints-magnificent-murals-during-lockdown/

Oar for R puts me in mind of a D4 accent, like Ross O'Carroll Kelly's cor for car.

Only getting back to this now @Corgiorsheepdog . Now my accent wouldn't be terribly removed from ROCK's but to my ear in that clip he says Oar rather than Arr.

I'm thinking of a girl I vaguely knew from my neck of the woods who got a job doing the weather and continuity announcements and had to go round the house practicing Arr Tee Ee, Arr Tee Ee. A much more English take on the letter than her natural accent.

[Corgiorsheepdog]

Love ROCK😁
Accents are confusing, aren't they? Trying to transcribe them is even worse.
I say the R in RTE much the same as that reporter does, but the word Oar sounds quite different to me. We must say it differently. Anyway, I'm sure RTE do train people to pronounce letters and words in certain ways as you say, which is a pity really and I hope they stop.

[eggandonion]

There is a woman reporter whose name i cant recall, with a fabulous accent..Donegal or Derry? She does a lot of work on social issues.

[eggandonion]

Aoife Hegarty.

[ladyforallseasons]

@RubyRoss

In a different vein, the construction 'an otel' instead of 'a hotel' drives me crazy when I hear it. Mainly by older newsreaders here in Ireland. I assume they were formally taught to do this.

This!
I was taught a hotel (I'm in my late 50s) but the latest seems to be an 'otel
Where has this come from all of a sudden?

We don't say an 'ospital or an 'andkerchief!!!

[DysonBison]

@Oddgirlout

My publishers have it in their style guide to drop ‘an’ before vowel sounds. Apparently it’s antiquated!

Which publisher is doing that? Hasn't there been a copy-editor uprising?

[booboo82]

The English language is going to shit these days lol hardly anyone speaks English anymore sadly

[ScentOfAMemory]

@ladyforallseasons

This!
I was taught a hotel (I'm in my late 50s) but the latest seems to be an 'otel
Where has this come from all of a sudden?

We don't say an 'ospital or an 'andkerchief!!!

For all the linguistic and historical /etymological reasons given upthread.

[Florissant]

@booboo82

The English language is going to shit these days lol hardly anyone speaks English anymore sadly

Oh, the irony...