Delivery driver, or anyone, entering your home

[KangarooKenny]

Following on from another thread I’d like to ask about two potential situations.

1. What would be the legal point of view from someone entering your home, either following ringing your doorbell/knocking, or not.
2. what is a dog owners rights if that person is bitten inside your own home and that person has let themselves in, either just walking in or after knocking/ringing the bell.

[GoodChat]

How are they entering? Through an open door or wedging open a window? What's their intention and are they in and out, like a delivery driver, or mooching around.

Generally a dog that bites would still be deemed as an out of control dog but that depends on the answer to the above.

[KangarooKenny]

Through a closed but not locked front door.

[Nolongera]

If someone enter your home uninvited through an unlocked door without criminal intent I would have thought it's trespass which Is usually a civil law matter.

Having said that, if your dog bit them I would have thought you have done nothing wrong, you dog was in control behind a shut door. Different if you have invited them in.

I can't imagine any scenario where a delivery driver would enter a house uninvited. They wouldn't even try the handle?

[KangarooKenny]

@Nolongera

If someone enter your home uninvited through an unlocked door without criminal intent I would have thought it's trespass which Is usually a civil law matter.

Having said that, if your dog bit them I would have thought you have done nothing wrong, you dog was in control behind a shut door. Different if you have invited them in.

I can't imagine any scenario where a delivery driver would enter a house uninvited. They wouldn't even try the handle?

Pop over to the chat section and you’ll see that it’s quite common. I had a delivery driver open my front door immediately after knocking, giving me no time to get there. Luckily I caught the dog as he was heading his way.

[Nolongera]

@KangarooKenny

Pop over to the chat section and you’ll see that it’s quite common. I had a delivery driver open my front door immediately after knocking, giving me no time to get there. Luckily I caught the dog as he was heading his way.

Most people have their front door locked.

[KangarooKenny]

@Nolongera

Most people have their front door locked.

Well obviously not.

[coffeecupsandwaxmelts]

The law states that dogs have to be under control on private property as well as out in public - that includes in your garden and in your house.

I'm not sure whether that covers unwanted guests entering your property though.

However my personal view is that it's your responsibility as the owner to keep your dog safe - and that means keeping external doors locked - to prevent escape if nothing else.

[Allthegoodnamesarechosen]

I’m amazed you don’t lock your external doors, even if you are in ( in some cases, especially then). Have you checked with your Home Insurance Policy? I wouldn’t be surprised if you were not covered for theft , even if you were in the house.
Your dog biting the delivery chap ?.. though I know that the Post Office used to have the right not to deliver to a house with a biting dog, and that included them snapping at the letter box from inside.

[Truckinghell]

I can't imagine any scenario where a delivery driver would enter a house uninvited. They wouldn't even try the handle?

I live in a small town where they open the door and put the parcel inside. It really caught me off when I moved here. Now I like not having to go to answer the door!

[RomansTheyGoTheHouse]

I'm one of the posters over on that thread.

I hardly lock the front door during the day and it opens, with a handle from the outside. I've also had a postie open the front door to put a parcel inside. I think it's probably more common in villages etc. I certainly never had it happen when I lived in the city.

[Nolongera]

@KangarooKenny

Well obviously not.

How is it obvious? Some people don't clearly, but I don't seem to know any of them.

Partly because we have dogs we keep the front door locked most of the time so the grandkids don't let the dogs out. I can see the door from where I am sitting, over 60 now yet not once have I had a delivery driver try my door or let themselves in uninvited.

It's not common.

[GoodChat]

Having an unlocked door doesn't give someone permission to enter private property.

[smileladiesplease]

I can't get my head around anyone not having their front door locked. You would invalidate your insurance as well as a very dangerous thing to do snd to teach kids to do.

[FawnDrench]

Where's all this coming from about invalidating your insurance?
What clause is actually used?
I've never seen anything on all my many and varied home insurances over the decades about compulsorily locking your door if you are at home.

Would be interested to see some evidence.

[Truckinghell]

@smileladiesplease

I can't get my head around anyone not having their front door locked. You would invalidate your insurance as well as a very dangerous thing to do snd to teach kids to do.

Well, it's not very dangerous everywhere, is it? And all my child learns is that we live in a safe place, which is nice.

[prh47bridge]

@smileladiesplease

I can't get my head around anyone not having their front door locked. You would invalidate your insurance as well as a very dangerous thing to do snd to teach kids to do.

It might mean your insurance would refuse to pay up if someone walked through the unlocked door, stole stuff and left without you noticing, but it wouldn't invalidate your insurance completely.

[RedHelenB]

@FawnDrench

Where's all this coming from about invalidating your insurance?
What clause is actually used?
I've never seen anything on all my many and varied home insurances over the decades about compulsorily locking your door if you are at home.

Would be interested to see some evidence.

There isn't. It only stayes you have to lock it if leaving it unoccupied

[GoodChat]

@smileladiesplease

I can't get my head around anyone not having their front door locked. You would invalidate your insurance as well as a very dangerous thing to do snd to teach kids to do.

are you getting confused with car insurance?

[daisychain01]

Re: the legal position re: someone entering your home, I think the starting point is that there is something in law around "implied right of access" whereby someone entering the grounds of a property (normally opening a gate and walking down the path to the door) to make a delivery, eg parcel, letters, food delivery from Tesco etc, has the implied right to do that legitimate business. You don't need to enter into a specific contract with posties and Amazon/Yodel delivery drivers, that's why it's implied.

That right of access is implied until such time as the property owner wishes to withdraw the right of access, eg if someone repeatedly accesses the grounds even if for a benign reason, such as a JW wanting to talk to the property owner about their religion, then the owner can say to the JW that they withdraw their implied right of access (ie stop coming onto my property.)

Someone actually stepping inside the property takes the implied right of access to a whole new level, possibly trespass, although it could be argued that if the implied right of access hasn't been withdrawn, they were there on legitimate business and weren't a burglar - our village postie has been known to reach in and put our post onto the utility room counter top, if we leave our side door open in summer . We live in a rural community and we have a gate which we keep shut as it has an electronic alarm on so the minute someone opens it, we know they've entered the driveway and are walking up the path to deliver something.

There's city living and there's rural living, they are very different in terms of the trust people have towards each other. Posties have always had to take their chances with family pets, hence "Beware of the Dog" signs probably to cover the owner!

[amylou8]

If you have a dog that would bite someone entering your home, then the onus is on you to take reasonable steps to prevent that from happening. That would be keeping your door locked and putting up a beware of the dog sign. Although there is no implied right of access, it's perfectly feasible that someone could enter in error, without any criminal motive (as in the case of the delivery driver), or legally, such as police or paramedics.

[MissingNightshades]

I don't know anyone that regularly locks themselves in their own home before nighttime, I'm in and out a thousand times a day, the only times in life I've locked during the day is when I've had an animal that's worked out how to let everyone else out and I'm having a bath etc.
It doesn't invalidate your home insurance if you don't lock yourself in and it most certainly doesn't mean it's your fault is someone trespasses.
As far as your dog biting someone who's uninvited the law does make an exemption on dogs biting people who have "No legal right to be in your home" Some people obviously have porches that are regularly used for parcels, the driver has legal protection in your garden as well but actually opening your door and letting themselves in? I hope the law would come down on your side but the law is regularly an ass.

[hookiewookie29]

@Nolongera

If someone enter your home uninvited through an unlocked door without criminal intent I would have thought it's trespass which Is usually a civil law matter.

Having said that, if your dog bit them I would have thought you have done nothing wrong, you dog was in control behind a shut door. Different if you have invited them in.

I can't imagine any scenario where a delivery driver would enter a house uninvited. They wouldn't even try the handle?

It's happened twice to us. Myself and hubby have both come across delivery drivers in our house- once in the hallway, and another time the driver came into the hallway, opened the lounge door and pushed the parcel in!
We always lock the door but dd rarely does. Both drivers had knocked the door but not even given us chance to get there to open it. We reported both of them to their employers.

[fruitbrewhaha]

This is ridiculous! I’m astonished that delivery drivers let themselves in. My current dog, a puppy, may well run off down the road if someone were to open the door. My
previous dog would have attacked anyone who entered as she was territorial. And it would be the drivers fault not hers.

[LoudHazelSnake]

Hey! I’m looking for advice on this thread. Today we had a situation, only know about it do to the ring door bell (sign on door to state ring door bell is recording). The yodel delivery man came to the property with a parcel, rang door bell and no one was home to answer. Now the delivery man can hear the dog barking & can see the dog from the living room window so he is fully aware he is there. The doorbell footage shows the delivery man leaving with the parcel and then coming back 2/3 minutes later with a card to state the parcel has been left in a safe place. We have an outdoor post box RIGHT NEXT to the front door, as our dog loves to rip mail, however the delivery driver has put the card through the letter box on the door and there has been some commotion. The audio hears my dog growling and the driver shouts and pulls his hand away. We cannot tell if the dog has scratched him through the letter box, bit him or if the man has just simply gotten a fright when he’s realised the dog is at the letterbox (letter box is at the very bottom of the door, at our dogs level). I’m worrying about this situation and don’t know what to do. I can’t understand why he didn’t put the card in the outdoor post box and really don’t know what’s happened. Should I contact yodel to make them aware of the situation??

[Longma]

Old thread - sorry