Yet another rapist and yet another 'women should stay inside' response.

[Mytwopenceworth]

so so

Just caught a news report about a rapist on the prowl, and the official advice is for women to not go out alone after, think it was 9pm (was listening from kitchen, so didn't catch it all).

That makes me so bloody angry. Yet another sick f*ckwit and women are supposed to cower in their homes, or go out escorted!! Bloody male police who think this is the best course of action! Put a bloody curfew on men, not women. Why is it every time they say women should be restricted in this way? Get police on the street and arrest any man out after 8pm without aproval and escort him home. THAT'S what they should stuffing well do.

And I know, the rapist will just hide and go out anyway and women have to be responsible for their own safety and a million more justifications and I suppose they're true and maybe sensible, but it still makes me feel angry that men commit these crimes but its women who have to alter their lives. Yet more power to the rapists. x a million!!!! - I wish there was a steam coming out of ears emoticon!

[Gobbledigook]

Seems reasonable advice to me - whether there was a known rapist about or not.

[Caligula]

Some of them are going to work QoQ. Particularly the very poor, who may work anti-social hours as cleaners.

[QueenOfQuotes]

going to work walking out of the pub/clubbing part of Northampton between 12.30-3am??

[Caligula]

Er ... clubs and pubs get cleaned too QoQ. As do offices. And I wasn't aware the rapists limited themselves to specific hours and specific streets. How very helpful of them.

[Gobbledigook]

I want to know what, those who have issue with the advice, you would like to see as an alternative?

[monkeytrousers]

I agree Sophable, to most of your points but feminism isn?t a panacea for the world?s injustices. We can?t wipe out misogyny, we can only legislate to protect against it..(does that make sense?) And there is an inconsitancy. Don?t know what to think about it though.

[hercules]

But women are only being advised, imposing a curfew is telling them.

[QueenOfQuotes]

Caligula I can say with 99,99% certainty that there are virtualy no jobs in central northampton (apart from actual bar/club staff) where the hours worked would mean walking home at that time of night.

Clubs and Bar cleaning jobs tend to be first thing in the morning.

DH has been looking for part time evening/night work and found nothing except for bar/club staff and warehouse operatives (on the outskirts of Northampton) for those hours.

And if a 15yr old girl was working then someone was breaking the law!

[QueenOfQuotes]

and Caligula - these 10 rapes/attempted rapes have all taken place between 12pm and 3am - in Central Northampton.

[Caligula]

QoQ, I wasn't referring to central Northampton in particular, just responding to your point that women who can afford to go drinking can afford taxis. The point being that women who are out at night on their own, aren't always out because they're carousing. Not just cleaners, nurses, policewomen, etc.

The point MTPW was making, is that the way the police frame the advice, implies that women need to modify their behaviour to avoid becoming the victims of crime, in a way that no other section of society is ever quite urged to modify their behaviour. If there is a spate of attacks on Asian youths, for example, the police do not advise Asian males not to go into those areas where the attacks took place (although the target group might choose for themselves not to go there). They may urge caution, but they don't tell other sections of society to restrict their behaviour to the extent that they tell women to. I really don't see why that is difficult to understand.

[QueenOfQuotes]

they're not being 'urged' to modify their behaviour, they've just be advised that unless nessecary they shouldn't go out at night alone - at least until the group are caught - which by the sounds of local reports shouldn't (hopefully) be too long, lots of postive leads which they're working on.

[Caligula]

Yes and when was the last time the police advised Asian young men not to walk in a certain area where Asian's had been attacked recently, in case they were targeted for attack? And if they did issue such advice, what do you think the public response would be?

[FairyMum]

I agree with Caligula. It's a slight risk that if someone is now raped after 9 pm, then obviously the silly woman didn't take the police advice. For women not to be able to walk alone after 9 pm in summertime is idiotic. You almost expect the next advice to be: " Don't walk outside after 9 pm in a mini skirt" as if women provoked the attack themselves simply by walking outside.

[merryberry]

I get the same feeling with the pollution warnings in London: e.g due to heavy pollution (usually an air inversion trapping traffic partculates) where they advise the elderly and people with asthma to stay inside with closed windows and that people shouldn't exercise outside while it lasts. Erm, why not cancle driving for a while too?

{OK so now I sit and wait for my meteorolgy ignorance to be enlightened - but I hope you get my drift}

[Caligula]

Gosh, I didn't know they had pollution warnings in London. When did that start?? (I remember years ago having them in Berlin and it seeming like something straight out of the fifties.)

[Gobbledigook]

Oh FGS this thread is a joke.

Fine - go out in the dark, wander about on your own and wear what you like if you don't want to modify your behaviour.

Leave all your valuables on view in your car when you park it in public (leave the door open for good measure) and leave your front door wide open inviting anyone in who fancies your TV or video.

It's the world we live in and unfortunately all of us modify our behaviour in one way or another every day to avoid being victims of crime. On this occasion, it so happens that women are the target of crime so women should modify their behaviour. If you don't want to, then don't. Advice is there to take or leave.

Suggesting we impose a curfew on men is absolutely ridiculous and totally unworkable. Women are not being told to stay in FGS - women are able to go out but do what you can to protect yourself, be aware - that's all the message is.

Perhaps you'd rather the police did bog all and just let you go about your business ignorant of the recent crimes.

[Mytwopenceworth]

"Police are advising black people to not go out alone and to avoid X area of the town as there is a racist out there who is beating black people up on the street. Furthermore, police advise that black people wear long sleeves, gloves and hoods or hats and walk with their head down, ensuring no skin is visible, for their own safety. If you are black and you must go out alone, ensure that someone knows where you are and you get a taxi home."

"Police are advising muslims to avoid going to mosques in X town, as a rasist has threatened muslims going to prayer with baseball bats. Police have many leads which they are following up, but until this person is caught, we advise that muslims make alternative prayer arrangements."

And when you say the above is outragious, you are told "sadly, we don't have the resources to protect every black person / every muslim in this area, and since we don't know where the next attack might be, and it will only be one person, it is not cost effective and until we follow all our leads and catch the criminal, we suggest you follow our advice."

It is part of a whole bigger issue! As I said in my initial post, men commit these crimes and its women who have to alter their lives. We all understand that we have to take reasonable precautions in our lives - personal safety, secure our homes, car alarms etc etc, to lessen the possibility of falling victim to crime - but no other crime involving an assault on a person is responded to in a similar way.

And on the rare occasions a rapist is taken to court, the victim is routinely accused of asking for it and forced to detail everyone they ever slept with!

How many times do we hear of court cases where a rapist got less jail time that someone who stole a frozen chicken from Safeway?! Where a woman is dragged thru the mud? Where judges claim the victim didnt suffer too much so the rapist gets to walk free?

I know we have to deal with the world the way it is, but the only way it's going to change is by people not accepting it! While any of us say - its sensible advice, we have to be careful etc etc, nothing will change. We have to say I BLOODY RESENT THIS!!! We have to say we are mad and we are not going to take it any more! We have to MAKE it change. Change the focus, change the attitude.

Melissasmummy - cutting the hands off theives? Excellent - new law - you rape - we chop off your cheesymicropenis.

[hercules]

But you are not going to change the fact that there are rapists and I still cannot see why it is so wrong to advise women to take precautions. No one is forcing you to, they are simply suggesting you take precautions in a certain area at a certain time of night.

Dh is asian and doesnt go to certain areas at night. Should he just to prove a point and risk himself?

It's not men against women. My sister was one of the police advising women around the time of the M25 rapist.

[motherinferior]

Ooooh, MTPW, you've summed it up for me. The only thing I can add/reinforce is that this is about context; rape is a crime of sex/power. Women have always been told that the 'solution' is to keep off the streets.

I think the warning should, yes, have emphasised that the streets are dangerous at the moment but put that in the context of 'and we are doing this, this, and this.'

[hercules]

The message of reassurance seems just like sensible advise.

At my old school the police come in every year and give a safety talk to the kids and a lot focuses on the local area. Should they no longer do this as it's singly out kids? Should the kids ignore the police advise as this advice refers to kids and the police are not going around telling everyone else the same thing.

One piece of advice given is not to walk home down a certain area of land on their own before and after school. Should the kids ignore this? Is it wrong of the police to single out the kids?

[motherinferior]

Rape is men against women (and yes I know there are male rapes too).

[hercules]

But they obviously are doing far more than advising women to be careful. There is no suggestion that this is all they are doing.

[QueenOfQuotes]

"I think the warning should, yes, have emphasised that the streets are dangerous at the moment but put that in the context of 'and we are doing this, this, and this.'"

It did come in the context of what they are doing.......

[hercules]

Yes, but it was said earlier that this advise was male police against women.