Nursery- sending DD 2.5 yrs to the toilet without support :(

[housepicturesqueclub]

Our DD has been potty/toilet training for about two months now. She is in the toddler room at private nursery but has now started a transition to the pre-school room now, sometimes spending a full day in there.

The problem is, last week the room leader in pre-school told us that she sent DD to the toilet on her own, but she came back and had accidents. We were gobsmacked, as at this early age/stage she needs assistance with using the toilet and cleaning herself properly. In the toddler room we didn't have any problems as they always take the children to the toilet/potty and assist them.

The pre-school staff member doesn't seem to understand what our issue is, the other children in the room are 3-5 year olds who can go by their selves (presumably).

We haven't been able to speak to the manager about it yet, as she is rarely in on the days we are there.

Has anyone experienced this problem? and did it get rectified properly? There are other things that bother us about the nursery so are wondering if we should be looking for somewhere else.

[housepicturesqueclub]

Discussed all the issues with the current nursery, in the main they fobbed us off.
Viewed another couple of nurseries last week. The first one always took all children to the toilet to supervise, no matter what. The second was similar, but give some privacy to the older children who are competent at wiping their selves properly. One of these nurseries was our original first choice but didn't have a place free at the time. They are so much better in every aspect, they have parents evenings, 6-8 week reviews, 6 monthly reviews, learning journey is available in the room for parents to see and take home at any time. Loads more activities and learning, more staff. Our little girl loved it too when we visited, so we are moving her there next month.

Thanks for all the help.

[housepicturesqueclub]

unident that's terrible to hear, must of been a massive stress and totally unavoidable. This is the sort of thing we were worried about. No not at a bright horizons .

[pommedeterre]

Depends on the kid. Dd1 still hit and miss with wiping at five but dd2 is nearly three and is great at it.

[Unidentifieditem]

Are you at a bright horizons by any chance??

[Unidentifieditem]

My DD joined the preschool room at 2.5 so that's ok as long as numbers allow.
She also was sent to the toilets on her own a lot and I got very cross. She has always been fab at loo training but needed help wiping and a reminder to wash her hands. They kept failing to do this until i told them her rash was directly down to them neglecting her when she needed help. She also picked up two UTIs from poor wiping technique. We would practise at home but at nursery she'd forget or just rush I guess.

They soon changed their approach and posted a person to all kids toilet trips. This isn't just to ensure hygiene and help but means you don't get kids mucking around with water /soap. They are still tiny kids not adults!

[Maryann1975]

I wouldn't be concerned about a 2.5 year old being in a preschool room, as long as ratios are correct. Is your dd quite bright? There is such a vast difference in children's abilities, a 2.5 year old might be fully capable of being with 3 year olds, but completely bored in the toddler room, where the next oldest child is just turned 2.
The toilet issue needs sorting though. I wouldn't expect a 2.5 year old to manage to toilet themselves completely independently, they should be supporting her and if they can't do that they shouldn't have moved her up yet as she isn't ready.

[housepicturesqueclub]

Thanks so much for the replies. She is spending some of the days in preschool, but they didn't say why, we should of quizzed them, why before 3 years. She is quite above average with talking, and all the other children in toddler room are only just two, so maybe they thought it would be better for her.

The old nursery took her learning journey over to the new nursery(really nice of them) but I remember them saying that they didn't have anything like that. We asked to see her learning journey recently, were told that the keyworker would contact us to arrange an appointment, but nothing happened.

[HSMMaCM]

There should be some kind of learning journey, as they should be following EYFS. I give mine to parents once a term, but if they asked in between, they could have a look at my notes so far. They will definitely be encouraging independent toikey use, but should be available to help when needed.

[Littlefish]

The majority of children in the pre-school where I work are either fully toilet trained, or happy to go by themselves and shout for one of us if they need help wiping. Generally, we support the child to have a go at wiping by themselves, and will only step in if things are getting messy .

We also suggest that parents send their child to nursery in clothes which they can easily pull up or down when using the toilet, but you'd be amazed at the number of times children come in wearing jeans with belts, really stiff buttons, tights etc.

Please could you tell me why your 2.5 year old is in the pre-school room?

Yes, we keep individual learning journeys for each child and these are available for parents to look at every day, without having to ask. Perhaps your nursery calls them something different?

[housepicturesqueclub]

Aware of the ratio difference for pre school, but can't see how any nursery can expect 3+ year olds to be fully toilet trained, friends have said at least 3 1/2 or older for this.

Sounds fair enough about no daily sheets for pre school, what are your experiences with EYFS in pre school, do they record an individual 'learning journey/development plan' for each child that you can ask to look at? We had this at the old nursery but this was between the ages 1-2.

The manager wasn't there as promised last night, so that was annoying.

[Littlefish]

Why is she in the pre-school room if she's only 2.5. This is the main thing you should be querying.

The problem is that the ratios are different (1:8 with 3+ years old, but 1:4 with 2-3 yr olds). This increased ratio will mean that they do not have the staff to take each child to the toilet every time.

Also, as a previous poster said, daily sheets/reports are not the norm once children are 3+

I think you need to meet with the manager as you've suggested and discuss all your concerns with them.

[Butterfly13]

Every nursery is different. But they should be working towards the EYFS. Daily sheets aren't the norm in the pre school room as the ratio is higher. But there should be a general info sheet of what they have done and what they have eaten in the room or on the door or something.

[fattymcfatfat]

I would move her. from what you have said the nursery is inadequate and is causing concern.

[housepicturesqueclub]

Thanks, I'd not thought about the effects of room change on things.

Other concerns are lack of a daily info sheet or feedback , they gave up doing them or are sporadic, or they do them for a bit and not actually passed them to us. Hard to get them to tell us what she's been doing on the learning side. They changed her keyworker and only informed us via a quarterly newsletter, months later we still have haven't met her. Asked to see DD's learning journal/journey, they don't seem to know what one is.

She has been at this nursery for six months due to moving house. She doesn't talk about or tell us about nursery like she used to at the old one. She only really bonded with one staff person there but she left at Christmas. She doesn't protest much about going there but sensing she doesn't enjoy it hugely.

The manager is in tomorrow so going in to talk to her.

[evelynj]

Seems odd to me-my ds is just turned 5 & has only recently started wiping his own bottom, (he hasn't got it totally licked yet either)

Why don't ypu ring the manager on a day you aren't there?

[Butterfly13]

Ofcourse they should be taking them to the toilet but the problem is more than likely the ratios. The toddler room is a 1:4 ratio, the preschool room is 1:8 ratio..

I would talk to the manager / staff of rooms about keeping her in the younger room for another month, so potty training can be fully established first.

She is going through a massive change in toilet training, then also being away from the room she knows, friends, staff, toys, routine. It is probably all abit to much, bless her.

What are your other concerns?