One man and the 'immigrants go home' advertisement.

[NicholasTeakozy]

Pukkah Punjabi asks the Home Office to pay for his taxi from Harrow to Willesden. What an enterprising chap! :o

[LittleSporksBigSpork]

No one is trying to ban the phrase 'go home', just pointing out it's loaded when used in conjunction with immigration, documented or undocumented, because of it's usage by violent, oppressive groups.

The current work on getting undocumented migrants to either get proper documentation (usually by helping them claim asylum properly) or leave is already quite successful. This is just riling people up either to get votes or to frighten people.

Thankfully, most of us will never have to consider the law versus our safety and wellbeing.

[NicholasTeakozy]

Oh blimey, I've been rumbled! No, I posted the article to point out a high class piece of real life trolling by Pukkah Punjabi. It gave me a good laugh. It seems immigrant bashers don't see the funny.

The point of my post of 14.38 is that the very people who decided to house immigrants on various islands are either immigrants or children of immigrants. again.

[TheFallenNinja]

But why do you believe my position to be on racial grounds? I have only referred to immigration status.

My position is based on the notion that I obey the laws of the land. Why should others not?

[MurderOfGoths]

"How much does this campaign cost? How much does illegal immigration as a whole cost Britain?"

Tell you what, I've got a great plan, if the govt buys loads of mousetraps and loads them with cheese maybe we could catch some immigrants? What do you mean it is unlikely to work? Worth a try isn't it? Waste of money? DOn;t you know that illegal immigrants cost us more!?

[Episode]

The OP simply linked to an article which highlighted the ineffectiveness of the CAMPAIGN and the offence it has caused.

Ethnic minorities have come on here and said they find it offensive, do you think they are playing the race card (whatever that is) and faking offence

It is not for you to decide what other people can and cant find offensive, its not how it works.

And in the same breath you have said you will defend the rights of anybody with a stay status. How about listening to what those people as well as those from larger ethnic communities have to say on the issue, if you will, as you say, defend the rights of these people to the end!!!

The campaign is offensive, its a waste of money and has been used as part of a political campaign rather than to make a dent in the debatable issue of illegal immigration.

Why are you so happy for funds to be wasted and offence to be caused if you are the defender of people and society you speak of?

[MadBannersAndCopPorn]

Just my two-penneth worth.

I think using the phrase 'go home' when talking about immigration is thoughtless and unnecessary- It has been used to taunt people with different skin colours for decades, so when used in this context, it is racially loaded.
The government, of all people, should be able to come up with more PC terminology for their campaigns. It probably offends uk citizens who have had this used against them more than the actual 'target' audience.

The poster reminds me of the tv adverts that used to be at the beginning of films "Video piracy is a crime, do not accept it"

I think most people are in agreement that illegal immigrants are criminals and disobeying the law. It's funny actually as I've never seen a billboard aimed at drug dealers, paedophiles or tax evaders telling them to turn themselves in- and giving a number to call if they felt like being caught and arrested any time soon.

The advert just seems like a way for the government to make it look like they're doing something about the immigration 'problem' in a way which allows them to do absolutely nothing whilst appeasing people who have an oversized bee in their bonnet about it (EDL etc)

Sorry for spelling mistakes

[MadBannersAndCopPorn]

x posted with loads of you, typing snail

[TheFallenNinja]

No,the OP linked to an article that was one persons comic take on the campaign in question.

Even the OP's title is misleading.

Your continued direction of making this about race whereas I am talking about immigration status puzzles me.

You can reiterate all you wish, however, my view is that if you are here illegally the law should remove you. Turning a blind eye simply undermines individuals who have complied with our laws.

[Episode]

Your viewpoint is obvious!

How it relates to the article, the success of the campaign and the funds wasted in relation to tackling the actual issue is where the race argument crops up....

The campaign is offensive but you say it does not matter, to you it is a success WHILST your actual issue is immigration.

If racially marginalised communities are saying they are offended in something that you say makes you happy, albeit useless, then I fail to see the non-racist connection.

Again feel free to elaborate!!!!!!!!!

[LittleSporksBigSpork]

The government is already quite successful at finding undocumented people and using the law the ensure they either leave or to get proper documentation. The campaign is unneeded, ineffective, and is more about getting votes and intimidating people with harmful rhetoric than getting people to comply with the law.

Undocumented people have no real effect to undermine documented migrants due to lack of comparable numbers and already strong enforcement on both types.

Thankfully the law is more flexible on helping undocumented migrants than rigid in or out and that few of us will ever need to consider such things for our own well-being.

[TabithaStephens]

"
The point of my post of 14.38 is that the very people who decided to house immigrants on various islands are either immigrants or children of immigrants. again."

Countries have the right to control their borders. There's no-one in the world that isn't descended from immigrants somewhere down the line. But that doesn't change a thing.

[TheFallenNinja]

I don't find it offensive, you do. You find it offensive because you want to.

You want to continue refer to me as racist so I'll try to clear this up.

Immigration status = what I'm talking about.

Immigration = what your talking about.

Now, you can continue to accuse me if being racist but again at no point have I referred to any particular group or ethnic origin or how I believe that an individual whose immigration status is not legal should be dealt with.

Rather cleverly in this country we have mechanisms whereby people from other countries can apply legally to reside here, those who are successful have my support, those who are unsuccessful have my sympathy, those who choose to sneak in have my contempt.

Again, just in case it was lost, not racist, I'll add some exclamation marks as you did to accent my point!!!

I hope this clears it up for you.

[LittleSporksBigSpork]

And that mechanism is working well for the government to have documented migrants and get a lot of money out of us as well as for getting undocumented workers to leave or to get proper documentation.

The campaign is not needed, and it is purposefully using harmful rhetoric to cause a raise in fuss for marketing, to get votes from target groups, and to intimidate others - undocumented migrants, documented migrants, and native born people presume to be migrants. It's harmful and worthless in the work being done about undocumented workers.

[TheFallenNinja]

But everything government does is to get votes from targeted groups, it's also understandable that some groups, as in this particular case, are so polarised on the topic that the electioneers will simply have calculated which side has the most potential votes.

Some seem to be in one demographic and others in another and as I am convinced that my viewpoint is not unique then I must fall into that group.

These are all pretty emotive topics as this thread has shown but at least the debate continues. One side of the debate may prevail over the other but that's the whole point of a debate isn't it?

And just to be absolutely clear, I have no racist views whatsoever.

[Episode]

Sorry, still confused!!!!!!

How has anything you've said been relevant to the OP and the campaign?

What wisdom do you think you have that allows you to dictate what people should and shouldn?t find offensive! Bear in mind that all of these people will have a better idea of receiving racism and living within marginalised communities than you do!

Why do you dislike illegal immigration? The financial drain on the economy? Which is? And the campaign wasn?t, no?

Or you dislike it because it is illegal? The law does not dictate your thoughts.... Please articulate why?

I am not saying you have to ignore the immigration argument, but I am saying that 90% of people who do not find fault with this campaign and are similarly happy with the fact money has been wasted and offence caused cannot on in the same breath complain about the financial implications of illegal immigration.

I am trying to understand why you have no issue with the campaign and the offence caused. Since you have not actually addressed this, I am of course inclined to believe your thoughts are somewhere rooted in racism.

[TheFallenNinja]

Imagine my surprise that you continue to accuse me of being racist.

You seem to read my posts, add bits, take bits away and then accuse me of whatever you wish.

I at no point have attempted to dictate who should or shouldn't be offended.

I'm not overly concerned about the cost of some van drivers wages and a few posters. The posters clearly state Illegal immigrants in big letters. Why would anyone else think this applies to them apart from the semantic argument of the term used.

As for knowing how marginalised communities feel, you have no idea what my race or origin is so you are making a rather large assumption here.

To be fair, you want the argument and I'm happy to play along, but, and again as you keep missing it, I am not a racist, never have been, you are knocking on the wrong door there.

In simple terms, our country has borders and within those borders there are those here legally and those not, some that have moved from elsewhere have gone to enormous lengths and made great efforts and sacrifice to be here legally.

It's those that sneak in I don't want here.

Again, so you don't add it in later, at no point did I cite a particular race, country of origin, religious group, gender or anything even remotely discriminatory, something a racist might do, but not me, not racist see.

[opilo]

I don't see the problem with the campaign all illegal immigrants should be deported and if this this assists then I'm all for it.

[LittleSporksBigSpork]

Whether or not you have prejudicial views doesn't really matter, the system for dealing with undocumented workers is already effective in getting migrants to leave or helping them get the proper documentation without this.

This isn't needed. It's a waste of money, not effective (more likely to cause false accusations than actual people returning), makes the actual work far harder and obviously more about getting attention than dealing with the problem. Whether or not an individual has hateful views doesn't matter, the wider system that this type of marketing feeds into dehumanizes, degrades, and continues to alter the perceptions of undocumented migrants (we've already had it in this thread where the perception that undocumented workers won't be White, they actually make up a great deal of undocumented workers) and overblow the problem that is already being handled well.

[MurderOfGoths]

"if this this assists then I'm all for it."

Do you think it will?

[TheFallenNinja]

I have no idea whether this will make any difference at all but here's something that's not too much of a leap. There may well be some here illegally who actually would like to go home but can't for financial reasons. I'm sure this could be a tiny number of people but law of averages says there must be some. In this case it may actually help some people.

[LittleSporksBigSpork]

There are already a lot of people working to help those undocumented migrants.

We don't need intimidation tactics for those undocumented migrants - they already come forward to the community and immigration help centers. This kind of advertising is far more likely to cause false accusations, more violence and pain towards perceived migrants, and do nothing for undocumented people who need help with asking for asylum or just don't care. The little bit of help that could be perceived from this (which there isn't, those undocumented migrants already come forward) is outweighed by the pain is far more likely to cause.

[TheFallenNinja]

Is undocumented migrant the same as illegal immigrant?

[JulieMumsnet]

Evening,

We'd like to remind you all of our talk guidelines If you could take a few minutes to have a read, that would be grand.

MNHQ.

[pointythings]

The problem I have with this campaign is that it will reawaken all the fear immigrants felt in the 70s and 80s when racism was not considered much of an issue. It's a simple matter of having the good manners to word things so as not to be inflammatory or inconsiderate of the feelings of very many people who were born in the UK, have contributed to the economy of the UK but happen to be of a different ethnicity. Bringing back those feelings to people is just plain rude. When did we abandon common courtesy?

[NicholasTeakozy]

Thanks Julie, you've made my day by reminding us of the guidelines. :o