moving house - fixtures & fittings, what is normal to take/leave/charge for?

[bossykate]

i would really appreciate some advice on this. what is the norm?

for example, the people we are buying our house from want to take the bath from one of the bathrooms and the cooker from the kitchen. i don't think that's really on, especially the bath... otoh, i would expect to take the washing machine and dishwasher.

what about carpets? i would expect to get those included and wouldn't consider charging our buyers for ours.

any views on curtains and other window coverings?

thanks very much in advance

[bossykate]

more replies, thank you!

a few points i'd like to come back to, but no time now.

however, have a look at DTI Guide to the Property Misdescriptions Act 1991 .

estate agents can't say what they like about a property... need to think more about how this could be relevant to my situation.

thanks again for these responses

[toddlerbob]

When we moved to NZ we sold out house to a landlord and did the following:

Left curtain poles (nice ones) but took curtains as match duvets etc.
Left carpets (most pretty horrible anyway)
Took 2 lightshades in the hall as they were new, left the rest, left all the lightbulbs.
Sold the freestanding cooker, washing machine, microwave to the purchaser for a nominal amount.
Left the wardrobes in the bedroom as couldn't be bothered to shift them and landlord wouldn't buy them without having another look and I couldn't face him backing out on the deal if he had another look.

Here in NZ the offer form lists all the chattels. You are expected to leave all your carpets, your cooker and your curtains. Nobody bothers having duvets that match here! You get a pre purchase inspection a couple of days before to check that everything is the same as when you made your offer. We even got a microwave in our latest house, because if was fitted into the kitchen and vented.

I cannot believe they want to take the bath. They should have to leave it, and buy it off you when the sale is completed like they would have to here in NZ. Or they should put the new one in and then have to sell the house "as is".

[Blu]

It is unusual to take a bath, but I took my free-standing cooker with me when i moved - but was clear from the outset that that is what i would do. If you are not passionate about the bath, i do think it would be reasonable for them to replace it - or reduce asking price by a fair amount for you to insatll one of your choice. But in the end, you have to decide how badly you want the house, and if it's badly, the reality is that you are in a buyers market until you have an offer on your house, and in the end cookers and baths are a minor factor if all else about the house is right. Once you get an offer, your power will rise hugely - so save negotiations til then?

Any luck over the w/e with selling yours?

[Blu]

Sorry, meant 'sellers market', until you have an offer.

[fio2]

we are in the process of moving and we are taking practically everything from our house. If they take down light fitting they have be replaced with a standard rose and bulb. Carpets/curtains etc are negotiable and freestanding electrical goods is not included. I have narked my buyers because I would not 'give' them my cooker. It fits perfectly in an alcove in the kitchen but cost me 750 quid and is the first brand new one I have ever had. I said it was negotiable but he would have to pay us for it. No, he didnt want to but has moaned about it al the same

[bossykate]

hello everyone

couldn't resist talking to solicitor about this on monday (after urging him not to do any work on our account as we hadn't had an offer yet! ). he agreed v. unusual "and i've seen everything," he told us. will need to negotiate this - there are some things you really can't legally take and and some things you can obviously take and a number of things in a grey area in the middle - surprise.

have had an offer on our place today which we are minded to accept and if so, as blu says, our negotiating hand will be a lot stronger.

thanks very much for all your comments. i was really having one of those "is this madness, or is it me?" type moments

[Janh]

Hey, bk, look at this from a local estate agent (the house is a VERY small (715 sq ft) cheap modern one, tarted up to within an inch of its life, on the market for £92,000):



Required? REQUIRED???? I don't think so...?

[Paula71]

Back in the days when we were looking for a home(there is no way we could afford a home now!) We looked at a flat that had belonged to a recently deceased lady.

The daughter asked us first of all if we wanted the light fittings - what do they leave a bare wire? She then said she had paid £1200 for the carpets three years ago but would be happy to accept £1000 cash!

Yeah right.

People are so money greedy now about property, it is disheartening

[grumpyzebra]

Janh: surely the buyer could refuse to exchange contracts unless there was a further contract specifying chattels to be sold for £3000? In that way the buyer would be "required" to purchase...?
At least it would evade £30 stamp duty.

[Janh]

gz, these houses actually have a covenant or something whereby they can only be bought by people over 55 or working locally or something AND have to be at 15% below market value. "Asking price reflects this". Think the £3K has something to do with that. (But £92K for 700sq ft including conservatory is still high round here!)

[bossykate]

people are so greedy, aren't they? i can't see how it wouldn't be more faff and expense to take fitted carpets, laminate and made to measure curtains with you anyway.

[bossykate]

having said that, if our buyers are ar$ey about making us pay for carpets and curtains, i may be forced to try and claw some cash back by charging our buyers...

[LIZS]

gz,
I think you have a valid point wrt Stamp Duty. If you strip the fixtures and fittings out of the main asking price you could get within a lower band, but you still have to ask a reasonable price for the property itself. It sounds like some vendors are rather missing the point and seeing this as an excuse to get greedy.

[bossykate]

hello

the next nail biting installment...

no progress negotiating on blank blank bath.

now we have had the fixtures & fittings list from the sellers. higlights include:

garden shed £250
curtain poles (not all the curtain poles in the house, just the two in the living room)£750
taking loo roll holder - just taking it, at least they are not trying to charge us a squillion pounds for it!
3yr old carpets £1,000

is it me or is this utterly taking the pi$$?

we decided not to charge our buyers in the end for any of our (obvious) stuff - decided that wasn't the right thing to do and stuck to our principles.

well, we may be poorer but we are much better and nicer people - so there!

[LIZS]

Yes they are pushing their luck and taking the pi$$. Could you trade off against the bath replacement ?

Not sure how much garden sheds cost these days but I'd be tempted to say no and let them have the hassle of trying to move it - they probably won't bother.

Curtain poles sound outrageous too but if they are long ones and fancy then they do cost a bit to replace - the most expensive one we put in our house was in the least used room (tiny 4th bedroom) because it was the widest so we could only get a posh one to fit and the lintel made it a pain to screw in. All the others were from Woolies which were fine but this one cost at least double any of the others.

Just how much carpet are they leaving for £1000 ? Do you like it or will you be replacing . If you don't really want it long term you could risk asking them to take it but you'd have to be prepared to bear the consequences if they were bloody minded enough to bother.

good luck.

[Freckle]

Definitely taking the pss. You can get a garden shed for £250 these days, so say no thank you and leave them to remove it. Chances are that they won't, but if they do out of sheer spite then you've lost nothing and can replace with one that you like. I personally would say stuff the curtain poles. Do you really* want them? You can buy replacements for far less, unless you are completely smitten by the ones that are there.

Carpets are a bit different. Most people consider them to be part and parcel of the house, but you can charge for them. However, if you refuse to pay, would they rip them all up? Unfortunately, they sound as though they might. So you'd have to take a chance there.

When we bought this house about 20 months ago, our vendors gave us a list of things we could "purchase" from them, including light fittings, etc. They asked us to make an offer. So we did. They turned down our offer. When we moved in, we fully expected to find the place stripped, but we think that, having started to remove items (and then finding that it wasn't a simple case of taking what they wanted, but there were certain items they would have to replace, such as light fittings) they got fed up and left the vast majority of things. They were rather odd. In one room, there was a very fancy central light fitment with matching wall lights. They took the central one, but left the wall lights, possibly because sorting out the bare wires on the wall was more difficult than putting in a ceiling rose.

Of course, it's up to you, but I'd be tempted to say no thanks and then take my chances as to what would be there.

[twiglett]

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[twiglett]

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[ZolaPola]

Hi - we're being left with a few huge wobbly bits of (plastic) furniture, added as 'fixture & fittings' on the form - I guess they don't want to move them as so big plus are too ghastly to take/sell on. However, built-in white goods are not included!

[noddy5]

the fixtures list is ridiculous!Let them take the carpets when they realise the hassle in lifting them they wont bother.You can get a shed for£120 from wickes or bandq

[Nome]

We refused to give our vendors the £750 the wanted for their (hideous) carpet and they took it up and left us with the gripper rod. Great with a crawling ds. It also took much longer than we thought to get to the point where we were ready to put carpet down, ie, no more decoating, boiler in, etc. I think taking the bath is completely outragous though - what are they going ot replace it with?!

[Blu]

I'm with Twiglett and Batters. (and I got up at 5am on moving day so that I could clean every soace as the removal men cleared it - the house was spotless like never before!

BK: I can tell you of a local business that makes custom-fitted bay-window curtain rails for a lot less than that!

Be careful over the shed, tho' am I right in thinking it's a strong selling point for your DH?! (but check out B&Q)

[noddy5]

maybe Im wrong then I just can't believe people take carpets!I assume their next house is carpetless?