4yo resistant to learning

[Izzymay]

Hi fellow mums/mums to be

I’m looking for parenting advice on what to do about a 4 year old (almost 5) who is very resistant to learning. I’m trying to teach her how to read, and she’s doing ok, but it’s really hard getting her to focus for 3-5 minutes. She either zones out, or zones in so much that she asks numerous random questions.

she also tries to get my attention by pretending not to know things. I often have to level with her and say something like ‘look mummy is really tired today, can you just stop this and read it, she will read the page without an issue.

The Oxford reading books for her age group are very shorty. It could take us 3-5min to read the book but her lack of concentration means it can take 15-20minutes. If I were to follow her guide and stop when she stops showing interest, we would not get past the title. She has zero interest in learning anything.

Any advice on how to deal with this would be much appreciated.

I have to say I’m astounded at how judgemental and sanctimonious some of you sound. You don’t know me or my child and you’ve assumed a lot. I have a bright girl, and 4 going on 5 is a perfectly normal time to start teaching children how to read. And when I say start I don’t mean reading bleak house. I mean phonics, and simple 2-3 letter words. Some of you are talking to me as if I’m a Victorian mum who is forcing a 1 year old to read love and war. Calm down.

If you are principally against teaching your child at home and taking an interest in their education, that’s you life, enjoy. Other people exist on this planet who don’t do things your way. I know weird. But we exist. So if you don’t have anything useful to say, and your only opinion is quelle horreur a 4 year old learning. Take your sanctimonious drivel and place it .. someplace not on this thread. Thanks.

I had just come on to advise - and provide some fun ideas - and also areas/ways in which to completely take the pressure of - speaking myself, as a parent who does do a fair amount of extension/depth work with DS outside of school who’s just finished Year 1, and as someone who has an Asian background which sometimes means a higher predisposition to some extra learning at home.

BUT - no, after reading this response from the OP, nope. Such an aggressive awful response to people who’ve taken the time to post.

Is she going into Reception or yr1? I think what people are trying to say is that a lot of bright kids about to go into Reception cant read. Not because they are not bright but because they dont like sitting still or the stories/words they can read are boring etc.

At this age, there is often quite a gap between their ability to follow quite complex stories and what they can read. Now, of course, you can try to devise different ways to make it fun and interactive like in a pre-school/school but my impression is that teachers often dont do stories but initially fun games with words.

Alternatively, you could also try to stretch her cognitive and verbal abilities to follow a plot, understand more complex word etc. However, she wont get that by reading but through listening to stories being read to her.

Or you can just forget it and leave it up to the school. Research shows that reading ability age 4 does not correlate with actual intelligence or even grades later on. Yes, a child ability to sit still, practice, self-regulation perhaps does correlate with better grades in the long run but that's seeing causality the wrong way round. A child who can happily sit and practice is in turn probably happier to sit around and practice reading and perhaps be happier to study thereafter etc. but even then that only gets you to GCSEs after that you also need intelligence.

You don't need to teach her to read. That's what school is for. As a parent you just need to read plenty of books to her, and listen to her read occasionally. She's 4. She doesn't need you hot housing. All you're going to do is teach her that reading is a chore and for mummy's benefit, not for her own pleasure.

You sound like hard work OP. Lighten up and leave your daughter be. There's no hurry to learn to read. She's not even started school yet! Just enjoy sharing books with her so you install a love of reading. She can learn phonics and how to read at school.

It doesn’t sound at all like she’s resistant to learning! Children are hard wired to learn, and there is very little a child of that age could be doing that is not learning in some way. But it does sound as though she is resistant to sitting down and doing structured reading practice - so in your situation I would simply drop it. Use the time to sit together and read to her, have cosy reading time together. That’s learning!

Get off your own high horse. You asked for advice and and some posters have suggested (including a teacher) that you step back a bit. And your response is to say people 'aren't taking an interest in their child's education'?
Just read the stories to your child and maybe ask her to start off the occasional page or word. But if you turn this into a battle of wills (or guilt trip - which is what 'please don't annoy mummy' is), that's a fast ticket to making reading a chore. You've tried different methods. Maybe the answer is right in front of you - she doesn't want to read she'd rather talk about stuff, and there's nothing wrong with that.
Your child will pick up reading as you read together, and will learn more formally in school.

Op I know you don't like the responses on here but I used to teach Reception children and trust me they are right. A more relaxed approach is definitely worth a try.

I’m not clear if we’re talking about a summer born kid just finished reception or she’s about to start school soon.

Either way, however shit the school is, it’s standard for kids to have reading at home, and my understanding is that actually it’s good to encourage kids to talk about what they’re reading rather than just churning through the words.

I'd say step away from the very educational reading for the summer and pick fun books you can read together. Pre school my DC (now going into year 2) couldn’t read words but knew lots of her fav books off by heart. Then from reception I’d ask her to help me sound words out or spot tricky words when we were reading her stories. And we’d do it out and about too. We go to the library every week so she can choose new books. I would not inflict Bob the bastarding Bug on anyone unless I absolutely had to…

I have a bright girl, and 4 going on 5 is a perfectly normal time to start teaching children how to read.

I'm sure she is bright and, yes, lots of kids that age do start learning how to read (many children will start reception just after 4), but the approach you are taking is clearly not working for your DD (or for you either, as you're not enjoying your time with her!). If she has not yet started school and you have not been told that she is behind, then why stress yourself and your DD out unnecessarily?

I also have a 4 almost 5 year old who will be starting school this reception. These are the things which we have done/are doing to encourage 'school readiness', if you want to call it that:

• DC attended a fun phonics class weekly last year where they focus on learning the letter sounds in the same way that the children do at school. The class also involved lots of dancing, games and running around, so DC enjoyed it and was sorry when it ended for the summer. We do some of the songs and actions together at home sometimes.
• I read to DC most nights, but not readers (those are boring and they'll get enough of them at school!) just normal children's books which DC chooses. For the easier ones (for example, DC loves Spot books), I'll trace the words underneath with my finger.
• We do playdoh (which DC loves) most days to build up hand and finger strength for writing.
• We have bath crayons in the bath and DC likes to scribble/draw with those.
• DC loves tracing shapes (spirals, that sort of thing) and doing simple mazes so I have a pile of these printed for them to do when they like.

I couldn't tell you how many words DC can recognise though (no idea) and DC certainly couldn't read full sentences. We do know some children the same age or younger who are much further on with reading, but DC has other interests and I personally don't see the point in making this into a battle at home. I know from DC's experiences at nursery that what kids will do for their teachers and amongst their peers is completely different to what they will do at home, so I'm sure DC will pick up what they need to know quickly enough when they start school. In your position, I'd be encouraging the questions, playing lots of fun games to encourage word recognition (the Usborne shopping list one is quite good for this) and doing lots of activities to develop hand strength for writing, but I'd park the reading for now and just read to your DD every night.

Stop trying to guilt trip her into reading with you!

One night I tried this we spent 8 minutes talking about Chip and Biffs shoes

I work in a school and do reading groups with dc aged 5/6/7. This is exactly what you should be doing at this stage. Reading the words isn't the main focus it's getting engaged in the book, discussing what's happening, looking at the pictures etc. the book will even give you a couple of hints on how to do this but it's always good to expand from there. You could even read the actual words yourself at this point pointing with your finger and following them as you say them

The first word my ds learned to read was Tesco - he shouted it out as we drove past a store on holiday.

Don't sweat it op. There are lots of ways to model good reading skills - and 15-20 mins of making it a chore is doing none of you any good.

I agree with pp - learning to read at 4 - at home - can be very passive. Try sounding words out as you go about your day. Like Tesco. Cat. Dog. Colours. S for slide, swings, stop sign. C for coco pops, car, conditioner. B for ball, back garden, bottom, bread, book. Have a theme day on a different letter, spot as many things as you can with the same letter, give a reward. Get some snap cards. Practice with colouring to get little hands ready to write.

Don't make it a chore as she'll disengage and it'll be doubly hard.

It all really depends on if she is going to reception this September or into yr 1.

If yr 1 and you are supporting her reading then getting her to focus for 3-5 mins is age appropriate. Take turns reading a page. Don't labour it for too long. Revisit and make it fun.

If she's heading to reception and you want to get her 'ahead of the game' then you are likely to be pushing her when she's not ready. It's really ok to talk for 8 mins about Biff's shoes. That's how young minds work. As it's not clear which she is then you will have people thinking your are a tiger mum. Don't get rude about it.

I am a teacher.

I didn't teach my kids to read before reception. They are both on scholarships in secondary school now so being a good early ready makes no difference.

Hi all

Thanks for your suggestions those who have made them. I think my main take away here is to adjust my expectations, and that she isn’t resistant to learning she’s resistant to this style of learning. I think going forward I’m going to pull back on these sort of ‘planned’ reading sessions in favour of reading words in everyday life (without being too insistent and making it a focus). And reading her story books more slowly and sounding out the words. I already read to her every night and whenever she asks during the day but not using phonics - more so doing the voices/reading normally - though I so point at the words.

I still have some reservation about advice on talking about the books. Of course we do that already, because developing comprehension and interest is far more important than the practical skill of reading. But I strongly feel it’s a distraction technique, but I think maybe once I stop being pushy this will resolve on its own.

And for everyone who asked she’s turning 5 1st September.

The issue around what you are doing is that you may put her off, make reading into a chore and in the long run hold her back. Reading should turn into a passion, a joy, not a competition. Remember at school she will start with picture books. Often comprehension is more important than being able to read, which you are not allowing her the chance to do. Working on your own patience may be a good place to start

Sorry cross posted.

OP Can I get advice please
MN Gives advice
OP Not that advice, give me different advice

I think most schools like parents to read with their children every day if they can.
They do not expect parents to 'teach' their children to read. Have you had any training/advice from school to ensure that you are using the same methods as they do? Otherwise your DD could be just confused by your approach Vs school approach.

My advice would be to keep it short - 5-10 minutes a day. Keep it fun. But also make sure you read to her from more advanced books. And definitely chat around and about the story - that will help enormously with her comprehension skills.

I’d recommend chilling out bit, reception is still part of the eyfs and the main principles are learning through play. Also have a look at the 5 minute mum books, especially the ready for school one.

My daughter was similar before starting year R. She loved having books read to her and we did that a lot, but she did not want to try reading or writing. Wasn't interested in learning to recognise letters. Didn't want to pick up a pen to even do colouring let alone writing. I didn't push it as she wasn't interested, but was a little concerned.

She started year R in September last year. Almost straight away she wanted to do colouring, shape tracing, drawing. Once they started doing phonics she wanted to do it all the time, pretending to teach me and her sister. And now at the end of the year she can read some words and sound out others, she loves writing and trying to spell things (incorrectly but that's OK!), Is constantly drawing and labelling things, trying to read signs when we are out and about.

Just leave her for now, she will get there. Do what she is interested in - being read to and talking about books - and leave the rest until she shows interest.

I still have some reservation about advice on talking about the books. Of course we do that already, because developing comprehension and interest is far more important than the practical skill of reading. But I strongly feel it’s a distraction technique, but I think maybe once I stop being pushy this will resolve on its own.

This is EXACTLY what you should be looking for at this age. Not just rushing through reading the words and ticking it off as done. If you're tired and want to get on with it it's not the best time to do it. Talking about the shoes is engaging in the story and is brilliant. How does it relate to the story and the words (doesn't matter if it doesn't tbh). Shoes is a tricky word, we can't spell it out. Point to it and explain why you can't spell it out etc. Talk about the 'sh' sound in shoes. What other words begin with sh. The ability to do this is what the teachers will be looking for at this stage, not being able to fire our words written on a page. Getting on and just reading is way way down the line. As a pp said often they will get books with no words at first to help with the ability to do this.

My daughter was similar before starting year R. She loved having books read to her and we did that a lot, but she did not want to try reading or writing. Wasn't interested in learning to recognise letters. Didn't want to pick up a pen to even do colouring let alone writing. I didn't push it as she wasn't interested, but was a little concerned.

She started year R in September last year. Almost straight away she wanted to do colouring, shape tracing, drawing. Once they started doing phonics she wanted to do it all the time, pretending to teach me and her sister. And now at the end of the year she can read some words and sound out others, she loves writing and trying to spell things (incorrectly but that's OK!), Is constantly drawing and labelling things, trying to read signs when we are out and about.

Just leave her for now, she will get there. Do what she is interested in - being read to and talking about books - and leave the rest until she shows interest.

Please don't start reading story books aloud to her with you sounding out the words. This is a terrible idea.

Read them properly so that the story is engaging, so that she can learn about fluency and expression, so that she can talk about what she has listened to.

Also this. I would go back and sound out words after reading fluently with the DC's reading book but never a read to book. Fine to do with simple words on signs etc when out and about but just get on and read the story in a fun and engaging manner or you'll put her off completely from enjoying stories