Campaign to highlight how mad WFH with kids is during lockdown

[UntamedShrew]

Hi MNHQ

Please have a read of this thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/coronavirus/3902119-is-it-just-me-or-is-this-working-from-home-with-children-completely-unsustainable?pg=6

I don’t know what the answer is, I just know this is having a terrible impact on parental and child mental health.

Possibly government policy to ensure parents’ get some paid leave to care for children and that jobs are protected If they do so?
Some talk of relaxing lockdown so families can share the load?
And definitely, definitely, a meme about wine o’clock and a suggestion to get the play dough out or try bbc bite size is NOT going to cut it.

Other ideas on the thread, do have a read.

Can you help?

[GoldenOmber]

I want my employer to see that I am still performing - and that it is because my husband shares our domestic responsibilities equally.

So does mine, and neither of us are coping particularly well and neither are our children.

[Rainycloudyday]

There are various things I could say to the woman in my team who is WFH with a three year old whose husband is a useless lump domestically (but a high earner). 'Get your husband to step up' would be incredibly unhelpful.

Would it though? My employer made it clear at the outset of this that they would support employees in finding ways to work flexibly, which might include sharing odd hours between partners. I think that’s very reasonable of them to say. Why should this woman’s employer bear the brunt of her having a shit husband?

[fasttracksign]

Also supporting this.

I think wfh full time with children in the house is sort of acceptable for a short term emergency while we were in lockdown. If the rumours are true and schools don't go back until September and even then, part time, very phased etc, then the government are saying it's acceptable for 6-8 months for children to be uneducated, neglected at the expense of work, or people lose their jobs, houses etc at the expense of education.

[Rainycloudyday]

Perhaps she and her husband need to be told that his actions are negatively affecting her career?

[MutteringDarkly]

I don't want schools open until it's safer (I accept totally "safe" doesn't exist). But I am on my knees as a sole parent trying to WFH and educate primary-aged DD who has additional needs.

At the moment my only option is unpaid parental leave, that I can't afford to take. Being able to drop my hours temporarily, without the full income loss, would make a big difference to the MH of me and my child. I am stretched too thin and I can't keep trying to be three things at once - mum, teacher, employee - feeling I'm doing a horrible job at all three

[Invisimamma]

We're in Scotland, the message from the government has been very clear, school will not be returning before summer holidays. From that we can presume they'll return at the end of August, but they might not.

[Lovemyphone]

Please, please let's not turn this important issue into a fight fgs.

Some people will be managing better than others. My sil for example, is enjoying her wfh, because her dh has been furloughed.

My dh IS NOT shirking his responsibilities. But he's working full time outside the home. He doesn't get enough holiday to cover this period, AND if he takes unpaid leave, then we won't be paying bills.

Solutions could be;

Some special paid leave for working parents to deal with childcare

Getting the schools open

Being eligible for a school place if you can't viably wfh with your child around.

Guaranteed not unfairly made redundant if you have to take unpaid leave during this period.

So for example. I can wfh ok with my older child, but I cannot do it with my 4 year old. I simply cannot supervise him properly.

[ProfessorRadcliffeEmerson]

Because the alternative is to lose a good employee. I'm a realist, if I push her to do more she'll hand in her notice (hence the relevance of him being a high earner). I would much prefer her not to have a shit husband, but he's always been shit and up till now she had good childcare and her own mother's support. She's had the rug pulled from under her. Do you seriously think he'll pull his finger out now when his job may be at risk too?

[ProfessorRadcliffeEmerson]

Sorry, that was to RainyCloudyDay

[SomeoneElseEntirelyNow]

I cannot understand why so many people cannot understand that there is no magic solution - it's a global crisis, there is going to be widespread suffering beyond the illness itself, and there is no magic money tree, the government can't save everyone.

[Lovemyphone]

I think wfh full time with children in the house is sort of acceptable for a short term emergency while we were in lockdown. If the rumours are true and schools don't go back until September and even then, part time, very phased etc, then the government are saying it's acceptable for 6-8 months for children to be uneducated, neglected at the expense of work, or people lose their jobs, houses etc at the expense of education.

This ^

6-8 weeks is a short term emergency.

5 months or more is a long term thing and something needs to be done.

[ProfessorRadcliffeEmerson]

But don't you think children ought to be a priority? At the moment their care doesn't even seem to be on the radar.

[zerocraic]

Thank you so much to OP and hopsalong in particular for powerful posts. This is a problem for so many of us we can't even properly articulate how gruelling it all is so i commend those who can still post so powerfully to raise awareness.

I understand that many people are coping very well but i am not, and neither are many parents who are navigating specific work cultures with preschoolers or SEN children in particular (but not limited to).

I feel quite desperate. I have 3 fabulous kids who are being brilliant. My h is doing most of the domestic work. He is coping better than i am. Perhaps i have seen enough to date to understand that nobody is in a hurry to fix this problem because nobody is even aware of it.

So i don't know what the solution is but it must start with some acknowledgement.

We are definitely on a path to awful news headlines.

[AnnSmiley]

Its not as easy as saying partners need to step up and do their share. A lot of people are talking about one parent working from home while the other is a keyworker. I can't split my working day around my police officer husband's shifts. I won't be the only person in this situation by a country mile.

The fact is, it's DANGEROUS. Stressed, sleep deprived parents having to leave very young children to their own devices too much.

[CinnabarRed]

Perhaps she and her husband need to be told that his actions are negatively affecting her career?

Why on earth do you think he would give a toss? Men who don’t pull their weight generally know full well what they’re doing. But they either don’t care or don’t think her career is as important as his. Pointing out the error of his ways isn’t going to miraculously change his attitude.

[Sandybval]

What would the desired outcome be? Personally I would be over the moon if childcare reopened, but understand that it can't happen until it's safe for staff as well, and rightly so. Is it that employers are rejecting furlough requests? Childcare is already listed as a reason for it being granted, would it be acceptable to some of it was stipulated that they had to honour that? I agree that it's awful trying to do both, but just wondering if people seem to have a universal preference for what should happen.

[ProfessorRadcliffeEmerson]

Thanks, CinnabarRed. That's exactly it.

Perhaps another way of framing this is that the failure to consider childcare and the needs of working parents is indirect discrimination because it's impact on women is so much greater than on men (which is not to say that men aren't affected). I wish women were not still primarily responsible for childcare and school stuff, but the fact is they are, and kicking individual women for their (societally constrained) choices in a situation none of us could have foreseen won't help.

[AnnSmiley]

I don't think it needs a magic money tree. It's just part of the discussion about gradually opening up the economy and easing out of lockdown.

We need to look at how to keep public transport as safe as possible. We need to look at how to make work places as safe as possible. We need to look at getting food grown and distributed. We need to consider how best to support self employed people. And we need to look at childcare provision for people wth in difficult circumstances.

[SillyYak]

I’ve been thinking about this ever since I had a Zoom chat with my single mother friend who is homeschooling two DDs age 6 and 8 while full time wfh in a very male environment (software dev). Even early on in the lockdown she was under enormous strain. To what extent would discrimination law help here? If she is made redundant at the end of this because of poor performance, would she have a discrimination case against her employer? That sort of thing usually makes the HR department of most major companies sit up and listen, doesn’t it?

Either way, this is such a crucial issue I hope Mumsnet does consider a campaign of some kind.

[SunshineOutdoors]

I work for a grant making charity and we’re working harder than ever, giving £1.5m to help people who are supporting the vulnerable through this crisis. Important work but not a ‘key worker’. I also have two primary school children and a husband who is md of a company and working ft from home. Leave, paid or unpaid, is not an option as my work needs to be done. I have in-laws round the corner (under 70, no underlying health problems) who would love to help us out with childcare. I don’t see how we can maintain what we’re doing without it seriously affecting our children. We need them in school or with their grandparents at least some of the week, it would make such a difference to all of us.

[Cathster]

@Whitestick I never said your opinion wasn't welcome, and I'm sorry if I was snarky but some more detail would have been helpful in the outset rather than coming across as a little bit smug. I'm genuinely glad that you are managing to cope and I do think it is important for employers to acknowledge the extra effort that parents are putting in to try and keep their productivity levels up.


To me this is about a parent, or two parents, trying to work at home whilst look after children with no acknowledgment on what the plan will be in the long term if schools and childcare settings don't open for months and we aren't allowed to utilise family for support. This has been the case for 7 weeks now and whilst it was okay in the short term, this cannot continue the same way. For what it's worth my DH is absolutely taking on a joint role in this, as he always has done, but we have demanding jobs and very young children and are still stretched to our absolute limit.

Perhaps tomorrow a clear plan will be laid out and we will have some reassurances but considering the radio silence about this issue so far, I'm not that hopeful.

[IgnoranceIsStrength]

Agree so much with so many posters. Full time work from home for me expected to be able to instantly reply to emails, make phone calls and deliver online training from 8-5. Dh working out the house full time. And 2 young DC 6 and 3. Home schooling cant even be attempted nevermind any quality time together

[CinnabarRed]

Is it that employers are rejecting furlough requests? Childcare is already listed as a reason for it being granted, would it be acceptable to some of it was stipulated that they had to honour that?

All kinds of issues with furlough.

People can’t be furloughed if their employer needs them to work.

People can’t be furloughed part time.

Furlough will finish at the end of June, and won’t be universally renewed because we can’t afford it. It might be renewed for some industries like hospitality where restaurants/cafes/bars are shut and there’s literally no work to be done. But for many it will end. There will be quite a few people currently furloughed who will have to make choice to either resign (and keep looking after their kids) or start working again (with all the issues that brings).

[Ouchy]

Children’s social, educational and probably physical needs are being neglected in this crisis and are not being given the level of consideration they deserve. Is this because children can’t vote/lobby? 😕

children without siblings are a major worry in terms of their mental health.

This should be way further up on the government’s agenda, this is children’s lives we’re talking about. 7 weeks fair enough, but there comes a point where the needs of the younger groups in society also need to be brought into the debate. Just because children are very low risk for corona virus and aren’t really at risk of dying from covid, doesn’t mean they don’t matter.

[TimeWastingButFun]

I don't know how people do it. I don't WFH but I know that whenever I try to do anything, invariably it's interrupted because one the kids needs something. Something I expect, so it doesn't bother me and I pick up later, but if that something is a very important conference call or something, then it must be really stressful. It really is like trying to do two jobs simultaneously. Especially with little ones - trying to work from home with a toddler must be impossible.